Republic of Ireland V Bulgaria - Wednesday, 18th November 2020 - Nations League

The thing he is not gonna change the 4-3-3,

i would go with a different team at all from what we have...
I would go with a 3-5-2 squad

----------------------------------------Randolph-----------------------------

Long --------------Clark-------------------Oshea-----

Horgan------------------Cullen---------O'dowda----------------- Manning

------------------------------------ Brady------------------------------

-----------------------Byrne----------------------------------------------

--------------------------------------------Collins-----------------------

O'Dowda has to take responsabilities

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Originally Posted by Paddy Garcia

I don't think Kenny has the wit to play Cullen - even though he was MOM against the same opposition when given his chance. Guess he may have no choice now.

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I will play Cullen, tidy player

to have a go at a team. I've not seen the point so far but no positive tests today makes me feel we might be close enough to give it a crack.

I think it's important to be more pragmatic than we've been to date. We are better than this version of Bulgaria and retaining the ball will be important, but at the same time there needs to be more purpose to our play. We also need to make more of set pieces. Bulgaria's 4th or 5th choice goalkeeper is presumably so regarded for a reason. Any dead ball in their half is an opportunity to send the centre backs up to test out his ability under high balls, and the organisation of the makeshift defence in front of him.

I actually ended up with 3 different ways we could play

------------ Randolph ----------
Christie O'Shea Duffy Manning
------------ Lenihan ------------
----- Cullen ------- Brady ------
------------- Byrne -------------
------- Collins ---- Burke ------


------------ Randolph ----------
----- O'Shea Duffy Clark ------
Christie Cullen Brady Manning
------------- Byrne -------------
------- Collins ---- Burke ------


------------ Randolph ----------
----- O'Shea Duffy Clark ------
Christie Cullen Brady Manning
----O'Dowda ------ Byrne -----
------------- Collins ------------

They're all variations of a theme, but the middle one is my preference.

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Originally Posted by backstothewall

We should be able to dominate this game. Anything less than a victory should see Kenny replaced.

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he is gonna stay for at least 20 games or so

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Originally Posted by Bielsa´s irish

he is gonna stay for at least 20 games or so

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Bulgaria team has12 international goals all together 9 scored for the 4 forwards, will play all from start I think

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Originally Posted by centre mid

I think he's from Ballybrack direction.

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Oh sh*t. I've told the whole road he is a local lad.

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Originally Posted by Diggs246

Oh sh*t. I've told the whole road he is a local lad.

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Close enough for government work.

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Originally Posted by paul_oshea

Bulgaria missing their captain, left back and another, but 3 starters added to ones already missing. Wont be calling anyone up either.

Ah Ireland can't not win now.

Can they? :D

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Eh we, non? Still not fully buying into the revolution it seems.

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Originally Posted by liamoo11

Is it capable of less though? Byrne is first league of Ireland player in donkeys to play competitive international senior football for Ireland. Evan ferguson will move on to Brighton and league of Ireland apologists can say the league of Ireland produced him when he plays for Ireland. If Sinclair Armstrong plays for Ireland will people say the league developed him cause he played for rovers B. Bazuna played for rovers A and will play for Ireland so the league developed him.

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What on earth is a League of Ireland apologist? Even the league's biggest promoters acknowledge it's below the standard it should be. The fact guys like Ferguson and Armstrong have progressed after a few years in the LOI underage leagues should be something to point to as a positive, no?

I love the total lack of respect shown to Bulgaria here!

This has actually been quite a tight group. Only one game so far decided by more than one goal (Finalnd 2-0 Bulgaria). Wales laboured to a narrow, late win against them last month, only decided by a freakishly good goal in the last minute. With the players we have missing I'd have Bulgaria favourites.

Bielsa is right imho. Kenny has a lot of time left, even if some have already lost faith.

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Originally Posted by BonnieShels

Eh we, non? Still not fully buying into the revolution it seems.

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Nothing to do with that BS. I often switch between they and we, depending who I'm talking with/to usually.

