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gave them way to much space in the first half, i dont care who your playing, if u give space like that you will be punished. great in the second half when they had a go at them though. keegan, cahill and gartland were brilliant. faz was absolutely useless last night, dont know what was wrong with him. couldnt pass a ball 2 yards. will be tough in the second leg but hope they put in a good display. well done drogs :ball:
very fair comment IMO - if people thought we should beat them then they are nuts, a draw would have been fab but next best was a decent performance against one of the elite of Europe. Before their second they were getting ****ed off and beginning to shout at the ref etc etc because they found themselves in a right tussle of a game. No doubt they were better - of course they would be, all Drogs could do was try and give them a game and hope for a bit of luck on the night. Away match appears like a hammering in the waiting but who knows.Quote:
Originally Posted by bennocelt
As for Roddy - what a gem with comments like "drogheda are out of their depth" - oh the wisdom - no ****e sherlock. Sure we can't beat keiv , might as well pack the league up now. :rolleyes:
I only caught the second half too as I had a match myself and I thought it was a wonderfully entertaining game. Jumped out of my seat when Drogheda scored and was really gutted when Kiev got the winner. It was great to see Drogheda have a go, it would have been easy to play with 10 men behind the ball and try and keep the score down but they went and played football and had a real go, leaving themselves exposed at times but showing that they were well able to play football. It's a pity that Drogheda have been struggling this season, they lack confidence at the back and Zayed is totally off form.
I don't think any neutral, barstooler, part-time fan, call them what you will, could fail to have enjoyed the game and been impressed with the manner in which Drogheda played. Hopefully a few more will now be tempted to attend live league games and support out league.
SeanDrog i don't think people are saying you should have beaten Kiev, but this type of rubbish 'great night fro Drogs' or 'Super Drogs' is absolute tosh. Drogheda lost, end of, thats the bottom line no moral victories etc etc when you are a full time team i don't think we should celebrate losers i thought Ireland had moved on from that mind set?
It was very obviously a disappointing night for Drogheda, they came within touching distance of a draw with a team that has qualified for the group stages of the Champions League for 10 of the last 11 seasons (this is the holy grail for the League of Ireland). The plus side is that they competed, while they were outclassed at times they still came close to getting a result. The tie may be out of reach now but hopefully they'll put in another creditable performance in Kiev.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rovers Maniac
The professionalism of Drogheda allowed them to up the tempo in the second half, rather than fade away and sit in front of their own 18 yard box praying for the final whistle. It was a step up from the Shels performance at home to Deportivo, another indicator of improvement.
Drogs in fariest did well but in the first half - they gave Kiev too much space. in the second half when ye put some pressure on them, they did not like it one bit and they defenders are poor. However they midfielders are very good in creating space and putting balls through to the forward. Drogs goalie was very poor for the first goal but in fairest to him - he was outstanding for the rest of the game. Baker was very poor for the second goal and you are always told never to turn your back on a player and he did - it was very stupid what he did and it cost the team - you would think a player of his experienced would know that!
Very good post PI. I too felt the same after watching the second half of this game.Quote:
Originally Posted by passinginterest
I still think though there are certain things that Irish teams can improve upon individually, not related to skill/talent/natural ability etc. A lot of the drogheda lads seemed wrecked by 70 minutes, others also were too easily fondled off the ball. Rosenborg are a good example, all their players were always physically very fit and strong, Irish teams should try to aspire to this as there is no real reason why they cant match their counterparts in this regard, and it would certainly make a difference in future European games, make up for what they lack in skill in brawn etc.
I think if we look at professionalism in rugby it seems to take at least a decade for that extra strength and fitness to be properly developed. The Irish rugby players have only caught up with the other professional sides in recent years (you might even argue that they still lag behind a little). The only sad thing is that professional football in Ireland is unlikely to be sustainable long term, Drogheda are subject to the whims of their investors, they don't have the revenue streams to realistically sustain a full time setup, in the current environment, without making massive losses. Unfortunately a lot of other Irish clubs are in the same boat.Quote:
Originally Posted by paul_oshea
Drogheda done very well last night and got as good a result as you could really expect. I think out there though will be a different matter and Drogs will do well to keep the score respectable.
I think matches like this are good for the LOI, who are aspiring to get to a level that 3rd round qualifiers is being hit every season. This shows you that the LOI are a lot closer than 10 years ago but still have a fair bit to go.
Unfortunately though I do think though Kiev could go up a few gears, which is the worrying thing, but if Drogheda can keep it tight at the back and counter attack you may be able to make a good game of it out their and sneak a draw, which although would put you out, it still gives you co-efficient points and gives LOI good coverage that a LOI club can match one of the better teams in Europe.
All in all this is good experience for Drogs and the LOI, maybe I’m wrong but I think this shows you the standard that the LOI should be aspiring to. Unfortunately as an IL fan, we don’t seem to have any European Aspirations at all, which personally I disagree with.
just gave them way to much space and respect in the first half. but anyway we are progressing no doubt but we cant just expect to beat teams like kiev. we can now compete we just need to go from here and develop more. if kiev were playing a part time drogheda last night it would have been a massacre. why dont drogheda go out and buy a proper striker ??
