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If Kelly is wanted by England, O'Neill should tell Southgate that it is racist as all Catholic players with Irish names are ours and ours only. He should also demand a gentleman's agreement whereby all players who represented us between the ages of 17 and 21 should not be targeted. This will ensure Kelly remains with us.
Would Liam kelly have got much of a chance with Martin O’ Neill in any case ? In important / qualifiers games like .
I would rather see Browne or Hourihane get the nod in any such role ahead of Kelly. At least I think I thunk that before this anyway...Quote:
Originally Posted by seanfhear
Good luck to him.
At least it wasn’t drawn out like the Grealish situation
Is this related to your hunch! ?Quote:
Originally Posted by IsMiseSean
https://m.independent.ie/sport/socce...-36734289.html
If that’s true then o’neills comments have been pure reckless.Now where can we find a fella to ask him to explain himself?....
Good. I said he had come off after 60 minutes for Reading at the weekend after scoring. And the England idea is a bit unrealistic. Really poor communication on his part though. And MON did a good job of testing his commitment publicly.
Don't you think he was testing the commitment? I think if Kelly has pulled put a few times then he has cast doubt himself. MON has sought to drive Kelly one way or there other with his comments. No harm. They won't be reckless if Kelly is totally committed. Being at the mercy of Jack Grealish somewhat must linger large.Quote:
Originally Posted by Fizzer
Possibly yeah, but if so,is it not another example of O’Neill placing his inflated ego over the good of the country?The man has a humility deficit. Who knows what comments yer man is after getting in the last few days.Could end up putting him off altogether.I’d rather O’Neill wasn’t ‘testing’ young players commitment on my behalf.
Do you attribute him with that level of awareness strategy here ? Is that why he was still speaking of Declan Rice as a potential England player til the other day, with the fella in the country to play for us ?Quote:
Originally Posted by Olé Olé
This is all total nonsense. We have no reason to doubt MON when he said that he tried to ring Kelly a number of times and only received a text back. If Kelly was serious about still playing for Ireland he could have had the manner to pick up the damn phone.
Now having said all that, if he is injured and MON has just thrown him under the bus that's a whole other conversation..... maybe he wanted a different story floating around this week so he wouldn't get any more questions about the Stoke thing etc (tinfoil hat is firmly on coming up with that theory)
O’Neill has thrown him under the bus whatever way you look at it.
Yeah but if Kelly is acting the p***k then its deservedQuote:
Originally Posted by Fizzer
no new quotes from player or managers in that article.Quote:
Originally Posted by Diggs246
No,we’re too short of resources to have him publicly disclosing communication details and speculating in the way he has.Its bad leadership and it shows all the other players, and potential players that O’Neill can’t be trusted,he’ll sell you out if he starts getting media heat.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Martin O'Neill
The way i see it there are 3 possibilities here.Quote:
Originally Posted by Fizzer
Either...
1. Kelly indicated via text that he wasn't available and gave not wanting to tie himself to us as a reason for his withdrawal
2. Kelly indicated via text that he wasn't available, giving a different reason, be it injury or something else.
3. Kelly pulled out giving no reason at all.
Unless and until we know what was actually in the text i don't feel it fair to cast judgement on O'Neill's comments, or Kelly's motives.
If it was scenario 1 O'Neill has been quite restrained. If there is an issue about him wanting to keep his options with England open I don't want him anywhere near the squad. We are a nation with a proud footballing history. I don't see why a cap for our senior international team should be equivalent to a late night booty call after the girl he actually wanted the shift with got in a taxi home on her own.
In scenario 2 O'Neill has been a little trigger happy to say the least. He has perhaps seen parallels with the Grealish situation and got the wrong end of the stick. On the other the player may well be under pressure from his agent/club not to commit to anything. By saying what he has said O'Neill will take a bit of heat in the short term, but he has forced the issue and has headed off the possibility of another year long saga as happened with Grealish.
If it's scenario 3 O'Neill is more justified in filling in the blanks. There may still be a way back, but Kelly really needs to be more professional and return his missed calls. He's still young enough at 22 that this can be put down to inexperience, but he would need to learn the lessons of this.
One thing is for sure, we've not heard the last of this.
Too short of resources my hole...that's a ridiculous argument that people put out in times like this and it's total bulls*it. We've plenty of other players if it comes to pass that Liam Kelly doesn't want to represent Ireland, in the exact same way we had plenty of other players in place of Jack Grealish.Quote:
Originally Posted by Fizzer
The article makes complete sense, the good news... with a bit of diplomacy we can get him on board which would be fantastic and he brings a degree of creativity we have lost with Wes' retirement. Don't worry about blame, I am sure it will be sorted out behind closed doors.
Delicately put Nige but in relation to your hole,you’re talking out of it,as standard.You’ve missed the point that the way O’Neill deals with Kelly could affect the decisions of potential players.
Well, it's been said many times before, but if a player makes a decision on their international future based on who is the manager, then they're not worth the time or effort.Quote:
Originally Posted by Fizzer
This isn't club football.