This might be a controversial opinion but would it better to drop to C, regroup and qualify for Euro 2024 via Nations League playoffs ?

Tonight's game I would go with wing backs I think Christie can get the Bulgarians down the flanks and Collins is good in the air. It might be more direct but for once pragmatism wins out over passing it about.




Backtowalls XI makes sense for this type of game and Parrot on for the last 30 to nick a goal after Collins runs himself into the ground.
Randolph
----- O'Shea Duffy Clark ------
Christie Cullen Brady Manning
----O'Dowda ------ Byrne -----
------------- Collins ------------

Christie would do ok against this side, but at the same time I'd rather he was left behind so to speak enough with O'Shea and Manning there to get his chance. General sentiment I agree with though, pragmatism and sensibility order of the day.

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Originally Posted by Stuttgart88

I love the total lack of respect shown to Bulgaria here!

This has actually been quite a tight group. Only one game so far decided by more than one goal (Finalnd 2-0 Bulgaria). Wales laboured to a narrow, late win against them last month, only decided by a freakishly good goal in the last minute. With the players we have missing I'd have Bulgaria favourites.

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I don't think there's any lack of respect. For me memories of the golden generation of Hristo Stoichkov, Yordan Lechkov, Krasimir Balakov et al means they will always be regarded as a strong footballing nation. But people can see what has happened to them in this window. If you think our withdrawals have been bad look at theirs! Of the 11 who started against Wales they only have 5 left.

RB Cicinho (4 caps)
CB Dimitrov (11 caps/1 goal)
CM Karabelyov (6 caps)
CM Malinov (17 caps)
LW Yomov (4 caps/2 goals)
CF Kraev (21 caps/3 goals)

We have been weakened by all this, but they are getting it much worse. There is the potential for more positive tests for both sides today, but as it stands we have to be strong favourites.

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Originally Posted by ltfc_2004

This might be a controversial opinion but would it better to drop to C, regroup and qualify for Euro 2024 via Nations League playoffs ?

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Indo saying that League C means €400k less per season, which for a cash-starved FAI is important. FAI also seeking a new corporate sponsor.

But that aside, I think League C would be better for the team's transition. If you can't win games in League C then you're clearly not going to win games in B either. Creating a winning culture and habit is important. With the next NL "assisting" Euro qualification (as opposed to it only remotely assisting WC22 qualification), being in League C isn't a disaster. Scotland qualified as a C team via the orthodox league C play off path, Hungary qualified as a League C team via the league A play off path. In fact if you look at Scotland there is genuine euphoria there, yet Steve Clarke had a poor start, and even their recent results haven't been inspiring - if taken out of context. 0-0 and 1-1 but two wins on pens, a 2-1 away win over a complete Czech B squad, including a stand-in manager & coaching team. Heavy defeat to Kazakhstan not long ago.

Our results under Kenny have been 1-1, 0-0 (open goal miss by Hourihane), 0-0, 1-0 defeat (suicidal throw by randolph), 3-0 defeat to England, 1-0 defeat. It took time for Clarke and even then their results have been barely better than ours and yet he's now a national hero. I'm only saying this to say how capricious football can be. Hourihane scores a routine chance and Randolph doesn't throw the ball straight to Pukki and we are all having a very different conversation.

That's not to say I'm convinced by Kenny. I haven't agreed with some selections and I think his media personality is terribly unconvincing. But let's see where this gets to. I don't have great hopes for the WC campaign but who knows what the world will look like next year.

Totally agree I watched Scotland v Czech B and the Czechs should of won the game, they were calling for Clarkes head in september! Football is fickle as we know and todays Hero is tomorrow's traitor in club football !

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Originally Posted by ltfc_2004

This might be a controversial opinion but would it better to drop to C, regroup and qualify for Euro 2024 via Nations League playoffs ?

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That's two nations' leagues' time, though. We can get relegated next time and execute that plan. Or we could drop this time, get promoted again, and have the worst of both worlds!

