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Result of the playoffs was Iceland's 4-1 trashing of Israel under wily Norwegian coach Age Hareide who was Denmark's coach when they trashed Ireland in the play offs. He's 70 now and I have it on good authority that he's on a basic salary of Eur400k+. It beats me why the focus is on championship manager standard salary and why it is thought that Eur 750k p/a is not enough to attract a decent manager. Just look elsewhere outside Britain.
I don’t think he’s ****e. Better than some names that have been bandied aroundQuote:
Originally Posted by Razors left peg
Quote:
Originally Posted by ifk101
Hi lurker journalists!:blowkiss:
https://www.irishexaminer.com/sport/...-41358463.html
https://extra.ie/2024/03/22/sport/so...anne-andersson
This is absolutely mental. Two prominent Irish football journalists are now running Andersson as a live candidate for the job, I can only assume for no good reason other than ifk101's post on here yesterday. There seems to be nothing further to this at all. How desperate for news are they at this point - they've been absolutely had by the FAI on the manager search.
Would assume the Andersson stuff is off his recent comments rather than just his name being mentioned by Irish fans.
“I have received some concrete requests,” Andersson told aftonbladet.se.
“Latvia was concrete and I was hungry but it was a little too early.
“If it's the right thing, it can happen, but I also feel that I've become picky.
“I've had the job I'd most like to have in the whole world, so if I'm going to do something else, it must be the right thing.
“We'll see what happens but I have something going on.
“If everything falls into place, it will probably be ready next week. A federation job.”
So he's in talks with a federation and if all things go to plan it will be a done deal soon.
FAI want someone that will do some work out of Abbotstown and he's never worked outside Sweden. Might get a handier gig closer to home that's more part time unless the money on offer is better than others are offering.
Eh, To Managed IrelandQuote:
Originally Posted by MylesNotMiley
I saw Brighton coach Gary Dicker tweet his attendance at the match last night. Last time he tweeted about attending an Ireland game was against Greece last June...
Paul Rowan has absolutely no info anyway. He writes a piece in the Times today speculating on Janne Andersson and even bothering to get quotes from Paul Walker in Sweden before concluding Andersson's desire to live in Sweden means he's probably not in for the Irish gig. Absolutely pointless article from a man who clearly hasn't a notion who is in the frame.
Poyet, Sagnol, Barry feel like the final 3 and I'm really saying Barry with more hope than anything.
Paddy Power have stopped taking bets on next Ireland manager.
Perhaps we’re close
I really, really think its Sagnol. He's relatively young for a manager, 90 minutes away from a major tournament and a free hit at a tournament that Georgia would have no expectations at. I don't see any real logic for why he would be stepping away unless he had another job to sign up for. I know his team said the FAI hadn't been in contact but maybe that's just being said for legal reasons just like the FAI said they cant name their manager until early April due to legal reasons.Quote:
Originally Posted by Olé Olé
We have to remember Poyet is out of contract too but the difference is he just hasn't been offered one yet by Greece so it's not really the same situation.
That's happened at least twice since the search beganQuote:
Originally Posted by Fixer82
I think it's Sagnol as well, the more I look into his tactical setup and philosophy the more he seems like a perfect fit for Ireland. It's a logical step up for him to make as well from Georgia in terms of salary and expectation.Quote:
Originally Posted by CSAD
His people dismissing the notion of an FAI approach might be technically true if he applied for the job rather than being approached, he always treated the Georgia role like a stepping stone position with his intention to leave after the campaign regardless of qualifying so it's fair to assume he was making his availability known for positions opening after this window.
Also he's preparing for one of the biggest games in Georgian football history so nobody connected to him or Georgia are going to say anything to Irish journalists which could cause a distraction.
Why would he already have agreed to leave a side he could be leading to the Euros though?Quote:
Originally Posted by Murfinator
Career progression I assume. Regardless of the reason it does seem to be the case considering followers of Georgia have said so.Quote:
Originally Posted by pineapple stu
https://twitter.com/GeorgianFooty/st...72801732039031
That site looks a bit like a Georgian equivalent of foot? (Or maybe Kenny's Kids more accurately)
It's probably repeating what's been reported elsewhere (which isn't to say it's not true) and there's a comment on it we've been talking to Murat Yakin.
I think if he wanted career progression he'd give himself a chance of a good showing with a minnow at the Euros though. That'd attract attention.
(I don't expect them to get there for all that)
I must do a Google but someone on Off the Ball said that Sagnol had racism allegations made against him previously? Must do a check.
