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The first goal was actually a well executed set piece, credit where it's due. I think Carsley should have attacked the ball but the guy probably would still have made the flick and those flicks are difficult to defend against. Classic George Graham set piece.
I think we should accept that we are a nation of chokers and will continue to do so in most sports for the foreseeable future
Dunne was immense, a man of the match performance.
Was surprised at how shaky McShane was.
The substitutions cost us last night, we didn't have the players on the pitch.
Sick after that game.
Jesus that game was there for the taking. Dominated the game for seventy mins. Oshea at fault for second goal totally, another s&ite performance by him. He is useless and should never play for Ireland again.
Why did Stan bring on Jonathon Douglas WHY WHY. I cannot understand that. Rest of the tram performed well. Doyles goal was top class. At least the performance was good, bit John O Shea has no cahunas, He has been Irelands worst player for three years and brings the whole team down. Get rid of him Stan although you wont because you have no cahunas either.
Nut I suppose no nobody died. Hopefully Wednesday will be better
You were GLAD slovakia equalised?? Grow up.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jofspring
We didnt keep hold of the lead and of course thats a problem. We are short of top quality players and a lot of the team are still very young.
But the stupid talk about tactics from Dunphy really annoys me. Who cares which of the full backs play left or right? Has anyone got the guts to point out that Benitez put Finnan left back the other week at Liverpool?? Oh no...we just want to slag Stan for every little thing. Stan is simply mature enough to know that it depends on lots of factors why you put players in different positions. Its not just black and white. Remember Stan was a full back..maybe he knows something about those positions...? Maybe?? Perhaps?
At the end of the day we are short as a team. Thats the problem. NOt tactics or managers. Stan is doing okay..
I thought that O'Shea was at fault for the second equaliser (that hurts to write) rather than the introduction of Douglas. Why on earth didn't he get his body behind the 'tackle' that he made before the Slovak scored? He and Kilbane were particularly awful last night.
Not to detract from the silliness of the Douglas substitution. He isn't the worst player in the world and has played well for us in the past and shouldn't be blamed for being the substitute. It was Stan's call and I just cannot understand it. I just can't think of one tactical benefit Stan envisaged taking place as a result of Douglas. And Gibson, for that matter. Both were pointless substiutions that killed us.
Yeh thats a great comment. Real positive and factual. Thanks!Quote:
Originally Posted by mrtndvn
very factual actually.
there was slovakia the other day, all those leads thrown away under Kerr, Spain in the world cup, Belgium in the play offs before that....
Rugby: France in the 6 nations, the 6 nations before that... Even Munster made hard work of the European cup.
boxing: Bearnard Dunne
Its an Irish mentality, we don't believe we're good enough, until we get other this well never win anything
We used to be fairly clutchy back in Charltons time, not missing any penalty in the shootout with Romania and never losing to Engerland in the 5 times we played them. I miss those days, each manager we have gotten since Charlton has gotten progressively worse, which makes me fear what the hell are we going to get as manager after Staunton
Why was douglas even in the squad? I want to give stan a chance but for f**ks sake, it's getting harder..........Got one half of double up anyway, forza latvia:DQuote:
Originally Posted by Donal81
I though Kilbane had a decent game on saturday to be honest by the standards set by the Ireland team anyway. His runnign with the ball won us a few free kicks and provided a break for our defenders against the Slovakian onslaught on our goal that seemed to be a feature of the match. The midfield otherwise was dire. They created nothing for the strikers (Doyle's goal was pure magic). McGeady in particular was rubbish. He's not good enough and shouldn't be near the starting lineup. Carsley was quite poor also (he kept giving the ball back to the Slovaks).
As for O'Shea. How does he still after all this time and all his mistakes find his way into the team? He was absolutely shocking as usual. The worst Irish regular I've ever had the misfortune to watch by a distance. He adds absolutely nothing in every performance.
Look at the games he's cost us by his mistakes:
The Swiss away (Euro 2004)
Israel at home
The Czechs at home
Slovakia away
another thing that i noticed and that really fecked me off, was carsley was crap and he just walked off without a care, not even bothering to applaud the fans etc.
craig you should add that link to your sig instead of having to post it in every threadQuote:
Originally Posted by craig7042
It wouldn't surprise me if we got a result in Prague on Wednesday as nothing Stan seems to do has any logic to it.
Most of it has probably already been said, but here are my thoughts:
Dunne- didnt think he had as good a game as some on here? But still one of our most reliable performers. Agree that he should be captain, generally i just don't see the point in having a striker as a captain. I think RobbieK would do well to be able to just concentrate on his own game too, rather than having the responsiblity of leading the lads. But am i mistaken, or did JOSH get given the armband when RobbieK went off against Denmark? While Dunne was still on the pitch???
