Derby at home to Brentford this afternoon. Big clash of the Irish in midfield with Hendrick, Douglas and Judge all up against one another, with Keogh in defence as well. Brentford winning after half an hour.
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Derby at home to Brentford this afternoon. Big clash of the Irish in midfield with Hendrick, Douglas and Judge all up against one another, with Keogh in defence as well. Brentford winning after half an hour.
Brentford winning that battle as well. Derby forced into playing 4-4-2 with the absence of midfielders Hughes, Thorne, Eustace and Mascarell. Christie not in squad so must be injured. The goal came as a result of Hendrick losing the ball well inside Brentford territory, having done well initially. I think he could have worked harder to get back and make up for his error, possibly an indication of why he's better suited to a three man midfield and how Derby are really struggling without a defensive midfielder to mop things up. Brilliant finish by Pritchard though.
Brentford have had enough chances to win 10 games. By far the better team.
Hendrick, lucky to still be on the pitch after a frustrated lunge, sets up the equaliser with a scuffed shot that rolls perfectly for Bent.
Bit of a wild one alright but yellow was probably about right, though he couldn't have complained if it was red. Just as well, last thing Derby would have needed would be a three game suspension to another midfielder. They were absolutely battered today, if they'd lost by four or five it would have been a fairer reflection.
Brentford were really good.
They were, they seem to be better away from home. I think Derby are making teams look better than they are at the moment too through their own lack of confidence but Brentford were tenacious, and clever and calm in possession. They really bossed the game completely. Only thing they didn't do was kill the game off, and it wasn't due to a lack of chances.
Ok, from an Irish perspective who do we most want to get promoted? Quality over quantity, i.e., I'd prefer a good prospect like Hoban to get promoted over, say, Jon Douglas. Unfair on Douglas who is playing really well but I think you know what I mean.
Put another way, of the Irish players in the mix for promotion, which ones do we think need most to be in the EPL next year?
Arter, Hendrick, Hoban, Hoolahan, Murphy, McGoldrick? I know TOWK liikes Alan Judge.
Hoolahan is a strange one as PL football might see him back on the bench. At this stage of his career we just need him to be playing regularly. He wouldn't necessarily be dropped or anything but Norwich might feel they need an upgrade, based on his expendable status over the past year or two.
Hendrick could do with making the step up for sure at this stage, I think the PL would suit his game and see him develop at a faster rate. We'd learn very quickly if Keogh could be of any use at a high level, I suspect Derby would need better if they were to be competitive.
The automatics are between four now after today and I fully expect Bournemouth to see it through with the fixtures they have. That would leave Norwich, Watford and Middlesbrough fighting it out for one spot. From an Irish perspective, like you say, Watford and Hoban might be the best bet with the Hoolahan situation. In the unlikely event of Bamford declaring, it's unlikely he'll remain at Boro anyway.
Ideally I suppose three from Bournemouth, Derby, Ipswich and Brentford would have been the best result. Mick might even sign another Irish player or two once they've gone up!
Realistically Bournemouth, Norwich/Watford (auto) and Derby (playoffs) might be the best result we could hope for now, although quantity wise Ipswich or Brentford would be ideal, but quality wise questionable.
Was thinking the same about Wes, although this new manager might trust him more.
I'm not pushed if Norwich go up or not. Wes is almost 33 so it's not really going to be hugely beneficial for us. I'd be hoping a team with some young Irish players would get promoted instead.Quote:
Originally Posted by Stuttgart88
Derby faltering again. Thrown away a 1-0 lead at Huddersfield and now trail 3-1. Cyrus Christie came on as a first half sub. The goals were probably all Keogh's fault.
Finished 4-4. Crazy stuff.
Mad stuff alright. With Wolves and Brentford both drawing, that means they only need a win from their remaining games to secure a play-off spot.
Bournemouth may just have blown the title by conceding a last minute penalty to Sheffield Wednesday, 2-2 there.
Yea Bournemouth might miss out on automatic promotion too, they seem to have a harder last two games than
their rivals. However they have the best goal difference, nothing is settled at the top yet.
Swings and roundabouts as Derby hang on precariously to a Playoff place after recently breaking a run of 7 games without winning against relegated Wigan & Blackpool.Quote:
Originally Posted by DeLorean
27 goals conceded in 17 games as Derby falter at the business end - again.
