Mods or someone, can we get a poll on this as to who the fans want now the opposition will be one of:
Portugal
Greece
Russia
France
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Mods or someone, can we get a poll on this as to who the fans want now the opposition will be one of:
Portugal
Greece
Russia
France
So correct me if im wrong but final confirmed is [in order of seeding]:
Pot 1
Russia
France
Greece
Portugal
Pot 2
Ukraine
Ireland
Slovenia
Bosnia
Given FIFA's motives, they wont want Russia and Ukraine to meet and would prefer to keep them apart from the former Yugoslav countries so its Russia for us then its a case of give the toughest draw to Greece and the remainder to France and Portugal. Call me cynical but after their cheap tricks already, I think the draw may very well end up like this:
Russia V Ireland
France V Bosnia
Greece V Ukraine
Portugal V Slovenia
NO top seed wants Bosnia!!!
don't think the seeding thing makes much diffrence still very dodgy sides in our side of the draw too i think greece would still be the weakest
We're weaker than Greece. Many of their players have experience of playing in Champions League year in year out and not just making up numbers actually being competitive. Players like Andrews and Whelan wouldn't be any better than what Greece have.
Its a much of a muchness between who is weaker, us or Greece. I'd say us.
Bosnia aren't that good individually but they have a few deadly players and probably the best team left in the competition in terms of passion and determination which counts for a lot.
Bosnia have a very good coach who has taken an unfancied team to third place in the World Cup. I've seen them a few times and they are well organised and under Ciro Blazevic they have an ability to grind out results.
I dont think we are weaker than Greece, this season only Kyrgiakos (Liverpool), Torosidis (Olympiacos) and Papadopoulis (Olympiacos) have a chance of playing in the Champions League. There are other Greek players at Olympiacos but they have either retired from international football (eg Stoltidis and Nikopolidis) or are fringe players in the Olympiacos squad (not as good as the likes of Galletti, Raul Bravo, Zewlakov, Maresca, Mellburg etc). They have one or two really good players like Gekkas and Pliatsikas, but there are areas of weakness - Chialkas the keeper is an example. We should be a match for them.
You are right, Bosnia No!Quote:
Originally Posted by irishultra
Bosna i Hercegovina, who let them in?
I posted this on the Ireland Monty match thread, but probably more relevant here:
Performances:
We've drawn with the world champions twice and could have beaten them bought times.
We were average against Bulgaria twice and still drew with them.
We did everything we had to do for a playoff. Worst result away was a draw.
Obviously we could have done better with only 4 wins but lets looks at our playoff opponents.
France:
Drew with Romania twice, who have been total muck this campaign.
Only beat the Faroes 1-0! That's as bad as we were under Stan.
Lost 3-1 to Austria
Not exactly setting the world on fire.
Portugal:
Lost 3-2 to Demark.
Followed that with three 0-0 draws with Sweden-Albania-Sweden
Pulled out a 3-0 and 4-0 win last two games so look like a team on a high.
Greece:
Lost to the Swiss twice(sound familiar?)
drew with Israel once(sound familiar?)
drew with Moldova
beat Luxembourg by one goal.
Definetly beatable.
Russia:
Lost to Germany twice
beat Liechtenstein by one goal!
drew with Azerbijan
So you can pick holes in the performances of all of our potential opponents.
Life of an Irish fan now reminds me of the scene in In the Name of the Father when Gerry first meets gareth pierce and berates her for giving his father hope! Well Trap has given us hope and I know it will hurt if we hope too much and get f ucked over again!...but this time I'm starting to believe!!!
Look, the draw is the draw. It's a game of luck.Quote:
Originally Posted by elroy
There are positives and negatives to all our opponents, and none of them fill me with excitement or trepidation. At least we know we can only get 1 of 4, rather than 1 of 7.
Away to Greece will be very tough. They are known for hostile, intimidating crowds, we don't have a great record against them, and they won't be pushovers. Travelling will be difficult too. A long and expensive journey if we get them.
I would say we need to either score more than them or beat them on penalties!
But seriously!, do away goals count as in UEFA cup etc.?
I give us about a 20% chance of qualifying...at best.
Away goals do count,Quote:
Originally Posted by Scram
20% regardless of who we draw?
