In fairness, if the FAI were able to sell that concept to Uefa for €10m, hats off to Delaney or whoever did the deal.
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In fairness, if the FAI were able to sell that concept to Uefa for €10m, hats off to Delaney or whoever did the deal.
"if"Quote:
Originally Posted by elatedscum
the source for that story is Con Martin:rolleyes:
New interim CEO announced - Gary Owens, formerly of down syndrome Ireland, and athletics Ireland
Delaney should never have been more than an interim now perhaps he should be interned !
Delaney gone from his UEFA post too.
Niall Quinn in as Interim Deputy CEO
It does seem like things are moving in the right direction.Quote:
Originally Posted by backstothewall
There seems to be some cynicism over Quinn, and the group he was involved in recently, which included Barrett and Owens. I don’t see it. Quinn might be seen as a bit wet but he’s got diplomacy skills, much needed if the FAI is to get closer to the state machinery. He is 100% right about football getting a pitiful share of sport spending and 100% right that football needs a stronger lobbying relationship with government. He has identified both the LOI and youth structures as critical areas needing investment and improvement. I think this is a positive step & I hope he does well.
His heart's in the right place, he's got a good business brain, was chairman of Sunderland so he knows a bit about top-level football administration, and he's likeable. Under the old regime, I'd have said he was destined to fail! I'm really optimistic about this - I don't expect miracles, but I do think good things will come.
Is it though?Quote:
Originally Posted by Eminence Grise
Quinn never did anything imo except for his personal gain.
https://www.irishtimes.com/sport/soc...ment-1.3760308
Looks like Quinn wants to harvest our best talents to England - will our clubs gain from this or will it be same old story. I'm v wary of him and the incompetence of his "Visionary" group presentation is already well known.Quote:
“Where it’s gone to now is: ‘the problem doesn’t just stop with a national academy, it needs a radical change in the League of Ireland around helping those clubs establish a system that can lead to players going over to England better prepared for top level careers or, if they don’t go, to make the League of Ireland more competitive.”
I don't see any problem with that tbh. The LoI has to expect to be a selling league. At the moment, too many of those transfers are (a) for free, or next to nothing and (b) ultimately not very successful. Transfer income is huge for similar-sized leagues and we can't keep ignoring it.
A system where youngsters stay at home, progress through the LoI and then move is essential, to player and club (except the schoolboy clubs of course)
I've no problem with those comments - especially as you didn't flag the bit where it says that players would be at least given the practical choice of staying here as well. The league loses too many players because it's just not worth it for many once they get a regular career
You didn't' answer my question though - Will the clubs themselves benefit from transfer fees and not a third party like Red Strike? Why would someone invest €40m into Schoolboy academies for no return? I'm not saying I'm right or wrong in any case I'm just questioning the assertion that Quinn's heart is in the right place. It may well be but It may well be not either.Quote:
Originally Posted by pineapple stu
I don't see anything in what you quoted that indicates anything other than helping clubs in this.
Third party contracts are illegal. I know football and money will always try find a way around rules, but for now I don't see why if Cork sell a player, Cork wouldn't get fees
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eminence Grise
In that he was proud to play for Ireland, is one of the few ex-internationals to have expressed any kind of interest in the league, came back to live here, runs his business here, seems to have a geniune interest...? Yeah, I'd say so. I could be biased because I've always liked him as a player and person.Quote:
Originally Posted by Real ale Madrid
If he has the business acumen to help LoI clubs develop players for sale, and, alone or with a consortium of investors, benefit with a percentage of the sale, once it's legal and not like some amateur clubs' trade in kids, or the obscene power of a Raiola or Mendes figure, I don't have a problem. As Pineapple Stu says, transfer fees here are something we can't ignore for much longer. Ask a club: would they rather have 100pc of a free transfer all by themselves, or 50pc of €100k where a third party gets their cut from having invested in the academy that helped develop the player (rather having dodgy joint ownership)?
If Niall Quinn had any interest in the LOI he would have got involved at club level years ago. I'm not lambasting him for that because he is a businessman and there is no money in the LOI but lets get real here. He has no interest in the league in general - or at least he has shown no interest thus far.Quote:
Originally Posted by Eminence Grise
Now we are getting to the crux of the issue. I don't really disagree with what you say - but from the outside this seems to be his motivation ( to make money for a 3rd party ) and its not a good starting point for a governing body to take, which he is now part of. Id rather a governing body lobby for government funding and be fully recompensed for players they develop. If investors want to get involved in clubs fine but I'd be wary of going down the road of an academy structure funded even partially by a third party. Significant investment will require significant returns.Quote:
Originally Posted by Eminence Grise
Maybe his interest is Irish football generally - so no interest in getting involved at club level, but recognises that the LoI is important in the overall scheme of things?Quote:
Originally Posted by Real ale Madrid
That'd be a big improvement on recent regimes...
I know there were issues with his Visionary Group - when you lose out to Lucid, who seems to have nothing, then that doesn't reflect well - but I don't think you've shown any grounds for legitimate concerns in your posts tbh.
You think "Maybe" is ok with regards his interest in the league despite there being no actual evidence that he does.Quote:
Originally Posted by pineapple stu
But I have no grounds for legitimate concerns surrounding a 3rd party football academy which Quinn represents that wants to invest large sums in the game here for no return.
Right.
You're beginning to sound a bit like SkStu in the politics forum now. :)
All I can say is that the quote you highlighted gives me no concern at all. It is entirely logical that the FAI would want to facilitate Irish players moving to as high a level as possible, and that's not the LoI. That would benefit the LoI as well. He doesn't need to have any specific interest in the LoI to act in its benefits, if his interest is in helping football in Ireland in general.
