Far as I have read, he wasn't ever the first target and Darmian was always preferred. I wouldn't rule out both signing though.
Printable View
Far as I have read, he wasn't ever the first target and Darmian was always preferred. I wouldn't rule out both signing though.
It's also equally likely that the (reported) massive transfer fee would have put United off
It'd be the first time in a long time they have been put off by a high transfer fee.
If they got 10m for Rafael and bought Coleman for 20m then it wouldn't be as bad.
CD pointed out it might happen yet. Darmian can play centre half as well so maybe he's a Rojo-type signing- signed for centre half, full back and wingback. I think they've more pressing concerns than signing two right-sided defenders, though.
If United really wanted Coleman they would get him I think. They haven't been shy in splashing the cash over the last year or so. I have never seen this Darmian chap live but just watched an eight minute YouTube video to get an idea what kind of player he is. YouTube could make a hero of me playing five aside but he does seem to have a bit going for him, strong and aggressive but tidy and skillful. It might be slightly unfair to just judge a few stats like goals, assists and international caps to compare him with Coleman. Van Gaal seems meticulous and it just depends on what he's after. Coleman and Rafael are quite similar in playing style and Rafael has been all but frozen out in the past season despite Van Gaal praising his attitude. Time will tell but Italian internationals tend to be able to defend first and foremost, and this guy seems extremely versatile, something you couldn't really say about Coleman. I also feel TOWK's frustration though, this really looked like our main chance to have somebody playing at a really top level and, better still, excelling at that level. Hopefully it could still happen but I wouldn't share CD's confidence if this deal for Darmian does go through.
Edit- just saw on Sky that Darmian played all three games at the WC so I would have seen him, just didn't take a lot of notice. I was actually more interested in seeing their other versatile full back, Di Sciglio, who was excellent against us at Craven Cottage. He was injured for the first couple of games though.
Anytime I've seen him for Italy he's been on the left too. God knows Luke Shaw is hardly an intimidating prospect at left back.Quote:
Originally Posted by Olé Olé
It seems he made his debut at right back against us and went on to hold his place there for the subsequent World Cup games. He's been an ever present since in Euro qualifying, playing mainly on the right or right of a back three, but more recently on the left in the friendly against England and qualifier in Croatia, presumably due to Di Sciglio picking up an injury. Bit early to judge Shaw I think (despite being obviously overpriced) given his lack of fitness last season. Daley Blind had a good run at left back last season in any case and holding down a central midfield spot looks like it will be even more difficult for him next season.
I'd still be inclined to think United a fairly well covered at left back with Shaw, Blind and even Rojo all capable of covering that side, for now at least, but this article has made the same suggestion as you CD. I hope it turns out to be accurate and there might be hope for Coleman yet.Quote:
Originally Posted by Charlie Darwin
Quote:
Like Van Gaal, Torino coach Giampiero Ventura’s preference for a 3-5-2 often saw Darmian deployed as a left wing-back, and he could well displace Luke Shaw at Old Trafford.Last summer’s €35 million signing is yet to convince with either his performances or ability to avoid unwanted injuries, and the stature of Shaw’s price tag will mean little to his newfound competitor in Darmian.
What about the FIFA regulation on solidarity contributions? If that works, that would mean Sligo get 1% of the transfer fee for the 2 seasons he was with them?Quote:
Originally Posted by tricky_colour
Can't put up the money to buy a proven Premier League RB for what is a problem position, but they apparently have the money to pay over £20 million pounds for a 31 year old midfielder in a position where they are already well stocked.
They are far from well stocked with midfielders/players with Schweinsteiger's experience, leadership and class. They struggled any time Carrick was injured last season, which was a lot. Plus I've only seen reports or £14-15m, which seems very reasonable to me given what he should bring to them. Not sure where you're getting £20m from unless you're including wages or something.
They have been pretty proactive with regards their right back problem area. It made sense to sign Darmian, they obviously knew Torino were willing to negotiate and they got him for what seems like a very reasonable fee and, on paper at least, he seems to tick a lot of LVG boxes. There are no guarantees that Everton would be as easy to negotiate with and they might just think that Darmian is a better fit in any case, time will tell but I doubt it's a case of really wanting Coleman but being too mean to put up the cash.
If Coleman was English we might well be saying he's overpriced because of it, and fair play to United for going to the continent for better value instead of just taking the easy option, a la Shaw, Clyne, etc.
Only applies if he's transferred across borders AFAIK, and even so English clubs try not to pay it.Quote:
Originally Posted by geysir
You seem to be taking this personally.Quote:
Originally Posted by TheOneWhoKnocks
It's easy to see why United didn't go for Coleman. At 27 and with 4 years left on his contract Everton would've demanded a fee of around £25m, or perhaps more, for him. Whilst I believe he could play for one the top 4 clubs and acquit himself well, Darmian represents better value and, according to many observers, will bring a greater defensive solidity than Coleman would have.
Your point on Schweinsteiger is just silly. Firstly, the fee is rumoured to be upwards of £15m, not £20m, and he has genuine world class pedigree in an area of the pitch where United have none, bar Di Maria.
(Basically.....what DeLorean said. :p)
I see that cross border restriction for the training costs compensation but not for the solidarity contributionQuote:
Originally Posted by Charlie Darwin
have a read of transfer regulations
page 62 and 63 training costs
page 65 solidarity contribution
If Sligo don't want it, can I buy their claim for a fiver?
is di maria really world class? had seen him play for real madrid plenty of times and when utd paid what they did i was completely flabergasted. i honestly dont see why he has the reputation he hasQuote:
Originally Posted by The Fly
He's certainly very good. But i haven't seen anything to say he's World Class yetQuote:
Originally Posted by jbyrne
The entire regulation is limited in scope to transfers between national associations. From the preamble:Quote:
Originally Posted by geysir
Quote:
These regulations lay down global and binding rules concerning the status of players, their eligibility to participate in organised football, and their transfer between clubs belonging to different associations.