I'm still wondering if there is any chance it's Barry. And that O'Shea and Co stay in situ for June, hence why such a team was put in place. And maybe that some of them stay in place for Barry.
Wishful thinking regarding Barry perhaps. Same thing could be occurring for Sagnol or Poyet.
Is it most likely to be Sagnol really?
He racially profiled African and Nordic players as having certain qualities & African ones as lacking others. Said there'd be far fewer Africans signed for Bordeaux while he was manager because of the AFCON.Quote:
Originally Posted by Olé Olé
Think it was said that the incoming manager will be starting work in April and won't be double jobbing until the summer if he's already in another job.Quote:
Originally Posted by Olé Olé
I’d be really disappointed with Sagnol. He basically had a failed job with Bordeaux about a decade ago and then managed Georgia who have a generational talent in Kvaratskhelia.
They got to that playoff by topping a group with Gibraltar, North Macedonia and Bulgaria. And their semi final was a win against Luxembourg. Came 4th in the euros qualifying group - which is pretty much par for what you’d expect by them.
So I really don’t see that he’s done a particular good job with either Bordeaux or Georgia.
Cheers. I rooted it out. Fairly warped comments. I'm sure our players of African heritage, including the 4 frequent starters in Bazunu, Omobamidele, Idah and Ogbene would be keen on impressing someone who comes out with this sort of stuff...: https://www.france24.com/en/20141106...frican-playersQuote:
Originally Posted by CraftyToePoke
Sagnol told the Sud Ouest daily [link in French]: "The advantage of the typical African player is that he is not expensive when you take him, he's generally ready to fight and he is powerful on the pitch. But football is not just that, it's also technique, intelligence, discipline."
OK… so which viable candidates do we have left who meet the conditions of Canhams statement (April contractual commitments), without being overly creative (looking at you Razor!)
- Sagnol (did some research on him yesterday, it would be a fascinating appointment really - things there I like but as ES points out a lot of ho hum)
- Poyet (i do think it might be him but it’s such a risky appointment for a very conservative FAI leadership - would be a wild rollercoaster ride)
- Anderrson (doesn’t really meet Canhams comment but his own comments are a tease, who knows what restrictions there might have been when he stepped down from Sweden. His style suits our culture)
Who else? Hard to see how it’s Barry - though his current roles are fairly narrow in scope and he may fancy the full meal deal.
Think a lot of people in football would say the exact same things about players coming out of Ireland in truth.Quote:
Originally Posted by Olé Olé
That they are powerful but unintelligent and undisciplined? I don't think I've ever heard anything like that. Direct maybe, hardworking maybe, physical definitely but none of those terms juxtaposed with mental capacity or another race in an unfavourable way. I wouldn't like it if it was said about Irish football players.Quote:
Originally Posted by Eirambler
I'd rather keep the current team in charge than those options tbh. I want someone who knows our players, not someone with pre conceived notions of Little Ireland like Trap. Maybe I'm just burned out on the whole thing but whoever it is at this point I can't wait for it to be over and we can move on to picking apart the man's every decision and blaming him for all the woes of Irish footballQuote:
Originally Posted by SkStu
Quote:
Originally Posted by SkStu
With Andersson his age and the fact he's never managed outside Sweden I don't think he'd be open to it. I don't see him being as open to the new job specs that the FAI want from the new head coach.
As for Willy Sagnol, even if he has plans to leave Georgia after this campaign I don't see him being in talks but talks so detailed that you've agreed terms while still in contention for the Euros.
As for Gus Poyet, if it was him we'd know about it because he'd have announced it himself or leaked it to the papers.
Sagnol is a racist - and to me it’s shocking that just after dumping the idea of hiring a man who threatened and intimidated a woman, the FAI are now apparently considering hiring a racist to run an international team with numerous black players in the squad.
There is a reason why Sagnol didn’t have a job for four years before getting the Georgia gig.
If looking for potential groundswell of support for JOS coming into being, interesting framing on this RTE article: https://www.rte.ie/sport/soccer/2024...e-for-ireland/
"John O'Shea offered the Ireland fans a glimpse of what the future could be like if the former Manchester United man was handed the permanent position as national team manager."
Would definitely rule him out for me anywayQuote:
Originally Posted by Jolly Red Giant
That they're cheap, physically developed, will give their all, but generally extremely technically limited. A few other stereotypes still kicking around as well even to this day, but not as prevalent as they used to be thankfully.Quote:
Originally Posted by ontheotherhand
I'm not defending Sagnol's comments by the way, he absolutely shouldn't have said them. Just pointing out that similar views exist of ourselves.