Hopefully Derby, Ipswich or Brentford go up through the Playoffs. Would be nice to see some Irish players in the PL next season.
Keogh has been decent, for the most part, despite their lack of form. The absence of a recognised holding midfielder has killed them, although there were certain matches they'd have expected to win regardless, i.e. Fulham, Birmingham, etc. When you say "falter at the business end - again", what are you getting at? Obviously they faltered in the very last minute of the business end last season, but before that they seemed to be handling the pressure well, finishing third, hammering Brighton in playoff semi and totally dominating the final at Wembley. It's incomparable to the collapse this season which you seem to be doing.
Edit - and how sad it is that you scanned back to page three of this thread to find a quote that you somehow feel is now disproved.
Three points clear with two games to play is hardly precarious.Quote:
Originally Posted by TheOneWhoKnocks
It's actually four points clear and a far superior goal difference. They will need to win one (or draw both) of their two remaining games if either of Wolves or Brentford win both of theirs. On current form you couldn't assume anything but they'll surely have enough (or get lucky with other results!). Precarious definitely too strong a word and I suppose they are unbeaten in their last five and have showed heart to salvage draws from Brentford and Huddersfield, when they looked dead and buried.
As a fan who had to hide behind his sofa for the tail end of several Ireland campaigns, Arsenal's faltering 1989 title run-in and Celtic's limp to the line in 1998, I can only empathise with Derby fans. Rovers' league win under Michael O'Neill too. Chuck, was it Bray who 2-2 at Tallaght late in the season with a deflected late equaliser? I thought that was going to be it! You just know that as soon as the first slip up comes others inevitably follow. Was it Birmingham when they shipped two injury-time goals?
I'd say Bournemouth fans just want to hibernate between games now too. Real life can be just too unbearable for football fans at this stage of the season. At least these guys only have to wait days between games. The Euro 2000 qualifying campaign was nearly too much for me!
Yeah Birmingham was a killer for them and, actually, Watford at home when they led against ten men. A lot of damage had been done by then but a win there and they were back in the mix for automatic big time. You'd never know though, they might be in a better position heading for the playoffs than whoever miss out on automatic. QPR were in pretty poor form going into the playoffs last season.
I'm not implying that Keogh has something to do with Derby conceding 27 goals in 17 games. Just like I am sure you are not implying that Derby's run of 6 clean sheets earlier in the season had something to do with Keogh. Or Derby's lack of a holding midfielder has something to do with their porous defense.Quote:
Originally Posted by DeLorean
Well obviously I was implying that Derby's run of clean sheet had something to do with Keogh, seeing as I said -
I didn't say he was solely responsible but obviously I implied he played his part. I'm sure he played his part in some of the goals they've conceded recently also, but my overriding opinion would be that he was one of the few steadying influences back there at a time when others have had a severe dip in form, Grant, Christie and Forsyth in particular. The bedding in of Albentosa to a new league after losing the very experienced Jake Buxton was also a major factor I would suggest.Quote:
Originally Posted by DeLorean
I'm not sure I understand your final sentence. Obviously any defence is going to be more exposed if their best defensive midfielders are absent? You're hardly disputing this?
I take it you've just accepted that you were spouting nonsense about Derby faltering at the business end - again.
Brentford, Ipswich & Wolves are winning. Derby are losing. Derby under pressure.
Will they miss Darren Bent up front?
Derby 2-0 down to Millwall after Keogh conceded a penalty.
Derby back in it after a free-kick from Tom Ince. The industrious Conor Sammon won the free-kick.
Derby 3-1 down to Millwall after another penalty; conceded by Jeff Hendrick and won by Alan Dunne.
Looks like it'll go down to the last day if Brentford keep winning.
Aiden O'Brien concedes a penalty and Derby are back in it again!
Hendrick equalises!
Keogh bailed out again.
30 goals conceded in 18 games is not promotion form but Chris Martin bails out Derby's defence again with his 21st goal of the season.
Derby's promotion effort falters again with 3 goals conceded against a relegation threatened team but their destiny is still in their own hands.
I'm actually heading over to Derby next wkd so will go to final game. A draw will do them for playoffs now and take it from there I suppose. I think Thorne might be back for it or at least the playoffs which would be a big boost.