I see that now, scope nr1.
Strange though that the cross association requirement is written in triplicate in annex 4 Training Compensation, but not a peep in annex 5 Solidarity Contribution.
I believe that was the reason for an earlier case where Crumlin United were awarded a cut of Robbie Keane's transfer from Leeds to Spurs, only for them then to clarify it was only to apply in cases of cross-association transfers.
My intention with the 'bar Di Maria' comment was to hint at the potential world class performances he can deliver.Quote:
Originally Posted by jbyrne
He was certainly world class in his final season at Real Madrid. Indeed many highlighted him as Madrid's most important player.
I can't believe anybody could suggest with a straight face Di Maria isn't world class. If he's not world class then nobody other than Messi or Ronaldo is.
no, there are quite a few world class players other than messi and Ronaldo but di maria certainly isn't one of them. completely overhyped and his season at man utd to date is a prime example.Quote:
Originally Posted by Charlie Darwin
really?, in a season that Ronaldo scored over 50 goals including 17 in the champions lge? I must have missed something.Quote:
Originally Posted by The Fly
di Maria had the most assists in the Primera Liga that season, and was MOTM in the Champions League final.Quote:
Originally Posted by jbyrne
Obviously he's had a difficult season in England, after an excellent start. Other than Messi/Ronaldo/Suarez/Neymar, who would you consider world class? I think Di Maria would certainly slot into the next bracket comfortably enough.Quote:
Originally Posted by jbyrne
hazard, kroos, lahm, muller, neur, robben....Quote:
Originally Posted by DeLorean
players who can put a real stamp on a game. di maria rarely does so
Fair enough... we're miles apart on this :)
Yep. Google is your friend on that one.Quote:
Originally Posted by jbyrne
In fairness, Ronaldo was clearly Real's most important player over the season, but Di Maria turned it on in the CL final when Ronaldo, and to a lesser extent, Bale, didn't. The real hero was Sergio Ramos though, beast.
I reckon Argentina would have won the WC also, only for Di Maria's injury. He would have taken a lot of the heat off Messi and given Germany a lot more to think about.
Or maybe if they had Coleman right back instead of Zabaleta, he'd have cut out that ball for Gotze. :)
No doubt Coleman would have bettered Zabaleta.
Zabaleta is a 2-penalties-waiting-to-happen full back.
Did POS take over your account?Quote:
Originally Posted by geysir
I think players from certain countries carry more cachet than players from Ireland. Darmian could well turn out to be better than Coleman - I wait with bated breath - but the fact is that Coleman has more International experience, infinitely more Premier League experience and even as much European experience as Darmian does. Coleman is also - at 26 years old - coming into his peak years. United have been burned a few times spending money on young players: Smalling, Jones, Shaw, so it's bemusing as to why they would be reticent to spend £25-£35m on a proven player for a problem position.Quote:
I don't get why you think LVG would prefer continentals of equal ability to Irish players, that would be anti-Irish, no other way of wording it really. And there's nothing to back it up, even if Darmian and Coleman are of similar ability, it only emphasises the point of Darmian being better value at half the price.
I don't think the argument that Darmian costs less money carries as much weight when you read reports of United being willing to spend transfer fees between £50-70m on Thomas Muller and Sergio Ramos. They have had no problems spending ridiculous money on Schneiderlin, Shaw, Jones, Smalling and Fellaini. At least Coleman is worth 25-30m. I don't know if you can say that about some of those other players I mentioned in proportion to their talents.
Then on the other side of the coin, I can see Coleman has less resale value than Darmian and is locked into a four-year contract with harder negotiators than Torino. I can see that too. I thought it showed a lack of foresight from Coleman to sign a contract of that length at the time.
Who knows? Maybe we are all overrating Coleman and he isn't that good. You would think if he was as good as we all think he is, some top 4 team from England, Italy, Spain, Germany or France would come in for him.
It's worth considering that United have done their homework, identified the type of player the want, and Darmian is simply a better fit than Coleman. Time will prove them right or wrong.
Really? I think it is probably one of the best career decisions an irish player has made in recent memory. Stability and success are both assured with Everton. Not having a player at one of the "big" clubs is not the worst thing in todays premier league world in fairness.Quote:
Originally Posted by TheOneWhoKnocks
Southampton 0-3 Everton. Assist from Coleman for Everton's third. Long started but was pretty poor.
Back to the bench then!
Watching Darmian for United yesterday and Coleman for Everton today, it struck me just how dissimilar they are as players. Darmian is all defence and is very good. Coleman is clearly a more attacking full/wing back and is very good at both. Granted, I can't judge Darmians style on the one game I've seen of him but I think that VanG made a decision (if they were truly considering a bid for Coleman) based on what he feels the team needed for the season. I love what Coleman brings to Everton.
Exactly. Footballing reasons, always the best criteria to use when purchasing a player. Darmian isn't shy in bombing forward either though normally but didn't do much of it last night.
Two games is a bit quick to make a judgment on this one.
I retain the opinion that if Seamus Coleman was an England international and not an Ireland international he would be playing for Man Utd right now. That is what irks me. They have no problem paying what they would need to pay for Coleman to pay for players like Luke Shaw and Marouane Fellaini. When Coleman is the answer to their RB problems staring back at them, that's when they go to the continent to buy a cheaper option.
But that is a natural consequence of England being the be-all and end-all for Irish footballers.Quote:
Originally Posted by TheOneWhoKnocks