I don't see anything in that article that isn't consistent with Kelly sending a text message mentioning his desire not to be permnently tied to us.Quote:
Originally Posted by gastric
The term "primary motivation" jumps out at me. What was his secondary motivation??Quote:
Independent.ie understands that Kelly's primary motivation during this international break was to focus on his efforts to be fully fit for Reading's final eight games of the season
We love a bit of drama don't we. In a week where we have quite a few lads making full debuts we waste time talking about the one that's not there and I'm as guilty as anyone.... I still haven't even managed to figure out how to watch the game as its not being shown anywhere in the States!
I appreciate this is a delicate subject, but let's not resort to personal insults.
I don't forensically read newspaper articles or situations tbh, I think it's an age thing! I feel the article gives a logical explanation for his non appearance and nowhere does it mention a desire to actually represent England over us. What I will say is, if there a desire to make this work on both sides, it will happen. It is also good to see his commitment to helping Reading avoid relegation!Quote:
Originally Posted by backstothewall
So we have textgate, it didn't take long to be back at it now did it :) with again regrettably MONs communication to the press under early scrutiny again.Quote:
Originally Posted by backstothewall
If, if, that lad (despite making a right balls of this, granted) has not indicated that his reasons are England related, why on earth would MON see fit to introduce that to the mix as conjecture.
His communication failings grow very f*cking tedious at this stage.
I agree it's a big if. It also seems unlikely that either party would reveal the contents of that message so i suspect we'll not find out exactly what was said for quite some time.Quote:
Originally Posted by CraftyToePoke
As i said there is a possibility that O'Neill was trying to force the issue. It's idle speculation, but that's the case with anyone who hasn't seen the contents of that text. If that's the case he has been very effective, or it could be that O'Neill has done something very odd. That's the thing with O'Neill. You're never quite sure. The fact that he was Brian Clough's captain suggest to me that there is a least an element of the unpredictability in his actions being very deliberate.
Maybe Liam Kelly realised that he is not physically big enough to play Martin O’ Neill’s style of football and attempted to go missing to avoid embarrassment all round = Plan = Backfired
How are Liam's Grandmothers ?
Unfairness I’d find it hard to play for Martin O Neill’s style......but that is because I ain’t no good .
What a load of total nonsense. Who cares how many times it's been said, it's still ridiculous. Of course players are influenced to declare for us/or not to/or to wait, based on the manager, sure they're even influenced by who's the assistant manager. if they're good enough players, they are worth the effort.Quote:
Originally Posted by nigel-harps1954
You are right when you point out that it's not club football, and that's exactly why O'Neill needs to stop treating the job like he's at a club, which can buy and sell players.
He needs to cop on, shut up and get on with trying to win games instead of playing schoolyard games.
O’Neill needs to realise / be told that the Ireland Mangers Job is a bigger Job than Him . He is just the Current Custodian .
Confidence is a good thing but arrogance is no good to man or beast .
where exactly is the MO'N arrogance in relation to Liam Kelly (the subject of this discussion)??Quote:
Originally Posted by seanfhear
More the personality of Martin O Neill’s generally .Quote:
Originally Posted by jbyrne
If he has interacted with Liam Kelly as he has done in other situations as Ireland Manager then how do we know how the chemistry worked .
Martin has confidence but can also be arrogant . Martin not declaring himself quickly as un-available for some of these jobs he has been touted for is an example of his arrogance .
I could not see a player of Kelly's physical stature getting much of a look in for Competitive matches under Martin O’ Neill . Maybe Kelly was correct to ‘Swerve ‘ O’Neill’s call .
listening to Keith Andrews on last night's Off The Ball podcast, and they mentioned the B international against Nottingham Forest under Trapattoni where he played his heart out to get into the senior squad, and they mentioned that Sean Scannell played in that game and that he was talking about changing allegiances to the North.
It occured to me that, right now, there's as much evidence that Scannell will change allegiance as there is that Kelly will, yet we're talking about both like they will definitely happen.
Quote:
Originally Posted by backstothewall
On YBIG tonight :
Kevin Palmer speaking on ‘Game On’ yesterday, confirmed that he knows Liam Kelly’s family / agent quite well, and says that at no point was MON told that Kelly was considering his England options.
Palmer also says that Reading didn’t want Kelly featuring due to a swollen ankle, and that he doesn’t see Kelly featuring in the current Ireland set-up with our current style.
Dunphy says MON needs to go and meet Kelly.
This segment begins at about 17 minutes in: http://podcast.rasset.ie/podcasts/au...38400_232_.mp3
Okay so he wasn't told that. So answer your phone, pal?
Which I did say, or words to that effect a few posts back, about dealing with the situation respectfully & LKs failure to manage that.Quote:
Originally Posted by Olé Olé
Its six and two threes here but justifiable eyes on MONs decision making and communication too, already, again.
The journalist who is fighting Liams corner said something that tells me all we need to know about the players attitude. It was along the lines of Liam doesnt think he would have played if he went to Turkey. Big swinging mickey.. You go to try get selected not on the basis of some guarantee. I think MON has saved us a lot of hassle ala Grealish and exposed this guy.
I would say that this camp offered an exponentially greater amount of benefits to someone like Kelly than a normal training camp for a couple of days in the lead up to a competitive qualifier. His failure/unwillingness to recognise this is a bit of an indictment on him, assuming all of the above is accurate.
FWIW Kelly misses out in Paul Clement's first squad