Yugoslavia. R.I.P.

Then there is the role of the IMF and the World Bank. These two unelected bodies have, with the EU, sought to impose Thatcherite neo-liberal solutions on Serbia-Montenegro, ever since the fall of Yugoslavia's Socialist-led government in 2000. Thousands of socially owned enterprises have already been privatised, but the west is still not satisfied - the IMF has made further economic help dependent on Belgrade selling off the valuable NIS oil company.

Montenegro's tiny economy is even more dominated by foreign capital than Serbia's, with the privatisation process having started much earlier. The selling off of nationally owned assets will have serious implications for the country's future economic viability and even with the tourist potential of its attractive coastline, it is difficult to see how Montenegro can afford to pay its way, without further surrender to western financial institutions. In doing so, it will be following the path of its neighbours.

For all the novelties of statehood, the brutal truth is that today's "independent" Balkan republics had, if anything, more independence when they were autonomous republics inside the Yugoslav Federation. In place of one militarily strong, internationally respected, non-aligned nation, there now exists a number of weak, economically unviable EU/IMF/Nato protectorates.

paragraphs one and two there are good. 3 is interresting.maybe debatable.

i dont understand the pro-serbia/yugoslavia sympathies.saying a unified yugolsavia should still exist is like saying ireland should rejoin the uk.

thers no good guys in the blakans. theyve being massacring each other for centuries. let them get on with having their own countries.
perhaps ina few decades through a system of EU style loose memberships of independent separate republics will do more to bring them together than teh previous 80 years of forced unfication in the yugoslav state did to help them live with each other

good post by dcfcsteve on page 2 of thei thread

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There's no good guys in the Balkans. They've being massacring each other for centuries.

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Well finally someone has come around to a reasonable viewpoint. Yes there are and were no good guys in the Balkans. Which is why it is important that this message is circulated. The Western Media portrayed the Bosnians and Croats as the good guys in the Bosnia-Herzegovinian Civil War and Serbs were portrayed as the bad guys. Serbs , Bosnians and Croats were all massacred during the Civil War. And for the record the Kosovar Albanians were as guilty of ethnic cleansing of Serbs as anyone else was guilty of ethnic cleansing against them. But of course it doesn't suit the agenda of certain Western States to acknowledge that fact and so it is scarcely if ever reported .

And this is also why none of them should be demonised any more than the other. I have met people from all sides of this conflict since the 1990's. On a one to one basis , Serbs, Croats and Bosniaks alike are all decent people pretty much like the Irish or any other people for that matter.

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Let them get on with having their own countries.Perhaps in a few decades through a system of EU style loose memberships of independent separate republics will do more to bring them together.....

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By your own logic, the United Kingdom should be dismantled. I agree with you Wales and Scotland are separate peoples to the English and also deserve their own states. And there has been an attempt to form an Ex-Yugoslavia Economic Area

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than the previous 80 years of forced unfication in the Yugoslav state did to help them live with each other

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There was more consent involved in forming Yugoslavia than the so-called United Kingdom, plus there was constitutional provisions written down in a single document, to enable those Republics who voted to secede, a system for doing so. Most of the problems involved in the break up of Yugoslavia stemmed from two things 1/ The borders of the constituent Republics 2/ The failure of the Outside World to abide by the provisions of the Federal Republic of Yugoslavia Constitution by recognising the states of Bosnia and Croatia as independent ... too soon in the process.

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Originally Posted by CollegeTillIDie

There was more consent involved in forming Yugoslavia than the so-called United Kingdom

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So ? The UK was set-up between 1535 and 1800. Nothing got done in those days in the 'right' ways or for the 'right' reasons. That doesn't make Yugoslavia any more or less legitimate or justifiable as a state. You can't assert the legitimacy of one illegitimate state by saying it's b@stard origin is less than other illegitimate states !

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Originally Posted by CollegeTillIDie

plus there was constitutional provisions written down in a single document, to enable those Republics who voted to secede, a system for doing so.

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Which they've all finally opted to do now. Proof that Yugoslavia wasn't wanted - regardless of how much blame for it's break-up you subscribe to the UN/EU.

Yugoslavia is gone - end of story. Hurrah.

Its allways hard to make a point on a situation until you have lived there and not involved one way or another. The propaganda that each country recieves will always be determined by some force and must be interpreted carefully.

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Originally Posted by anto eile

aw poor sebia, losing control over more land it shouldnt occupy

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They didn't occupy Montenegro. The two states have been united from before Yugoslavia.

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Originally Posted by anto eile

and theres no simple "good guys" in serbia.

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There's plenty of good people there. What are you on about?

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Originally Posted by Poor Student

They didn't occupy Montenegro. The two states have been united from before Yugoslavia.



There's plenty of good people there. What are you on about?

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thaks very much for wasting my time by misinterpreting my post.thanks a lot.
what i meant was the same as when i said

"There's no good guys in the Balkans. They've being massacring each other for centuries.
to which your ucd(d) mate pretty much agreed when he replied by saying
Well finally someone has come around to a reasonable viewpoint. Yes there are and were no good guys in the Balkans. Which is why it is important that this message is circulated. The Western Media portrayed the Bosnians and Croats as the good guys in the Bosnia-Herzegovinian Civil War and Serbs were portrayed as the bad guys. Serbs , Bosnians and Croats were all massacred during the Civil War. And for the record the Kosovar Albanians were as guilty of ethnic cleansing of Serbs as anyone else was guilty of ethnic cleansing against them. But of course it doesn't suit the agenda of certain Western States to acknowledge that fact and so it is scarcely if ever reported
And this is also why none of them should be demonised any more than the other. I have met people from all sides of this conflict since the 1990's. On a one to one basis , Serbs, Croats and Bosniaks alike are all decent people pretty much like the Irish or any other people for that matter.

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Originally Posted by Poor Student

They didn't occupy Montenegro. The two states have been united from before Yugoslavia.

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fair enough. but montenegro spliting from serbia is a good thing imo. completely and finally breaking up the old yugoslavia is a good thing

Well whatever you say about the politics of it, they would have had some football team in the 1990s.

So would a UK team in the late 1980's and 1990's - if such a one existed and Ireland hadn't gained independence....!