Look it won't happen without FAI/IFA/UEFA backing (although I read somewhere that UEFA supported the idea of an AIL in principle). If that happens Rovers will be in no matter what. I agree with the wage cap. I also want to see an AIL.
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Look it won't happen without FAI/IFA/UEFA backing (although I read somewhere that UEFA supported the idea of an AIL in principle). If that happens Rovers will be in no matter what. I agree with the wage cap. I also want to see an AIL.
Not to mention facilities and marketing.Quote:
Originally Posted by Billy Lord
The point is, they're already building us a stadium, they're already building training facilities. They're already marketing us; but the only way to even half fill that stadium would be to be competitive on a european stage and to vastly improve the quality of the league by attracting the kind of players people will pay to watch.Quote:
Originally Posted by Poor Student
As I said, I'm all in favour of limiting wages, but a blanket cap of 65% is ridiculous; Kilkenny City might pull in 50,000 a year and Cork City pull in at least 1,000,000. Cork City are in a much safer position to be spending more than 65%, perhaps 85% on wages. That leaves 150,000 for a "rainy day", as that is all that this money will be if the investors are already building facilities.
How legal is this cap, anyway? I know its anti-competitive, and its certainly restricting employment. National associations had to drop the foreigner limits and the strict transfer windows; how would one so blatantly illegal get by?
I'm no expert but I've seen it written in other football circles that you shouldn't have more than 50/60% of your turnover spent on footballing wages as good business practise. I mentioned somewhere before that Celtic have worked theirs down to around 50%.
I think it's unlikely that any investor will throw their money at an eL club forever unless they happen to be rather rich and philanthropic therefore most eL clubs (there's 22 of them) will have to stand on their own two feet with a stable and sustainable business model. That can be done if they don't blow more than 65% on short termism.
It's hard to debate this though as I don't know if wages means purely players, the whole footballing side (e.g. coaches as well) or the entire wage bill of the club. None of us still seem to know how donations, directors loans and owners investment fit into the income definition either.
Yes, but investors don't want stable. Stable is unattractive right now as stable means bleeding money. its fine for celtic to limit their wages to 60% because they're dragging in multi-millions in merchandise from this island alone. The big clubs are losing money right now and all but a select few smaller clubs are having their costs covered by philanthropists. but (our) investors believe that with investment, rather than bill-paying, they can move closer to glasgow celtic than kilkenny city.Quote:
Originally Posted by Poor Student
You could argue that a rainy day in Cork would be much more costly than a rainy day in Kilkenny - the bigger the club, the bigger the expenses. I'm guessing the 65% was seen as a safe figure, no matter what the actual turnover for each club is.Quote:
Originally Posted by GavinZac
I'm guessing it is not a case of being legal under Irish law - I'm guessing it is a policy the clubs signed on to. Lots of sports have wage caps, and I think they're all voluntary "gentleman's agreement" style deals. Every club signed on to this wage cap, right? If they change their mind and decide to ignore it, it probably wouldn't break any law, but would break their deal with the FAI and other clubs. I don't know what the consequences would be.Quote:
Originally Posted by GavinZac
Isn't the function of this wage cap to try and change the situation so that "stable" doesn't mean bleeding so much money any more? A limit of 65% means that you can only bleed so much, on players at least.Quote:
Originally Posted by GavinZac
If your investors spend millions on this then your wages will have no trouble keeping within 65% of your turnover.Quote:
Originally Posted by GavinZac
Let's see them do all this first and we can cross the Roy Keane bridge if we ever come to it.
Didn't know that - where is going and how long will it take?Quote:
Originally Posted by GavinZac
A nice shiny new crest with a massive red "C" and what looks like a pirate ship you get a theme parks on itQuote:
Originally Posted by BohsPartisan
As a Widnes fan back then - I'd never thought I'd see that referenced on here - ****ing Maurice Lindsay selling us and Keighley up the River MerseyQuote:
Originally Posted by BohsPartisan
This was a summary of the meeting in Newry on Friday as I told to me and first posted on ILSF. I stand to be corrected on any of the below but I think it is fairly accurate.
12 full time teams with an 8-4 South North split (i.e. 3 IL clubs and Derry City) Best guess's are that the 3 "prefered" are Linfield, Glentoran and Glenavon.
New company to be formed with the clubs in the new league (by invitation) being franchisees.
Players fund to be available to help clubs have a level playing field when it comes to transfers.
The company to loan money to clubs if they need to do ground improvements.
Head Office in Belfast.
