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I think ConorE - in fairness to him - was answering the assumption by NYHoop that we were getting €1m p.a. for 25 years after the deal has been concluded.
In any case, as I've stated, we get €2m now just for agreeing to the deal. In 12 months we get another €1m, then €1m 12 months after that and so on until the handover (or pp, not sure).
Trust me you havent met the real resistance yet, the residents associations in Castleknock are particularily influential due to 2 senior Planners in FCC, 2 Senior Execs in ABP and more than 1 or 2 TD's living in the area, if they manage to organise a sustained effort against such a development it'll be an uphill task. In an ideal world these people would step aside as soon as the applications are lodged due to the fact they can hardly be expected to look at them impartially, sadly however this will not be the case due to our archaic planning system. Yeasr of experience have taught me that to get a fair crack of the whip is highly unlikely.Quote:
Originally Posted by CharlesThompson
Just had a quick look at FCC's development plan in relation to parking resuirements btw, according to Table 6.2 of the current development plan a parking requirement of 1 space per 3 seats is stated for Auditorium, Theatre, Cinema and stadia, obviousy in this instance theres not a hope in hell of meeting that standard, so straight away you can see the obstacles that will be brought to bear on this proposal.
I have to say due to the location ill be keeping my eye on this project very closely, should be an interesting bout!
Koh
D
Thanks to charles thompson for responding properly. Must however note that future rational questions that would interest all EL fans could be construed as "inaccurate notions" or "playing to the crowd".
You're not wrong about your biggest problem.
KOH
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roverstillidie
The sniping from yourself and NY Hoop is really getting pathetic at this stage I love your feeble attempts to imply that Bohs are getting screwed and the fans don't know it. Or maybe you guys are the experts since you've allowed yourselves to get rode so many times by your own club.
Just to indulge you slightly...
Milestone 1 = (Agreement of Deal.) - Bohs get 2 million Non-refundable deposit
Milestone 2 = (1 year from agreement) - Bohs get 1 Million Refundable deposit
milestone 3-5 = (Each year from year 1) - Bohs get 1 Million Refundable deposit
Milestone 4 (Completion of New Stadium) - Bohs get 27million minus deposits paid. Which can range from 24million to 0 million depending on how long it takes to build the stadium.
Optional Milestone 5 = (The planning collapses) - Bohs give back the refundable parts of the deposit.
Optional Milestone 6 = (If the deal has not progressed after 5 years) - Bohs have the option to cancel and renegotiate it - thus incentivising the builder to have the ground complete within 5 years.
As for the fine detail? Nobody knows the fine detail of the deal yet, not even the developers, as it has not been negotiated yet. We voted on a letter of offer which sets out some concrete parts of the deal and leaves others for thrashing out later. You can spin this as a bad thing if you want but it isn't.
The planning aspects, road widening, etc. are Andorry's problem. If they cannot achieve their side of the deal we can walk and keep their 2 million bob.
A final point. So Bohs didn't have the money to develop more than one side of our ground - big swing.
As far as I can see the only people who were rewarded for consistent failure were Shamrock Rovers. They got free land for their constant failure over almost 20 years, immediately p*ssed that away, and then got another free handout of a municipal stadium. The Bohs members have done the best they could with the money they had at all times, including this deal in AD2006 - this is more than can be said for many clubs in the league.
Any criticism from Rovers fans, the club with the absolute worst record on Football Stadiums in the country, should be treated with the contempt it deserves by Bohs fans. You had to stand on a broken down terrace - boo hoo, my heart bleeds for you, you poor baby.
PS
Real Madrid IS a members club.
vitruvian, the only sniping is coming from the black and tan quarter. this is a hugely important issue for all football fans in the country, and we are asking a few simple questions about the ins and outs of the deal. who is criticising the deal? i certainly dont think you are being screwed as it stands, but we are getting dripfed the details.
if your response is 'you are rovers fans with no stadium you arent allowed ask these things' its a bizarrly childish attitude.
charles thompsin is at least trying to honestly answer the questions, you are just reverting to bitter gypo mode
Must further note that same questions, which interest all EL fans, are now regarded as pathetic. And that charlesthompson seems to be the only boez fan here who can answer said questions without being petty.
