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I think the tradition of the Boxing day games helps the IL derbies get really good crowds. These seem to be big events regardless of how the season is going for the clubs. The eircom league has no such equivalent. Also, the teams tend to play each other more often, which detracts from the attraction.
I'd be willing to bet the average derby crowd in the North will drop next year with more league games between the sides.
The key issue I believe is that there is a football culture throughout Northern Ireland, which is lacking in the Republic.Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve Bruce
Northern Ireland is and always has been the footballing heart-land of the island. Bar the odd hick village in Tyrone or Derry, or the Hurling-loving Glens of Antrim, there are no towns in the North where soccer isn't the number one sport through and through. Furtehrmore, it's been the number one game throughout the north since time began. As a result, most people in parts of the north that have an IL team will know people who are supporters of the game, and many will have been to matches themselves
In the Republic, on the other hand, large swathes of the country have historically not had a culture of supporting soccer (and often darn-right hostility towards it). There are huge areas where GAA, and even rugby, have always been more popular than soccer. Even where EL teams do exist, outside of the main cities (and often inside as well) these are teams with much less history and longevity behind them than your average IL team. The likes of Galway, Limerick, Drogheda, Longford, etc haven't the support - both active and latent - built-up over many decades that the likes of Portadown, Ballymena, Coleraine etc do. It's no accident that of the 6 new spaces (and the 11 or so different teams who've fille dthem) that were added added to the LOI in 1985 - 23yrs ago - the only club that's had good support (City) is the one from a hard-core soccer city in the north where the team had a latent pool of support to tap into. There is nowhere near the same latent pool of support for the local game in the south as there is in the north. You could spend your whole life in Dublin without meeting anyone who's ever been to an Eircom League game. Depending on the circles you move within, that would be a lot harder to do in Belfast I believe.
What primarily killed football in the Republic was, i believe, the glittering lights of English/Scottish football and the promise of something much better elsewhere. What did the same for the IL, I believe, had more to do with the sectarian strife impacting on the game. That would suggest that the latent pool is still there to be tapped. But i don't believe, in this modern age, that the extremely parochial IL has the draw to fully tap that latent potential (I think an AIL would have a much better chance).
Cork City have a bigger support than Derry City. There are too many teams in dublin thats why a big top of table derby can only get 2,000. If there was one team for northside one team for southside it would be far better.
Less travelling up the north is the key imo...Quote:
Originally Posted by dcfcsteve
South I'd imagine.Quote:
Originally Posted by kingdomkerry
Galway United v St Pat's - official attendance - 1,003
great crowd in bray tonight, about 1000 rovers at least. i'd say the attendance would be about 2200-2300, im open to correction on that now.
I agree with most of the rest of what you say, but that statement is only true if you stick a '4' after the word 'Dublin' - certainly, in North or West Dublin, you would have to move in very select circles to avoid LoI fans completelyQuote:
Originally Posted by dcfcsteve
Its going to be very tough to change people's outlook towards the eloi. So many people who are interested in football have never been to a league of ireland game. I think a few campaigns in secondary schools could change things,its young people's attitudes that can change. Its so frustrating talking to people who are interested in football and asking them why they don't go to games,they say "cos its sh**",but sure they've never been at a game so how would they know?!
But it's all relative.Quote:
Originally Posted by Raheny Red
Anyway - away crowds are generally poor at IL games, and if you're talking about derby games there's little travel involved in those games eitehr side of the border.
Not sure what your point is...? :confused: It's a much bigger city anyway.Quote:
Originally Posted by kingdomkerry
There are too many teams in Dublin, but I don't believe that's why derbies there get poor crowds. There's an even biggger 'club density' problem, and a much smaller population, in Belfast - Yet Linfield v Glens can atract 10,000. The number of clubs isn't so much of a problem re individual games's attendances if you have a couple of big, well supported clubs (or clubs with latent support). We don't have that in Dublin, but they do in Belfast. The big question is - why is that ?Quote:
Originally Posted by kingdomkerry
Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve Bruce
How many was at the Setanta derby games in Belfast?
It didn't seem to many the past two seasons. Defo not more than 4,000 reading through the old threads on ILS forums.
As for the mid Ulster derby, it's been only twice in 14 years since the crowd exceeded 5,000.
The north coast derby barely gets 2,000 nowadays.
Things will hopefully improve with the 12/14 team league.
Woeful crowd at Belfield tonight; no official figures available for the foreseeable future, but it was about 200.
Edit - 230 on the RTÉ report and on the radio, so that appears to be an official figure.
Listening on radio on the way home from home from Dublin.
When a crowd of 230 was announced by Pat McCaullive a shudder went through my body.
Thats the equivilant of the the attendance of an u-10 streets league final in Cork.
Good win though.
Serious question for UCD fans. Are attendances effected by the terms at college. i.e. Are most of the supporters students, who disperse to various parts of the country during the summer months or are there many of your fans who don't go to UCD but live in the area??
No, a very small part of our support is made up of students. The most students we had this season was around 120 against Drogheda. We usually only get around 20, although I don't think anyone has been keeping check lately.Quote:
Originally Posted by oldyouth
if there was 230 there you can be sure 70/80 were Harps supporters at the very least so just 150 home fans and neutrals.Most 1st division Teams have bigger support than that.
How can you be so sure? Not sure what difference it makes but there was about 50 Harps fans at most, and that would be being generous. Yet again you come marching in thinking you know it all when you don't have a clue.Quote:
Originally Posted by gufct
Derry vs Finn Harps would get on average 6,000 to 7,000. (that 4,000 crowd was on a tuesday night)Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve Bruce
The last Rovers-Bohs derby in Tolka there were at least 4,500 at it with an incredible atmosphere. So the north-west derby isn't "far and away" the biggest attended derby in the LOI. In tallaght I can assure you we will easily sell out this derby (6,000). But yeah, it is bad considering you's can get 14,000 for the glentoran-lindfield derby - I think that is an incredible crowd considering both clubs average attendences are around 2,500. (guess) The event junkie mentality on this island is obviously very prevelent up north.
901 announced at Shels v Youths.