I'd be inclined to have a bit more faith in Trap's tactical ability to grind out the results.
This is FIFA We're talking about, nothing will be left to luck!! They clearly want the big 3 but the 4th spot is open, I think we might get Greece, Ireland are an attractive team to FIFA in terms of the number of fans we would bring.Quote:
Originally Posted by mypost
I'd rather have one of 7 with the knowledge that 4 of the 7 are beatable, I don't think we will beat Russia, France oR Portugal over 2 legsQuote:
Originally Posted by mypost
Greece is by far the easiest of the potential ties, their crowds are nowhere near what you would get in Turkey, our record against them is immaterial 2 friendlies the last of which was a 0-0 draw 7 years ago; We have a much longer history and less distinguished against the other 3.Quote:
Originally Posted by mypost
Travelling will be more difficult than Paris or Lisbon I grant you but 3/4 hours on a flight to Athens is hardly a trek through the Himalayas.
On Monday morning I will be on my knees to Bhudda, Jebus, Allah, Ganesh and L Ron Hubbard in the hope that we get Greece.
France are the only one of the 8 teams commercially attractive for FIFA.
I wouldn't be very hopeful of going to Greece needing a result out there in a second leg, given our less than great ability to hold onto narrow leads. Portugal would be a decent trip for travelling. No time difference, and warm in November. Paris is well, Paris. Russia is the one to avoid.
But I wouldn't question the fairness of the draw. When those balls are put in the pot on Monday, nobody knows which is which until they're opened. It's purely the luck of the draw.
Portugal are too, there is a sizeable ex-pat population in SA plus the Ronaldo factor, if we get either of those we are out imho.
Russia I think is the most difficult away trip.
I would question the fairness of anything Blatter has a hand in, especially when it comes to the arranging of a draw. Quick example; I called the Confed cup draw the day before it happened, I predicited SA would get the Kiwis & Iraq to give them the best chance of making the Semi's... waddya know Thatys just how it happened....
Do you think FIFA will interfere with the officials for the game in order to influence a more desirable result?
there are conspiracy theories going around that Real Madrid insisted Ronaldo played last weekend, even though they knew he was unfit, because having him at the World Cup meant he would sell even more jerseys
Don´t you think FIFA´s interfering stops at the seeding.
FIFA bribing a referee, as is alluded here, to influence a result, is at the whacky end of conspiracy theories.
Not directly, but I agree with Hunt's assesment that the agenda has been made clear by FIFA and that in turn will have an effect on how the officials perform.Quote:
Originally Posted by geysir
I 100% think that the draw will be done to a FIFA design.
I really think so. Come on guys, that level of corruption that there's bribed referees, rigged draws, it's far too many people involved for it to stay quiet. Even if it only got out in 20 years time there'd be a massive ****storm of a scandal and they'd be ruined.Quote:
Originally Posted by geysir
They won't rig the draw now - no need.Quote:
Originally Posted by Yard of Pace
Referees are not bribed nor will FIFA try to influence them.
BUT
FIFA have made it very very clear who they want in the finals. Danny Jordan came out again yesterday on that. Thew referees will know this. A tight call either way will see the referee favouring the team FIFA want.
That is the real reason for wanting Greece. FIFA won't care who wins.
I am a believer in the rigged draw conspiracy around previous play off draws. That is a respectable conspiracy belief :)
Probably the experience of those rigged draws do not inspire confidence in the impartiality of FIFA and that there are no limits to their interference.
Mind you, we did get a strange guy from Brazil when we played Iran at home, probably that was because we were playing a team from another federation.
100% correctQuote:
Originally Posted by gspain
Portugal & France are the money teams, get either of those and we may as well not turn up. Russia is a maybe but Moscow in November on a plastic pitch......
Russia is the one team I want to avoid. I can see there midfield tearing us apart with the kind of football they play.
France next simply because of the calibre of player they have.
Portugal are not as big a threat as the above two and if you can keep (a big if granted) Ronaldo and Simao quiet we may have a decent chance.
Greece is by far and away the most realistic chance of going through.
The top refs are not that gullible.