Kilbane- far too easy a target for some on here; not sure i'd pick him to start but i thought he had a pretty good game really. Thought he was more effective than McGeady, unfortunately. I dont think his effort can ever be faulted, even if the skill comes up short.
Full backs- i figure the out-of-position thing was because Stan wanted two of our more inexperienced lads to be covered by two of our 'more' experienced. Otherewise we would have had Kelly and McGeady on the right, which could have been disasterous? Its kind of a negative tactic, but if you leave out Kilbane, his replacement on the flanks is still going to be either fairly inexperienced and/or defensively lightweight?
Doyle- not a great game, but what a goal! Grew in confidence after; hopefully that'll kick-start his season.
Subs- just unbelieveable. Again, i think its already been said. The situation looked pretty identical to when we played them in Dublin; Slovakia looked decent enough going forward, but pretty shaky at the back. At Croker both Hunt and Long came on and that took pressure off our defence. There might have been a case for Long to come on instead of Murphy, but what i really cannot understand is why Douglas came on instead of Hunt??? The Gibson sub is more debatable perhaps, but i thought Reid should have started anyway.. either way i thought we were crying out for someone to put their foot on it. With Reid so on-form you have to feel for him. Baffling.
Still gutted this morning. And yet we're still not out... Its torture.
I thought Dunne had a great game but there is something about him which doesnt seem to inspire the players around him like McGrath, Moran or McCarthy. I've seen the defence at Ireland and Man City disintigrate on occasions. Hopefully McShane will develop into a better leader.
At least now on Wednesday we have to try and win and no point sitting back where as had we beaten the slovaks, stan would have all men behind the ball looking for a draw and we would probably get hammered so hopefully that slovak result turns out a blessing. Dont know why but have that feeling we are going to win on Wed night.Quote:
Originally Posted by drinkfeckarse
Amen to that. If there's one sure thing to come out of the result on Saturday is taht now we won't be starting with a team aiming at securing the draw (as I'm sure Staunton would have done). If this was the case I think we woudl be far mroe likely to be beaten.Quote:
Originally Posted by cobra
The lack of the win on Saturday measn we've no choice but to go for all three points from the off. The only problem is our team under both Stan and Kerr before him keep trying to hang on when they get a goal in front (even early in the game) and I can't see us managing this against the Czechs.
Another draw I reckon with us going a goal ahead as per usual then giving away the lead.
1 up front so. :DQuote:
Originally Posted by cobra
disappointed after saturday like the rest of you, thought the worst thing that could have happened was us scoring so early, we hadnt a clue what to do
i'll say it yet again though, Stephen Kelly is one of the worse defenders i've seen in a green jersey (yes, including JOS, Harte et al). hes a nightmare yet stan seems to have a huge horn for him, how does this guy ever get near the team bus, even with our injury problems he should have been left at home
everything else has already been said in this thread, i have this horrible sense of disappointment but i knew this moment would come since the cyprus game..... how could we ever expect to beat the Slovaks or Cechs in their back yard when we couldnt beat a scrappy Cyprus side in Nicosia...
Germany couldnt win in Nicosia either and hopefully the Czechs will struggle to when they go out there too.Quote:
Originally Posted by McGinty
Yeah and pigs will fly and we'll all find a pot of gold at the end of the rainbow!
Dream on Cobra I admire your optimism but time for a reality check even if that did happen it won't matter as it's their last game anyway. We have to play Germany and Wales. Both of these countries are more than capable of beating us. The Czechs still have to play the Slovaks and The Slovaks have 2 games against San Marino. It's not a case of us qualfying anymore it's a case of finishing above Slovakia. Think seedings and the optimism turns quickly to despair!
I want to think positive especially when I am going to Prague Wed morning. The czechs have to go to germany yet, have to play slovakia( a derby and the slovaks can still make it) and go to cyprus which will not be easy and play us:D. I would not rule out Slovaks for 2nd placeQuote:
Originally Posted by WembleyGreen
Thats such a losers attitude, granted the odds are against us, but to say its not about qualifying anymore is foolish, the bookies have Ireland at 23/5 to qualify and the Czechs are 1/10, so giving the bookies usual margin for profit our actual chances of qualifying are somewhere between 23/5 and 10/1(ignoring odds of Slovakia which are negligible) probably around 15/2, unlikely but there is still a slim chance.Quote:
Originally Posted by WembleyGreen
If you are 100% sure Ireland won't qualify then why not bet everything on the Czechs qualifying, you would make a 10% profit.