Chris Martin scored a penalty to pull it back to 3-2... This is what bailed out Derby's defence... again? Funny, Martin has been injured for most of the period where Derby's defence actually needed bailing out. He scored the vast majority of those goals when their defence were on top of things.
To be fair, DeLorean..
- You shrugged it off when I said a month and a half ago that I worried for Derby's promotion aspirations and contrasted their form with that of Watford, Bournemouth, Middlesbrough and Norwich. A month and a half later, Watford are promoted and the other three are in the automatic promotion mix and Derby need a win just to secure a Playoff place.
- In the same post a month and a half ago I expressed concern about Derby's (lack of) defensive solidity to your annoyance and a month and a half later, they are still leaking goals like a sieve.
- I don't know why you keep insinuating that the absence of Thorne & Eustace is affecting them. They have played a combined 17 times this season and Derby have done fine without them.
- I said last year that they do not have a strong enough defence to match their attacking strengths and it cost them; just like last year, they have the worst defensive record of the top 6 teams.
- I don't know why you are having a wee dig at me (and Chris Martin)! Today was just his second start since getting injured on the 2nd of February. Before that his form was exemplary! It is okay to insinuate that Keogh is part the reason why they kept 6 clean sheets once but it is unfair of me to point out that Martin's goal today bailed them out and that his goals were a significant reason for their early season form?!
- You were belligerent towards me when I said they were faltering at the business end. They have conceded 30 in 18 games and have won 4 of their last 18 games. You don't think that is faltering?
I honestly don't know why you are so paranoid and sensitive. I haven't blamed Keogh for anything this afternoon. I simply said their defense is faltering (which it is) and that he conceded a penalty (which he did).
Now you can blame the man on the moon for Keogh's inadequacies and you can defend him to the hilt but his and Derby's form is far from perfect ATM.
Mascarell has also been injured and released back to Spain, their third holding midfielder, but generally more effective in home games when they're on the front foot. If you're going to plant stats, please include him. It's their lack of any holding midfielder that has been their problem. Mascarell used play the home games even when Eustace was available,so your stat is totally misleading. You surely can't disregard it as a major factor, on top of the loss of Bent and Martin at the same time. I'm not knocking Martin, far from it, he's a major player for them and they are, and have been, lost without him. I was just saying he was injured during their worst period defensive, which contradicted what you were saying... simple. Yeah, in fairness, you did call it. I have to say I never invisaged things getting as bad for Derby, but then I'm not psychic and didn't realise instead of their chronic injuries clearing up, they would get progressively worse, to the point where they had litteraly no stricker or defensive midfielder for a long spell, on top of losing some other important players at various stages, notably Buxton, Keogh's long term centre back partner. Had I known this, I wouldn't have been as sure, but they'll still probably make the playoffs, regardless, so I'm not totally wrong just yet.
By the way, nice touch with the bullet points... Makes you look like you mean business. Hendrick's goal was supposed to be a cracker.
Saw it on sky sports news earlier, yeah it's a cracking finishQuote:
Originally Posted by DeLorean
Some volley alright. He also gave away the second penalty for a foul on Dunne. Keogh's handball looked incredibly harsh.
Eh DeLorean it was you that brought up George Thorne as if his absence was the reason Derby's defence has been performing so dismally over the last several months and when you are told he has been out all season - even when their form was exemplary - it's Mascarell's absence now. :rolleyes:
And what does a striker - any striker - being out injured have to do with how poorly a defence is performing?
Yeah I'm not disregarding it as a minor contributing factor.
You come across like Norwich, Watford & Ipswich have Didier Deschamps or Claude Makelele type water carriers protecting their defence when they have had to economise just like Derby have.
Ironic that you bring Jake Buxton up. The last time Derby started without Keogh in their defence, they actually kept a clean sheet. Hmm..... :p
Listen DeLorean, I think you are being a little paranoid here.
I didn't have a go at Keogh for his performances or for the penalty but you still feel the compulsion to defend him anyways.
Derby have scored 7 goals against poor teams and they have picked up 2 points for their efforts. I have criticised their defence. I don't think there is anything slightly provocative in that.
You have implied that Cyrus Christie & the other defenders have been erratic and carry the burden for their deficiencies - which I disagree with - but Richard Keogh is supposed to be the captain.... you know?