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There are three reasons for punishing someone for an action:Quote:
Originally Posted by jebus
Which one of those do the McCanns need more of?
- discouraging them from doing it again,
- making them pay for their action and
- making a public example of them.
Depends who you talk to, some want them investigated by social welfare, so thats making them pay for their action, some want a public example made of them, some might argue that by doing so to the McCanns might discourage other parents for doing similiar in the futureQuote:
Originally Posted by John83
In a way that them losing their daughter won't?Quote:
Originally Posted by jebus
"Frank, let's go to that new restaurant across the way. We can leave the kids on their own for a few hours."
"But what if social services catch us?"
Not really, most people walk around with a 'it will never happen to me' attitude about most things, so taking someone to task over their negligence might hit home, or at least make them think twice, who knows?Quote:
Originally Posted by John83
Where did you get this from?Quote:
Originally Posted by John83
A few pounds of grey goo. No one's really sure how it works though.Quote:
Originally Posted by osarusan
fair enough:). I thought you'd taken it from another source, it was written with so much authority.Quote:
Originally Posted by John83
I was talking about you trying to sensationalise it even further by bringing up words like rape when there's no evidence to suggest anything.Quote:
Originally Posted by jebus
I wasn't disagreeing with the thrust of your post
the mccanns deserve any bad press they get imo. the press (red tops especially) have been behind them from the start and have not held them responsibile at all for their part in the whole story.
had the mcCanns been black,on the social and holidaying in benidorm then the media would be crying out for social services to come and take the rest of their kids away.
it is a sad story but the mcCanns must accept responsibility for their actions and be held accountable.
It's something I've thought about before, hence the structure (and therefore the appearance of authority). Feel free to poke holes as they occur to you.Quote:
Originally Posted by osarusan
Article from a US perspective but I think the general principles apply for here and the UK
Quote:
Missing People Face Disparity in Media Coverage
‘Sex sells, kidnapping sells, but not every kidnapping is equal’
By Michele Chan Santos; Special to MSN.com
If you are kidnapped or missing, it helps to be the right race, age, social class and gender. Otherwise, don't expect the media to cover your story.
http://lifestyle.msn.com/specialguid...9082>1=10323
I think the fact that they have lost their daughter is punishment enough don't you. They know they made a mistake and have been punished to the full. What more do you want?Quote:
Originally Posted by galwayhoop
A sense of perspective from the UK pressQuote:
Originally Posted by drinkfeckarse
That would require a Total Perspective Vortex.Quote:
Originally Posted by Dodge
the media to point out that they are at fault for leaving their children alone and unsupervised in a hotel room in a foreign country. then perhaps others won't be so stupid.Quote:
Originally Posted by drinkfeckarse
yes we all feel sorry for the child but tbh my patience is running thin with the whole 'cult of madeline'. i heard a very good report recently where it was said that the whole blanket coverage has in fact immesurably reduced the chances of finding the child safely. the question of what we have learned or gained by the whold media circus surrounding this, very sad, story must also be asked.
but if you are asking me to exonorate the parents then i am sorry i can't. i wouldn't go so far as to say you reap what you sow but these people obviously find it acceptable to leave their children alone in a room while they are out socialising! it appears that the night when madeline went missing was NOT an issolated incident. if the child had not been kidnapped then they would probably still be doing the same thing. i feel sorry for the child and what has/is/may have happened to her but my sympathy for the parents is much much less.
Perspective works two ways.Some of the bile aimed at the McCanns(not on foot.ie) has been bordering on the Ghoulish.As people they might not be my cup of tea either but peoples rage should be aimed at people who snatch children.Hopefully this case will lead to a more concentrated international approach to protecting children from predators.
authorities can only do so much - and usually after the event. the first line of defense has to be parents protecting their own children in the first place. if this is done adequately then you can start pointing fingers at authorities.....Quote:
Originally Posted by cheifo
I think that the debate has been that to be critical of the McCann's has to be someway evil, bourne out by stuff like Journalists being reprimanded for asking the hard questions of why they were left alone. The media has been totally one sided, and now it's beginning to balance out to some degree, but because of how far it has to come it's inevitable that it's going to appear unpleasant to those that brought into the story so much when it broke.
There isn't a shred, not a shred, of evidence that this child has been "snatched" by any "predator". The media in this part of the world is just so jumped up about this particular bugbear/cashcow that everyone now assumes the bogeyman is inolved when a child goes missing.Quote:
Originally Posted by cheifo
The heavy rains will probably hit Portugal in October/November and if workers clearing a reported blockage make a tragic discovery ...well, in the unlikely event that an autopsy can rule out foul play and concludes it was a tragic accident -then that's the McCann parents asses.
Oh right, so with all the publicicty you don't think people will have learned from what has happened to the McCann's or do you think that it needs to be spelt out in black & white in a courtroom or something?Quote:
Originally Posted by galwayhoop
There isn't a parent alive who hasn't asked themselves questions or realised it's not a sensible option to do something like that since all this happened. If you don't already know that then you've missed something. Everybody with half a brain knows they were at fault.