Nah the Slovaks have virtually no chance but you can get 54-1 on Slovaks qualifying if you fancy themQuote:
Originally Posted by cobra
I think the Czechs won't beat Cyprus in Nicosia - in fact I think they might be defeated. But I think we will draw in Prague, and wont win against the Germans and probably will draw in Wales, so overall the Czechs will still go thru.
the czechs beat slovakia in slovakia ..Germany Beat them ...scores were 4-1 and 3-0 something we didn't do particualrly dissappointing when you see they were there for the taking
In four away games in this group we have four points...that is terrible when you look at the fact we played both San Marino and Cyprus in two of them. Our only win is against San Marino. How can we expect to beat the czechs
germany 1-0
Cyprus 5-2 (Still cant believe i wrote five there)
San Marino 1-2
Slovakia 2-2
People can talk all they want about the number of games withouit a loss but the above is dire reading in fairness
I would be thinking on them lines too and thats only 2 points gained leaving them on 19pts, taking it germany beats them(even a draw)..Slovakia have wales at home, 2 games against san marino which you would expect them to win leaving them on 19pts..so the game between the czechs and slovakia could be 2nd place for the winners..The 54/1 Morbo mentions for slovakia qualifying is worth a few bob to meQuote:
Originally Posted by cfdh_edmundo
in fairness to oshea, that "chance" he got was from a very tight angle. It was by no means easy lads, dont know how it looked on the camera, but i thought he did well to get it across the box. it fell awkwardly for him too.
As with all football the blame ultimately should fall on the managers head. Yes individuals didn't perform but at the end of the day thats the gaffers job, plain and simple. It's Stans job to get the players to perform if he can't do that he isn't doing his job.
Morbo & Edmundo, does the phrase "grasping at straws" or in your case 'betting slips' ring a bell or two? 20 years since we won a game away against anyone of any consequence, I was in San Marino and saw what transpired first hand, it's left me scarred for life! Win your home games, win aginst the goal fodder of the group and then try and at least draw against the so called contenders. We've haven't even managed this, losing in Cyprus was bad, drawing against the Czechs was 2 points dropped at home and with Germany to come I can't share your rose tinted bookie specs! Sorry!
There is an interesting tactical analysis in The Times' The Game today. It shows 3 pictrures in the run up to the goal, with key players ringed.
The captions are:
1. Dawdling Douglas - Jonathan Douglas , the Ireland substitute watches Marek Cech advancing yet shows no desire to track him.
2. Douglas continues to jog back while JOS the right back moves left to help the central defenders.
3. Too late. Douglas tries to get back but Czech fires in Slovakias late equaliser as O'Shea dives across in vain.
Can be seen here. Disproves the theory that O'Shea turned his back to the ball.Quote:
Originally Posted by Paddy Garcia
Shocked at the choice of the starting 11 and stunned by the substitutions. Reid had to start as Doyle and Keane want the ball to feet.
Hunt is a great impact sub as he has proved in the last 3 competitive matches. Does Stan never watch the videos of our previous games.
Two great Goals for Ireland, but both goals conceded could have been avoided by better organisation.
At least we had these few moments of unbridled joy ...
anyone had the match notice how carsley after such a crap performance i might add, didnt even bother to come over to the fans? says it all to me really.
looking at teh stuff on youtube, what was dunne putting the ball across the defence like that, he should have cleared the thing out or back up the field.
But looking at douglas and JOSH that just ****ess me off even more.....again.
I think there's a suggestion Dunne was pushed. Stephen Kelly certainly said so. I can't look at youtube at work.
Ive looked at it too many times already so I cant look again :D but that may be the case actually, it looks as though he is turning his head to see where he is aiming it but that could actualy be him turning his head around as he was pushed. However from looking at it, he definitely aims the ball over that way, whether that was a reaction of being pushed or not I dont know..... anyhow there was so much space over on osheas side, terrible defending from both of them arrrggggggh its just frustrating even thinking about it. good finish but terrible defending.Quote:
I think there's a suggestion Dunne was pushed. Stephen Kelly certainly said so. I can't look at youtube at work.
I'm useless at finding stuff on Youtube; can anyone post a link to the Slovak eqauliser, or tell me how to find it? For some reason i feel compelled to watch it again, just to see exactly what went wrong :mad:
(ps. Macdermesser; mate, quality footage of Doylers goal and the 'pit' afterwards!)