Rovers fans can pose these questions because we have been through this. It is not "sniping". Personally I think its a tremendous deal ON PAPER. Long way to go though.
To indulge you: The fans didnt lose Milltown or Tallaght.
KOH
I wonder why pettyness and sniping came into it...Quote:
Originally Posted by NY Hoop
Oh, now I remember.Quote:
Originally Posted by NY Hoop
You've lost your way.
Correct to an extent, with all due respect any resident of the Dublin 15 area is entitled to have an interest in any proposed development of this scale which potentially could have a negative impact on an already at breaking point road/travel infrastructure.Quote:
Originally Posted by BohsBohsBohs
In fact i'd imagine the residents of D.7 will view a high density proposal for the Dalymount site equally with interest. Thats a large amount of people who may have zero interest in football who may want to obtain as much information as possible, so to try & claim this should be of no interest for anyone outside of the Bohs persuasion is a tad off the mark.
for one if it goes ahead it affects the groundsharing agenda. that is of concern to all dublin teams fans.Quote:
Originally Posted by BohsBohsBohs
you cant come out with the mantra "the home of irish football" every 2 minuites and then tell people its none of our business. and besides, a fan of which club started the thread....
didnt take long for the average bozo to become miserable again. go back to abusing your manager, leave this discussion to those of us with an interest in promoting the league and new ways to improve facilities
WE ARE NOT HAVING A GO YOU BITTER DIPSHíT. we are asking for clarity on certain aspects of the deal. if you dont want to share this info, log off.Quote:
Originally Posted by BohsBohsBohs
scientific proof you cannot have an intelligent discussion about football on here without some d7 clown ruining it with whining.
how so, all you have done is direct the thread into Rovers v Bozos, rather than the questions at hand?Quote:
Originally Posted by BohsBohsBohs
go back and stew on gypoweb ffs
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roverstillidie
If you are honest RTID you will admit that YOU (and to a lesser extent NY Hoop) started the Rovers V Bohs bickering.
Almost every post from you on this thread has a random dig or insult at Bohs/bohs fans not to mention loads of the l-know-it-all b*llocks you regularly come out with.
Now you are whinging when some of your own sh!t is thrown back at you - typical you I have to say.
Anybody who has asked a straight question has been given a straight answer or at least an attempt at a straight answer. But that's not good enough for you.
If you want a mesageboad insult-a-thon then fine, there's loads of ammo on Irelands Most Famous RUC-Lovin Homeless Hooligan Hoops. I'm sure the mods will shut the thread down in due course. If you want to discuss issues of interest to all football fans, as you claim you do, then stick to the topic.
And don't give me the " It's only football banter" crap either because you can give it but you can't take it.
Does anyone know what Bohs intend to do with the €27m - it would be great to see them build facilities like the astro park which would show off the club in a positive light and generate a regular revenue stream for the club (which could be used to finance the playing side). I trust that the members will not use any of the capital to try and buy success as it will only result in inflated wages and rapidly run down the clubs assets.
There is a lot of discussion around the 'spending' of this money (IF we get our hands on it) on the Bohs MB. There are many suggestions at this point as on how to spend the windfall, however I would seriously hope that the club do not start to pay players willy nilly exhorbitant wages if and when we do move to the new stadium.Quote:
Originally Posted by Forever Dreamin
Most of the suggestions seem to be around capital expenditure furthering our income streams and creating funds with which we can improve our squad in the years ahead. If you think about it, the annual expenditure for league winning sides in this league is probably about €2m. For Bohs to give ourselves a chance of winning the league (which most Bohs supporters want!) we will need to match what the likes of Shels, Cork, Drogheda are spending and bringing in a quality of coach that is just that bit more over what is currently coaching in the eL and players to match.
From our squad, there are probably only four players that would stand a chance of getting onto any of the aformentioned sides and Derry City IMO (Joxer, Farrelly - if he'd get his finger out of his hole! - Wardy and Kevin Hunt. In saying that we would have to also get rid of a plethora of players. Anyway, I digress.