Interesting interview with Hourihane: https://www.the42.ie/conor-hourihane-5-5269870-Nov2020/

It's fair to say he loves playing for Ireland, but it does touch on some of the difficulties of playing games in a pandemic and the outside stresses on players that we don't see or hear about a lot.

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Originally Posted by John83

That's two nations' leagues' time, though. We can get relegated next time and execute that plan. Or we could drop this time, get promoted again, and have the worst of both worlds!

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Hi John - This edition is the 2020/2021 and the following one 2022/2023 which includes Euro 2024 playoffs

Yeah, the first campaign was Euro 2020, this one is nothing, and the next one is Euro 2024 alright.

The play-offs will probably be tweaked though as League D is much smaller than before (half the size) and was won this year by the Faroes and Gibraltar. Would UEFA really have those two play off for a finals spot? Maybe they could just say Leagues A, B and C get a finals spot, and then there's 20 qualifiers plus the host (Germany).

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Originally Posted by pineapple stu

Yeah, the first campaign was Euro 2020, this one is nothing, and the next one is Euro 2024 alright.

The play-offs will probably be tweaked though as League D is much smaller than before (half the size) and was won this year by the Faroes and Gibraltar. Would UEFA really have those two play off for a finals spot? Maybe they could just say Leagues A, B and C get a finals spot, and then there's 20 qualifiers plus the host (Germany).

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That works with 10 Group Winners/10 Runners up and 3 play off spots or maybe include Group D winners in with C so its C Group winners ranked 1-4 - C1 Group Winner v winners of playoff between C4 and D2 and C2 v winners of C3 and D1

True, although it sounds very simple for UEFA, so that's probably definitely not what's going to happen :)

I don't think we should set out to lose tonight, but I do think there would be up sides (and down sides - such as the money Stutts mentioned) from being relegated.

Neil O'Riordan tweeting that Kenny wanted to call up Michael Duffy but his international switch hasn't been ratified yet. I can't go onto social media at work so can't add the source.

it was pointed out on YBIG that relegation to League C means we will be in Pot 4 or 5 for the Euro 2024 Qualifiers.
Staying in League B means we'll be in 2, 3, or 4.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by backstothewall

I don't think there's any lack of respect. For me memories of the golden generation of Hristo Stoichkov, Yordan Lechkov, Krasimir Balakov et al means they will always be regarded as a strong footballing nation. But people can see what has happened to them in this window. If you think our withdrawals have been bad look at theirs! Of the 11 who started against Wales they only have 5 left.

RB Cicinho (4 caps)
CB Dimitrov (11 caps/1 goal)
CM Karabelyov (6 caps)
CM Malinov (17 caps)
LW Yomov (4 caps/2 goals)
CF Kraev (21 caps/3 goals)

We have been weakened by all this, but they are getting it much worse. There is the potential for more positive tests for both sides today, but as it stands we have to be strong favourites.

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Nothing like a good dose of reality to wake up the "hard done" by.

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Originally Posted by Stuttgart88

Indo saying that League C means €400k less per season, which for a cash-starved FAI is important. FAI also seeking a new corporate sponsor.

But that aside, I think League C would be better for the team's transition. If you can't win games in League C then you're clearly not going to win games in B either. Creating a winning culture and habit is important. With the next NL "assisting" Euro qualification (as opposed to it only remotely assisting WC22 qualification), being in League C isn't a disaster. Scotland qualified as a C team via the orthodox league C play off path, Hungary qualified as a League C team via the league A play off path. In fact if you look at Scotland there is genuine euphoria there, yet Steve Clarke had a poor start, and even their recent results haven't been inspiring - if taken out of context. 0-0 and 1-1 but two wins on pens, a 2-1 away win over a complete Czech B squad, including a stand-in manager & coaching team. Heavy defeat to Kazakhstan not long ago.