Can be more than a hint of truth to those stereotypes too. The old "British football style" comments we hear about the national team too. We mightn't like them, but it doesn't mean they're wrong or even that we have a right to offence at them.Quote:
Originally Posted by Eirambler
Ffs lads let's not equate the Irish stereotype of hard working players and say it's similar to Africa. Firstly there are 54 individual countries in Africa so don't lump them all in as one, and more importantly as a continent Africa has produced some of the best players the world has ever seen. Anyone that says there is a stereotypical African player is a fcuking racist plain and simple
Ah look I'm not saying you are at all. Just saying there's a way to interpret his words, the ones I picked out rather than the ones you have above, that makes them very similar to the typical racist tropes you hear. Adding in the Nordic reference makes it pretty clear to me where he is coming from.Quote:
Originally Posted by Eirambler
It would turn me off the idea of him as manager. If it's even an idea...I've lost track of who is actually in the running versus who is a fever dream born out of our collective boredom.
And I could be very wrong here now but I doubt there are many African migrants inwards for an old Soviet Union member country.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jolly Red Giant
I don't think there are any players of African heritage in the current Georgia squad.
Whether there were any players of African heritage in the Georgia squad before Sagnol became manager might be a more instructive question to have answered. Again, I don't think so.
On the contrary - I think an interesting issue that arose with scouting for African players back in the early days of football globalisation is that scouts went looking for a particular type of player. I think it was the big physical striker - the Didier Drogba style player. But because that's what they were looking for - and what the clubs wanted/expected - that's what they found. They would have passed over technical midfielders, keepers, etc.Quote:
Originally Posted by Razors left peg
So it's entirely possible Sagnol's comments had some basis in fact. (I've no idea obviously) Often it's easier to take offence and dismiss someone as racist, but that doesn't mean it's correct. And I'm not saying it's not correct either. Just a bit of nuance can't do any harm.
The comments about the AFCON seem fine to me; other managers have made similar complaints.
For me, elatedscum's analysis of Sagnol's career is far more pertinent in terms of whether we want him as manager
Nothing wrong with the AFCON comments but if you are still talking about a stereotypical African player in this day and age Ron Atkinson would love a pint and a chat with you
But you've ignored my post. I'm suggesting that while there mayn't be such a thing as a stereotypical African player, there quite possibly was such a thing as a stereotypical African player who came through a scouting mechanism looking for a specific type of player.
Surly anyone who uses the "nordic" is into White supremacy!
No, I didnt ignore your post, I dismissed your post as the bullsh1t it is. Any supposed stereotype of African players has come from racism. You can potentially say a certain country is stereotyped based on a style of football over the years , you can't do that for an entire Continent unless you lump them all together as one. How can you say Jay Jay Okocha is a similar Stereotype to Drogba, or George Weah to Salah. Players from there are as diverse as 54 different countries would be anywhere else.Quote:
Originally Posted by pineapple stu
If you are trying to make the argument that scouts today have an African player type in mind I think that says more about you than the football world at large
Suggesting it based on what ?Quote:
Originally Posted by pineapple stu
What you're saying bears no relation to what Sagnol actually did say & this scouting scenario you're putting up as to why he'd say it, well its news to me.
Seems a pretty oblique defensive angle to take on all this
rather than just call it out as wrong, offensive and hurtful. Which is what it was.
& it begs the question why you would seek ways of defending him on it also.
I’m sure you’ve all googled it by now like I have. He apologized for his comments so they were obviously wrong.
The apology itself was a bit ham-fisted but he gave additional context to his words - in particular that his reference to intelligence was meant in a footballing sense rather than a racial or ethnic sense. His argument being that the youth coaching infrastructure there is not to par with what you’d get elsewhere (he used the Scandinavian system as a comparator) therefore the younger African players need that type of development when they’re signed. His opinion has a certain logic to it that I don’t think is racist. But how he said it originally was brutal and he rightly got called out on it.
I think you've being too nice
My take is he is saying African players are strong but thick
Nordic re white people are the smart players. His "clarification" was I guess to save his backside
I'd be very disappointed if we hired him. What kind of message would it send to our black players and to our African community as a whole.
That's pretty much it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Diggs246
Window dress it / rephrase it / revise it / clutch at straws to justify it all they like.
You know exactly what you're fu cking saying when you cite Nordic people over African ones.