To me the most important thing the club can do with some of the money is to start up an Academy, link it in with Blanchardstown IT and develop players ourselves who would also have a qualification if things didn't work out for them. The very best could be sold on to teams in bigger leagues and the best of the rest could be given contracts at Bohs.
You've probably guessed, but there is no real 'plan' as of yet and probably won't be. Suffice to say that of the downpayment of €2m a lot of that will do toward reducing our debt and God knows what else the board have lined up for the rest.
My answer to that question is that there is a pie in the sky element to all Bohs opinions on what we shoud do with the money. But at least when you have money you have options. I'll list out the options that are most popular with Bohs fans in order of how popular they are at the moment.Quote:
Originally Posted by Forever Dreamin
1. Become the Ajax of Ireland by investing the money in top quality youth structures and facilities eventually reaping the rewards on the pitch and making the money back in transfers. Dominate the league on and off over the long term.
2. Invest the money like an investment banker would, property, stocks and shares etc. Try to get a regular yeild off the lump sum which will be spent on trying to win trophies, running the football club and having a secure future.
3. Get in a load of top players and make the CL group stages. Then we will be the Rosenborg of Ireland who strangles everybody else and dominates like a colossos blah blah. (this one just refuses to die with some people)
4. P!ss around with the money signing players like Glen Crowe on even more undeserved wages than he is on now. Drive the wage spiral in the league ever higher so it damages all clubs around us. Win loads of trophies by having all the good players in the league and lord it over everybody else. And then when the money is gone, go back to the normal p!sspot existance we all have at the moment except in our hard-to-get-to ground in Blanch. In 20 years time, when property prices out there are high enough, do the same again and move to Athlone.
Personally speaking my dream would be option one but I would settle for option 2 without any arguements but knowing what I know about the Bohs board and the general members I reckon option 4 is a real possibility.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vitruvian Man
Hopefully 1 or 2, option 4 will not only kill Bohs but kill the league if other clubs try to compete and forget reality! ANyway best of luck to Bohs
Why are public stadiums in Ireland almost alwasy built far away from public transport? Other countries build next to train stations & such...
Pete, the train station is about a 20 minute walk away surely that's not too far for people to walk? I'm not familiar with the bus infrastructure though, it seems that the 37 or 39 drops off about a 5 minute walk from the site. There are also a multitude of houses going up in the immediate vicinity of the site which you would imagine would need better public transport.
Let's not forget, this stadium will not be built for at least another 5 years (more if you listen to the Rovers supporters on this MB) - ample time for Dublin Bus to increase its service to the area. Not to forget that the proposed new Metro route is to stop at Porterstown - 5 minute walk from the site.
Yes access is an issue, but I feel it's being overplayed at the moment due to the fact that we will not be in Diswellstown for at least 5 years.
By the time the stadium is built there will be adequate public transport and the area will be just as built up as phibsboro is!!
The nearest 37 stop is a 15 minute walk away. The nearest 39 stop is 25 minutes walk away unless you take a short cut and walk down the M50!! Despite the huge growth in the area over the years Dublin Bus were very slow to increase their service.
But as already been pointed out long way to go yet.
BTW Joan Burton is holding a public information meeting next thursday where the proposed new stadium will be one of the issues.
KOH
I would be nervous about this point. How much of setting up a youth acadamy involves having cash and how much involves having the right people? Building a top training ground with all the facilities would be a help but would be no guarentee of underage success. The coaches, not the facilities, would be important here and I would be nervous of building a white elephant.Quote:
Originally Posted by Vitruvian Man
I was reading the other day that Celtic, a club who have a pretty successful youth set up, invest about £1.5m a year in their youth set up and that's without any decent facilities to go along with them. Rangers on the other hand have top class facilities but lag behind Celtic in terms of youth development. You're completely correct Bald Student. Also the outlay of having either of both will soak up Bohs €26m in a decade or two. Bohs fans must remember our proximity to Britain and the fact that we live in the shadow of the EPL. They will not break this dominance and I think their hopes and dreams of future dominance based on an academy model are a bit pie in the sky.