Our results under Kenny have been 1-1, 0-0 (open goal miss by Hourihane), 0-0, 1-0 defeat (suicidal throw by randolph), 3-0 defeat to England, 1-0 defeat. It took time for Clarke and even then their results have been barely better than ours and yet he's now a national hero. I'm only saying this to say how capricious football can be. Hourihane scores a routine chance and Randolph doesn't throw the ball straight to Pukki and we are all having a very different conversation.

That's not to say I'm convinced by Kenny. I haven't agreed with some selections and I think his media personality is terribly unconvincing. But let's see where this gets to. I don't have great hopes for the WC campaign but who knows what the world will look like next year.

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8 or 8.9 mil or something -> https://www.independent.ie/sport/soc...-39760101.html

The Euros too, youd imagine would have been a big hole to fill already...

David Kelly in today's Indo:

"He (the Bulgarian manager) is the lucky one. His squad has been shorn of a mere 10 players through injury and Covid-relkated concerns. Kenny is down to an eye watering 25 players all told".

So I'm not sure what version of reality ""they are getting it much worse" comes from.

And I'm not sure who's feeling "hard done by" or who is asleep here to be honest. It simply can't be denied that we have had a ridiculous number of withdrawals. Only a crank would argue that that doesn't offer some mitigation to the run of form.

Paul's whole post just reads like a miserable and quite typical attempt to divide people here into camps. The naive dreamers and the hardened realists. I think such division only exists in Paul's head.

There's lots of things that only exist in my head, a euphoria of sorts.

I still maintain Kenny's been lucky from the other side of it. No pressure. Playing loads of players with little retribution from the outcome or how they play. hes had a chance to fast track u21 players into the squad and side with little negativity. Its bought him time, even if its time with players he wouldn't necessarily have wanted time with. Hes found out who isnt ready without sacrificing anything massive. He knows the problems we have now. It all bodes well for the WC qualifiers in March I feel. Once he knows that we need to compensate by changing formation to give us the best chance of scoring as we dont have a finisher, or a "false 9" now McG is gone.

Every cloud and all that....COD out.

https://www.rte.ie/sport/soccer/2020...bulgaria-game/

Quote:

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Originally Posted by ltfc_2004

That works with 10 Group Winners/10 Runners up and 3 play off spots or maybe include Group D winners in with C so its C Group winners ranked 1-4 - C1 Group Winner v winners of playoff between C4 and D2 and C2 v winners of C3 and D1

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Btw, this NL qualifiers is important i thought - unless my info is old - as the best two group winners are guaranteed a play-off in the World cup.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2022_F...ication_(UEFA)

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Originally Posted by Razors left peg

I agree with this 10000% but I cant see Jack Taylor coming and taking his place :D

Again I agree that Duffy should be replaced but with Egan, Coleman, Stephens and Doherty already out then it wont happen for this game.

We've discussed the keeper situation before but I had a thought about it this morning. When Guardiola took over City the 1st thing he did was get rid of Joe Hart. There was media outcry at the time that you couldnt do this to "Englands Number 1", but Guardiola wanted to play out from the back and Hart couldnt play that type of game. Id imagine Kenny would like to do similar and get Kelleher into the teams ASAP for distribution reasons. I think if he had gotten some good early results, beating Slovakia especially, we might have already seen Randolph being replaced to have a look at other keepers but theres no way he can do that when Randolph is making saves that keep us in games that we are not scoring goals in, and since none of the 3 keepers in the squad at the moment are playing 1st team football nobody can point to any club form as justification for being in the team and so the status quo with Randolph continues. I absolutely think that this time next year either Kelleher or Bazunu will be 1st choice though.

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I wouldn't have Kelleher anywhere near the squad. O'Hara, Banuzu and Travers are all better goalies than him. Lad looks like an outfield player having a go in goals any time i've seen him.

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Originally Posted by Kingdom

Btw, this NL qualifiers is important i thought - unless my info is old - as the best two group winners are guaranteed a play-off in the World cup.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2022_F...ication_(UEFA)

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You're right.

The two best group winners in the NL 20/21 (this edition) that have not finished in the top two of their group of European WCQ, based on the NL ranking, will go into the play offs.