In modern times I can think of 2 important games that we were involved in against the well favoured teams where the ref was ruthlessly objective,
Holland at home and Spain at WC 2002
Who's to say we'll get a "top" ref?Quote:
Originally Posted by geysir
Im just waiting for the announcement that all 4 seeded teams will have their home games in the 2nd leg as a reward for them being higher placed in the world rankings
I was under the impression that that was the original intention but it changed.
Id prefer if that was the way to be honest. I think if we nick on at home we can hang on away with Trap having a few days to fine tune his defensive masterplan.
Quote:
Originally Posted by geysir
It wouldn't surprise me a bit, they are just more clever at it these days. In all fairness, the Chelsea Barce semi final last year was a joke, number of decisions against Chelsea to keep Barce in it, that looked a Fifa picked ref all the way.
I was delighted Barce won through, but Fifa made it clear all along they did not want an all English final for a number of reasons.
I'm not saying they bribe refs to deliberatley influenece the outcome of a game, but I wouldn't be surprised if they have some refs they can rely on in certain situations, without having to really do much.
We will have to see what quality of refs get appointed.
The play off draw to decide who plays away/home will surely demonstrate some FIFA impartiality:rolleyes:
Would anyone (be so foolhardy to) bet against the 4 seeded teams from pot 1 not getting the away fixture first?
:D I wish I could believe that.Quote:
Originally Posted by mypost
How the hell is that a positve? :confused: Our odds of getting a favourable draw have more than halved and even if we are lucky enough to get Greece then thats still going be a tougher game than some of the teams we could of got in an open draw.Quote:
Originally Posted by mypost
are most people who are planning on attending the away leg going to fly out the day before the game, two nights accomadation and fly home the day after the game.
would it be fair to say if the game is in france or portugal the above should be attained for est €250-€300
Grecce €350
Russia €600
then the price of match tickets and alcohol and food added. Iam definatley going if we draw anyone except russia just try to convince a few of more lads to come on board and if someone could post estimated price for the above. thanks
It was UEFA but your point is valid.Quote:
Originally Posted by Polster
ya, greece, to make it loook impartial. they dont care about greece or russia to a lesser extent.Quote:
Originally Posted by geysir
You'll be very lucky if you get flight and accom for France and Portugal for anything near €250-€300.Quote:
Originally Posted by wexfordman
By the time Monday comes around the airlines will have flights to Lisbon and Paris at approx €200 each way (€500 when you add in tax etc). When the draw's made whoever we don't get, the flights will return to normal.
I reckon the flights to Russia will be the cheapest from the 4, at the moment their about €250 including tax, but the Visa hassle etc will put a lot off so the demand won't be as great.
There's plenty of options for flights to Moscow so I would expect the prices not to increase.
I follow Sky Sports' Andy Burton on twitter, and he was on the same filght as Liam Brady back to the UK:
From http://twitter.com/footballandy/statuses/4889035412
Quote:
Brady chat went well. He wants Greece in PO. Interesting views on negativity shown by Irish media to the team too.
FIFA won't fix the draw to have the 4 seeds at home 2nd.
They could easily have mandated that and made it part of the draw but they haven't bothered.
Well you should.Quote:
Originally Posted by Morbo
I have seen many EC and WC ones over 20 years. Barring seeding sections and rules of public knowledge, every draw has been conducted in public, and is 100% fair. You get who you're given, and even if you don't like it, you make the best of it. Anything different is cynicism and a conspiracy.
As for the reffing debate, it has as much validity as "the ridden rock solid" theory. A stonewall decision will be given by any ref in any game around the world. That has always and will continue to be the case.
My Post; did you see the draw for the 2000 european play-offs? The one that UEFA wanted to seed, had to back down because of complaints and then proceeded to keep the 4 would be seeds apart with home ties second.... Sorry that was a fix if I ever saw one.
WC 2002 po draw (official policy or not) also came up with 4 fancied teams playing away first against the lower teams but WC2006 po draw was officially seeded.
But i agree with Mypost re the ref, they will officiate as they normally do, under the normal occasional influence of a home crowd.
there are many ways of fixing a public draw by the use of heating the balls, diff texture on the balls etc. and no one watching is any the wiserQuote:
Originally Posted by mypost