Board to run the company similar to what has be proposed for the IFAPL with one of the promoters companies acting as consultants it seems.
P&R. 1 relegated (with parachute money availalble) the 2 current leagues to continue to operate with the winners of each in a play off for promotion. (Though I don't know what happens if this causes inbalances in the leagues below.
Interest shown by Uefa and IFA (not sure if that is the Exec or one individual mind) but not from the FAI.
Governments show interest.
IL clubs represented: Glentoran, Portadown, Newry, Glenavon, Newry, Donegal Celtic and Crusaders with Linfield sending their apologies. (Don't think I have missed anyone). Portadown rep left early.
http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/sp...cle3296452.ece
Glentoran supporting the idea. Also their is talk of 2 champions leagues spots. Don't know how they will work that one out.
Why can't Irish people get the concept of settling sporting matters on the fieldQuote:
Originally Posted by Mr_Parker
Any more details on that? Say for example if Cobh were in the top division and Derry, Cork etc. spent 10k on a player's transfer fee, would Cobh be able to go and get 10k for their own player of similiar ability? More importantly would it be a short term loan?Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr_Parker
All well and good until the creditors come callingQuote:
Originally Posted by Mr_Parker
Any idea on what the TV/Prize money breakdown is?Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr_Parker
Doubt they will want to pass the sceptre after only a year in chargeQuote:
Originally Posted by Mr_Parker
I heard they will go to the top teams from the North and South, regardless of where they finish in the league, e.g. if Linfield finish above their fellow Nordies, but still only finish 5th they will still get the CL spotQuote:
Originally Posted by Steve Bruce
Just in case it's not already known, the 65% cap is a cap on "player costs". In your scenario above you're suggesting that €150,000 would be enough for Cork City to pay its team manager, coaching staff, physio, grounds staff, admin, sales and marketing staff, and all of the other overheads (insurance, rent, rates, telephone, ESB, etc. etc.). I can't see how €150,000 would cover all that.Quote:
Originally Posted by GavinZac
Technically the cap doesn't restrict employment. If a club has €1m turnover it can spend it's €650,000 any way it wants. That could be 20 players earning €32,500 each or one prima-donna earning €600,000 with another 50 earning €1,000 each. This isn't a wage-cap for players (i.e. one that limits the wages of any one player), it's a spending-cap for the clubs.Quote:
Originally Posted by GavinZac
I'm afraid I don't have anything more than I posted.Quote:
Originally Posted by jebus
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr_Parker
So 9 teams from the Eircom League leaving 3 premier division teams and 10 division One teams. Brings up the questions would the LOI return to a single division?. What about the (to date) 4 A league teams?, would there still be a A league or would these sides simply be entered into the new LOI division
If the government of both sides are interested in seeing this go ahead then the FAI could come under pressure and find their government funding under threat and I can think of one or two sporting organistions who wouldn't mind an extra bit of money whether they do indeed need it or not.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr_Parker
One question regarding UEFA though where does that leave the two national teams?.
Not interrogating you Mr. Parker I know that all you know but just general questions/point(s) that spring to mind
Cheers for posting up what you heard anyway, my questions were more aimed at anyone else in the knowQuote:
Originally Posted by Mr_Parker
Player funds, money available for ground development (bigger crowds), and parachute money.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr_Parker
If the first two bits of info relate only to top division clubs, it sounds like whatever club is relegated will be in prime position to get promoted again, given the financial aid.
And all this money will come from new sponsorship and a tv deal?!Quote:
Originally Posted by osarusan
It all sounds like the Simpsons episode where Mr.Burns buys/helps the Church doesn't itQuote:
Originally Posted by Buller
Which basically kills any interest UEFA have for this.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr_Parker
Governments showing interest could see a change of heart by the FAI though, important source of money for the FAI that government.;)
Quote:
Originally Posted by passerrby
didnt we do it up until last season without the fai supporting us,the league hasnt changed that much over the past year.
i havent really been tuned into the whole g6 thing could anyone tell me how advanced the talks have come.