You would expect these teams to come from League C all things being equal.

Only 2.5 weeks 'til the WCQ draw; December 7th @ 5pm Dublin time.

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Originally Posted by Stuttgart88

Neil O'Riordan tweeting that Kenny wanted to call up Michael Duffy but his international switch hasn't been ratified yet. I can't go onto social media at work so can't add the source.

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I assume McEneff had already switched then? I haven’t kept track of his international ambitions but I know he played underage for the north.

Yeah, the switch was only completed about two weeks ago

Wasn't Rice's switch to England completed basically instantly? Can see where their priorities lie.

This could be Duffy's best ever chance to get a run in a competitive game. Really have to feel for him

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Originally Posted by DCWA

I assume McEneff had already switched then? I haven’t kept track of his international ambitions but I know he played underage for the north.

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I spoke to someone tangentially involved in the international setup at a Rovers-Dundalk match early 2019 about Jordan and Aaron. Bit hazy now, but I took it that he had already switched at that point. Obviously Aaron mentioned that it only came through 2 weeks ago but he was waiting ages for it.

Madness Duffy has had to wait over 2 years, absolutely taking the ****. Genuinely would have had an opportunity to play tonight and contribute.

We sorted Rice in 3 weeks. Imagine if Rice’s change still wasn’t processed by us now, imagine the uproar...

I hope Mallon’s change isn’t processed until Duffy’s is...

The Duffy situation seems completely unfair, I can't imagine what possible reason there could be for the hold up. This might be his best - maybe only - chance to feature for Ireland and he is being denied it.

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Originally Posted by Stuttgart88

David Kelly in today's Indo:

"He (the Bulgarian manager) is the lucky one. His squad has been shorn of a mere 10 players through injury and Covid-relkated concerns. Kenny is down to an eye watering 25 players all told".

So I'm not sure what version of reality ""they are getting it much worse" comes from.

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It's not easy to keep track of the comings and goings, but David Kelly is certainly wrong to describe the Bulgarian boss as "the lucky one"

Captain Vasil Bozhikov, goalkeeper Hristiyan Vassilev and full-back Dimitar Velkovski have all tested positive for coronavirus in the latest round of PCR testing. Bulgaria were already without Georgi Terziev, Martin Raynov, Nikolay Mihailov, Kiril Despodov, Plamen Iliev, Georgi Kostadinov, Todor Nedelev, Anton Nedyalkov, Ismail Isa, Georgi Georgiev, Dominik Yankov and Georgi Yomov.

In addition Georgi Milanov & Aleksandar Tonev, experienced players with 43 & 29 caps respectively, aren't in the squad as they find themselves without a club.

We are missing Matt Doherty, John Egan, Séamus Coleman, Enda Stevens, Derrick Williams, James McClean, Jeff Hendrick, Jayson Molumby, Alan Browne, James McCarthy, Harry Arter, Adam Idah, Callum Robinson & Aaron Connolly. But we've been left with enough seasoned international players to form the spine of a team. Darren Randolph, Shane Duffy, Cyrus Christie, Ciaran Clark, Robbie Brady and Conor Hourihane are all still there. These are all guys who have played in the Premier League (overated as it is, it's still one of the highest quality divisions in the world). Some of them might not have been great for Ireland recently, but they are not bad players.

Getting better performances out of them is something I really hope Stephen Kenny is capable of doing. Because that's his job.

Edit: Add O'Dowda to our missing list.

I dont know if its just an irrational feeling but I think it will come together tonight and we will get a win. We've played relatively well, England game apart. We're creating enough chances and just have to continue do the right things.

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Originally Posted by centre mid

I dont know if its just an irrational feeling but I think it will come together tonight and we will get a win. We've played relatively well, England game apart. We're creating enough chances and just have to continue do the right things.

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I think when the opposition are so poor, regardless of anything, there is always a chance.

Tonight we could win 3-0, draw 0-0 or lose 0-1... honestly who knows