I think the crowd was disappointing last night as would think maximum of 5000 boosted by 500+ Ukranians. Sitting in the Connaught St side & little evidence that many non-LOI fans there. IMO even though I paid it E25 is far too expensive to sit in the rain on derelict terrace.
Drogs were let down by individual mistakes & some weak links. While he was better when Drogs were on top I thought Keegan was terrible in the first half. Drogs also seem to suffer from using players coming back from injury - Shelley looked off the pace when he came on. Was very surprised to see Kudovavic taken off as he was their best player. A draw would have been a fair result as for all their chances Kiev did not hit the target often. Ewing was poor as it is mark of desperation saving with his feet so much.
Drogs will get beaten badly next week. At least 3-0.
The Drogheda of last year would have got a result i believe! They were sloppy on occaisons and put themselves under pressure....against a side who could change tempo amazingly. Drogheda did well and games like these show where we need to develop; fitness and concentration are there by and large, composure and guile will happen with experience. After that we will just have to wait and see how our youth development pans out. To use a political comment (in reverse) Irish sides need to be lucky all of the time, European sides only need to be lucky once. 2nd qualifying round is now absolutely minimum standard to kick on from.
As for Roddy, every time Con asked Rico about when he managed in Europe etc, Roddy would jump in with a 'when i managed ... and played in these games ... blah blah' lest we forget!! flipping plonker:rolleyes:
PS Did anyone else hear Collins swear when the Shels result was flashed up...must have handed over the weekly wage to the bookies....
kiev were prob one of the hardest draws after last nights showing aswell.
I think a draw would have been flattering for Drogs. Kiev had dozens of chances and should have scored a load more. It was heartbreaking the way Alliiev scored but it was a fair result.
At 1-1, there might have been a chance but at 2-1, with Kiev at home, I think even the most optimistic fans would struggle to justify backing Drogs.
I thought Ewings did very well, both goals aside. Gartland was outstanding in the second half for them. I don't see how Cahill got MOTM or how Zayed stayed on so long.
I was impressed with the Dinamo fans last night. They made a lot of noise considering they were outnumbered 10 to one.
man, i dont really think you have a clue about football:eek:Quote:
Originally Posted by Rovers Maniac
Drogheda were playing a team that have spent the last 11 seasons or whatever in the CL proper, and some of those past teams they had were a joy to watch. In fact Kiev nearly always play good passing football, and I would expect them to cause a few teams problems this season (thats if they can sort out their defense)
As someone else pointed out, it takes a good while to see the benefits of full time football. And for the last few years there can be no argument that LOi teams have improved in Europe
(by the way Kievs co efficient was 38,ooo or something, the Drogs was about 2000!!!! that does show the level they were up against)
That you Roy?Quote:
Originally Posted by Rovers Maniac
I agree totally.Quote:
Originally Posted by Denis The Red
(although I'd add professionalism to summer football - but as you say thats for another day)
Drogs were not outclassed & played like a team who knew they could win the game. Kiev were slightly better on the night (& definitely have a couple of class players - watching their No4 was worth the €25 ticket by himself) but the score draw may have been a fairer result IMO.
Irish football has progressed from expecting to lose at the first hurdle, past hoping to get a team into the second round, to expecting to be able to get to this level every year & hoping for one of our teams qualifying for the NEXT round - our results in the past 5 seasons all show this. The next step is regular participation in the 3rd rounds, which we could see in the next 2-3 years, before we can look at the possibility of regular (or any) participation in group stages. So, 2 steps taken in the past 5 years, 2 to go . . . .
:ball:
Unfortunately the 2 steps taken are a lot easier than the 2 steps to go. That is not to take away from the progress that has been made. Although the first 2 steps are a lot easier, it is still very difficult and you managed to do it. This is something that the Irish League is still trying to achieve and still a very long way away from achieving.Quote:
Originally Posted by CuanaD
I think the 2/3 years to regularly qualify for 3rd round is unrealistic. I think 5 to 7 years would be a bit more realistic if not still a bit optimistic. Shelbourne are the only side to reach the 3rd round and that was a few years ago. So I think regularly qualifying for the 3rd round is still a bit away as the next level of football is a considerable gap to the level we have been competing at.
i agree about the moral victory bit the fact is we lost but it was a great night for drogheda. everybody was expecting a 3 or 4 nil win for kiev last night but we put it up to them tried to play football and despite hanging on at times we gave a team who are more used to playing man united and real marid a run for their money. they bought a player for 6 mill 2 weeks ago. with that money somebody could probably buy drogheda united at least 3 times. so the fact that we gave them a big scare and were very unlucky not to get a draw can make it a great night for drogheda united and a step in the right direction for the eircom league. also fair play to the amount of non drogheda fans there last night. seen an awful lot of finn harps cork city limerick etc jackets.Quote:
Originally Posted by Rovers Maniac
The new changes to Uefa Cup in particular may change this but based on the current system LOI clubs on the verge of permanent seeding on the 1st qualifying rounds. This is the reason countries such as Latvia & Lithuania are still ahead of us. Seeding should ensure relative easy progression to the 2nd round (easy ranking points too) & if nothing else bigger games & money money.
It is still possible if lucky to draw teams easier than Kiev in the 3rd qualifying round (Kiev will be seeded in that round) so really that is the target to be looking at.