So I edited the Football Manager database (FM2007) to swap Irish and Northern Irish teams into the Hungarian league and the Hungarian teams into LoI/IL so that I could create one All-Ireland League. This was a 16 team league with two leagues of sixteen beneath it. Two teams get relegated, the winners of each sub-league get promoted. I didn't play as any of the teams, I just let it run. Here are the results of the 3 seasons I ran:
Year One:
1. St. Pats, 59 points
2. Bohs, 52 points
3. Cork, 52 points
4. Glentoran, 50 points
5. Linfield, 50 points
6. Derry, 50 points
7. Drogheda, 46 points
8. Dungannon, 42 points
9. Coleraine, 42 points
10. Galway, 41 points
11. Portadown, 40 points
12. Shams, 39 points
13. Sligo, 33 points
14. Ballymena, 27 points
15. Newry, 21 points
16. Cliftonville, 20 points
Cup Winner: Shamrock Rovers
Year Two:
1. Bohs, 55 points
2. Glentoran, 54 points
3. St. Pats, 53 points
4. Derry, 53 points
5. Cork, 53 points
6. Drogheda, 48 points
7. Linfield, 47 points
8. Portadown, 45 points
9. Sligo, 42 points
10. Galway, 35 points
11. Dundalk, 34 points
12. Crusaders, 33 points
13. Shams, 32 points
14. Dungannon, 29 points
15. Coleraine, 25 points
16. Ballymena, 22 points
Cup Winner: Cork City
Year Three:
1. St. Pats, 60 points
2. Bohs, 56 points
3. Drogheda, 49 points
4. Shams, 48 points
5. Portadown, 48 points
6. Glentoran, 47 points
7. Dundalk, 45 points
8. Cork, 44 points
9. Sligo, 42 points
10. Derry, 41 points
11. Longford, 39 points
12. Linfield, 35 points
13. Crusaders, 33 points
14. Glenavon, 32 points
15. Galway, 29 points
16. Dungannon, 14 points
Cup Winner: Dundalk
Sounds fairly accurate... ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by Kivlehan
I'm starting to like this new league!
Most pointless exercise ever
It's not meant to be serious, just a bit of fun.Quote:
Originally Posted by LeixlipRed
Huge amount of naivety on display on this thread.
I'm personally still to be convinced about the feasibility of launching an AIL right now, but I wouldn't underestimate the involvement of Drury & Co and the amount of work that went on prior to the discussions being "leaked". Drury is no fool and you can be sure all of the questions raised here, and a hell of a lot more have been discussed.
Which clubs are in are out of the "G6" at the present time is neither here nor there. If the proposals are attractive (ie lots of cash on offer), clubs will have no choice but to jump in.
The national association and governing body support issue is more problematic, but UEFA and FIFA are long overdue being taken to the European courts over freedom of trade and movement issues. I would also find it hard to believe that these bodies hadn't been sounded out unofficially before discussions began.
If anything can be a silver bullet to improve Irish football then a large, sustained injection of cash is whats required. This will improve infrastructure and the standard of play and the fans should come. If they don't, then they never will.
I'm also sceptical of UEFA being for this AIL. If it is allowed to happen is it not setting a precedent? What is to stop Celtic and Rangers from joining the premiership or teams in other countries changing leagues? I don't think UEFA want that?
http://www.irishleaguesupporters.com...d=1#post131379
A few posts down theres a scan of the front page of Today's Star.......
If there's any truth in that n wonder the 'G6' are staying defiant
Have to register to view...summarise it?Quote:
Originally Posted by micls
Total of 10m prize money for this new league, with between 1 and 2 for the winners. Also says that seven clubs from the Irish League showed up at last weeks meeting.Quote:
Originally Posted by sligoman
There's a headline saying "Super League clubs to net 10m". There's also a quote "With the top finishers in the new Super League receiving prize money between 1m aand 2m each", a bit unspecific but that's the main gist of the article.
:DQuote:
Originally Posted by DmanDmythDledge
2m for the winners, between 1m and 2m each for the 'top finishers'
And most walked away with more questions than answers!Quote:
Originally Posted by DmanDmythDledge
Wells dismisses All-Ireland plans
http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/foot...sh/7167621.stm
Misleading headline...Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr_Parker
As far as I know, one paper ran with a quote suggesting the league would begin this year. If this was ever said by anybody it would only be to emphasize that the parties involved are serious about making this happen. I don't think anyone would realistically claim that the new league could begin in the middle of the next scheduled LOI season.Quote:
"I've had some informal chats with people about it but it has not been brought to the table of the appropriate authorities.
"As far as I am concerned, suggestions that this is all going to happen from August this year is pie in the sky," said Wells.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jerry The Saint
Sorry to repeat myself from the other thread but the promoters of the new league themselves stated August to those IL in attendance at the meeting held last Friday.
Wells is no doozer and is giving a politician style answer. He is not going to come out and completely trash any ideas until he has actually seen what has been proposed.
dont kid yourself we have never been independantQuote:
Originally Posted by Supersaint