I'm a parent and I have no clue what they're going through. I can empathize on a human level but it's all as much speculation as my childless friends (and far, far less of an understanding than unfortunate acquaintances of acquaintances of mine who have a still-missing relative).Quote:
Originally Posted by cheifo
The thing is, there are far more things about this that I can't understand as a parent, more than people with no children who would just think of these things as curious. Leaving my kids sleeping alone in a room with an out-of-view door they could up and walk out of (well, only the one that was old enough to walk :rolleyes:)? That's unfathomable -- not that I'm a great believer in there being hordes of bogeymen child-rapists out there, more that I know that sleeping children have this tendency to, well, wake up (something "only a parent can understand"). And if they wake up alone they get scared. Now, I worry about my daughter getting scared about fifty billion times more than I worry about her getting plucked from her bed by that chap from Chitty Chitty Bang Bang. If they don't recognise the place they're in, they get even more scared. And when they're scared they try and find one of their parents so that they can calm them down.
Everybody's saying things like they were mad unlucky that this child-snatcher (totally hypothetical) happened to break into (lies) this safe place (lies) and steal their adored child from under their very noses (lies) and it was a one in a million chance and all. What is not a one in a million chance, though, is that a sleeping kid would wake up. They appear either not to have been aware of this fact -- even though they're doctors and this is pretty much a 'medical' fact -- or not to have given two hoots.
How many other times has that kid woken up on her own not having a clue where they were, and they out gallivanting? How many times has she wandered off, crying, frightened, from where she was sleeping to go and find them and get a hug off them?
I do relate to this story as a parent, but that's not where my compassion and whatever empathy I feel for them comes from. Absolutely the opposite. I feel for them despite being a parent myself.
Hopefully they get their kid back (unless they had something to do with it, obviously).
Hardly the McCanns fault even if they have rightly courted the press in an effort to keep the story in eveybody's minds. It is us who continue to talk about it and wanting to hear about it that have kept it a story.Quote:
Originally Posted by Dodge
Anyway, a sense of perspective will follow as soon as this is resolved whether it's good or bad news.
it is the mcCanns who have driven the whole press story. obviously they feel that by keeping it in the public arena that it may increase the chances of the child being returned safely (a debatable point imo). but to say that the story would be in the limelight as much without the mcCanns pushing it is simply not true.Quote:
Originally Posted by drinkfeckarse
i think it needs to be spelt out in black and white tbh.Quote:
Originally Posted by drinkfeckarse
i know they were wrong to leave their children unsupervised, you seem to know they were wrong but the press has been blinkered on that particular issue. by leving their children unsupervised they increased the odds of the child being abducted (assuming that is what happened) by many times.
do i want to see them suffer in court? No. should social workers visit them and interview them about their parenting ability? Yes.
their actions contributed vastly to the situation they now find themselves in and as such are partly responsible.
The police said last night there was strong theory for her being dead!
The fact she hasn't been seen alive for months and isn't able to look after herself?Quote:
Originally Posted by bellavistaman
:D. Correct as you say 5 months and its just a theory:rolleyes:Quote:
Originally Posted by OneRedArmy
God I hope her Mum had nothing to do with it. I just cant understand how any parent could do such a thing.
To be honest the signs have pointed to the Portugese police believing she had for a while now, I mean when the McCann's asked why they weren't clued in on the breakthroughs on the case straight away I thought, it's because you're a suspect. I find it worrying that the McCann's released a statement to the moronic press saying that they are worried they are going to be framed (by who? the police?) for Maddy's murder on the day they were taken in for questioning, it just smells of damage limitation, and a possible 'Free the Innocent McCanns' appeal should they be charged with the kid's death.Quote:
Originally Posted by Magicme
The only, and it's a stretch, silver lining that might come from this case if the McCann's are charged with Maddy's death is that it might be a wake up call to the media and the public to not believe everything the British/Irish families tell you just because we're from the same country, and to not be so reactionary until the details of the case are known
I've thought from the early stages that the parents know more than they've let on, something hasn't seemed right from the start, difficult to put a finger on it because as said above it's unimaginable that a parent could be invoved.
Sky News have sent Martin Brunt, their Crime Correspondent out there, he hasn't been out before. Makes me think something's going to happen.
There will be some serious U-Turns in the British media if the parents were involved.
To be honest they'll probably all say they've been telling us for weeks that something was fishy, ALL newspapers have gone the way of the Sun in that respectQuote:
Originally Posted by endabob1
I don't think that will happen. What I think will happen is a backlash of biblical proportions. It'll be like it was worse that she lied to the British press than actually killing her own daughter (and I'm not saying she did)Quote:
Originally Posted by jebus
i would have tought it was the fella more so than the woman, so it is quite a surprise
Any reason for thinking it was him rather than her?Quote:
Originally Posted by bennocelt
I'm pretty sure that this is all just another dead end. Nothing new, nobody will be charged, and we'll be wondering about this for the rest of our lives.
I think the theory of a sedative given to keep the child quiet or asleep is credible. The child woke up, fell and died. The other children didn’t wake up, because they had been given the same sedative. Someone hid the body. The media circus makes it impossible to for whoever did it to come clean. The sedative could have been given innocently. The likes of Phenorgen, for *****ly heat, usually knocks out or makes kids drowsy.
I'd say so.
The main headline on Sky last night was that the mother was making a fresh appeal for the culprit to come forward.
I didn't understnad the significance of it at all.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Risteard
Madeleine mother named as suspect
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/6982969.stm
As with the case of that poor fooker who the UK press decided was too "huntley like" to not be considered, being a suspect actually gives more rights under questioning. However, it's been fairly obvious that the cops had more questions - everytime the McCanns mentioned going home, the cops released to the press that they were close to a breakthrough and that they should stay.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ringo
Just caught the start of liveline there - someone already on claiming their being made scapegoats and calling on Gordon Brown to intervene! :rolleyes:
Interesting to see the Portuguese crowd boo and whistle as she was brought in. As the English crowd would do if she was in England.