There may well be issues of concern here - but you've not really shown them. You argued against your own point (Quinn has no interest in the league), so you can hardly give out to me for arguing against it too. Everything else is just supposition on your part based on one connection.
If ever there was a Que to shut up! That is it.Quote:
Originally Posted by pineapple stu
Fixed that for you.Quote:
Originally Posted by pineapple stu
Its more than just supposition in fairness. He went to Lobby the government no more than a year ago accompanied by Redstrike and Brian Kerr - its not some sort of outlandish connection.Quote:
Originally Posted by pineapple stu
https://www.dublinlive.ie/sport/nial...-over-15699216
Anyway - point made. Hope Quinn does a great job but I'm not holding out any hope of this being a watershed appointment.
It’s that kind of thinking (generally, not you, RAM) that holds back the league. This Corinthian amateurism that wants a pure game, unsullied by money and materialism – almost a Ron Manager with his small boys (hm!) and jumpers for goalposts. It's not money on its own, it has to be the right money.Quote:
Originally Posted by Real ale Madrid
The league has been starved of money for my entire life (I’m mid-forties).
I’m fed up seeing players go to clubs in the UK for nothing or next to it, and our clubs getting ripped off by UK clubs who could afford to pay proper fees but have us over a barrel. If someone can professionalise player marketing (from development to finished product) for a fee that means our clubs profit, I’d be all for it – once there are proper legal and regulatory controls in place (that much we agree on, I think). The kind of stuff Delaney and his gang never bothered to implement.
I don’t think that necessarily means a third party on its own. Of the two proposals for the league, Lucid’s got a little traction, Quinn’s didn’t. Who’s to say that Quinn in his new role can’t work for a joint FAI, LoI, state and third party initiative? Or hasn’t been brought in for this exact reason?
A centralised governing body that lobbies and develops players here is a great idea, but it would need to be a national academy along the lines of a Clarefontaine or a George’s Park (the latter cost over £100m to develop) or have a draft and contract system like the MLS. Both are outside our football culture, and I’m not even sure that centralised contracts would work under EU rules.
I want to be optimistic. Following Ireland and the LoI these last few years … it’s like being 3-0 down in a cup final heading into injury time. But I still want to believe that our lumbering veteran centre forward can shank one in and start the mother of all comebacks. Don’t take that hope from me, RAM!!!:D
Ooooh... that's a pistols at dawn comment if ever I saw one.Quote:
Originally Posted by pineapple stu
Look, the ball is fizzing over the shoulder of Van Aerle and he looks like he is going to put Van Brekeluen under pressure with a bad backpass. I'm with you - I want Quinn to anticipate the loose ball and slam it home into the roof of the net but the ball is most definitely loose and its really anyone's guess as to where it is going to end up!Quote:
Originally Posted by Eminence Grise
Ooooh! Get it up yer orange jersies!!!;)
The best think IMHO about having people Like Roy Barret , Gary Owens , Catherine Guy etc coming into the FAI is that they all have professional reputations at high levels and wont be part of an organisation going forward that isnt run properly.
Quote:
Originally Posted by pineapple stu
Now, now. Be nice and lets keep politics out of Irish football, as the old adage goes.Quote:
Originally Posted by Real ale Madrid
*cue by the way RAM. I hope that doesnt offend you... ;)
where does he say the national academy is to be a vehicle for profiting on player sales? I didn’t see that.Quote:
Originally Posted by Real ale Madrid
Private funding will look for a return.Quote:
Originally Posted by Stuttgart88
And the full quote in context? Is he talking about private funding of a national academy or private funding of clubs? The former would probably be illegal (TPO), the latter is football.
To answer my own question I read that there’s a guy called Mike Farnan who does indeed have stakes in foreign academies in places such as Vietnam, Lithuania. Definitely cause for concern. By all means have a national academy but not one which actually owns players’ transfer rights. Kerr is an advisor. I think there’d be outcry if something like that was launched here I’d be surprised if Kerr supported it. There was a similar academy in Spain run by Glenn Hoddle which was slightly different. It was “signing” out of contract players like Christy Fagan and giving them a second chance. I think they had to apply to be a club in Spain’s lower tiers. Not sure how it worked out but it had some iffy characters involved - as does most of football.
This bit does indeed deserve some attention.
I may be naive but I still think this lot could be decent though. They have the business skills to run an organisation.
I’d also be curious to know what the appointment process was.
If a private company can set up an academy programme that still leaves LOI and domestic football in general in a better position than they were, then the private company making their money as well doesn't bother me.
If they end up making loads of money while LOI and domestic football plods along as usual, it's an issue.
If one side was to take advantage of the other, I'd expect the FAI and LOI to be the ones getting screwed by the private company, rather than the other way round.
To be honest, the perception of the LOI as a two-bit league with players available for buttons, and the inability of most clubs to tie their players down for longer than a year, will result in a drawn-out solution, if there even is one.
I wouildfn't be as relaxed - TPO is a murky business - and I'd also have conflict of interest concerns at FAI level.
https://www.the42.ie/gary-owens-nial...86831-Jan2020/
So much for corporate governance.Quote:
Quinn, having made it known he would be interested in assuming a role with the FAI while ruling himself out of becoming full-time CEO, was appointed as Interim Deputy CEO of the FAI last week.
The creation of such a role was not among the governance reforms recommended by the Governance Review Group report of last year, and the role was not publicly advertised.
Owens then threw in this clanger.
A bad start.Quote:
“Listen, I could work in the commercial world for a lot more money than I’m actually getting for this. I started playing football a long time ago at St Joseph’s, I love the game, I go to international matches, so we’ve came together to try and make change.
Didn't JD say something similar some years ago?Quote:
I could work in the commercial world for a lot more money than I’m actually getting for this.
FAI appears to be full of lads foregoing multi-million euro salaries elsewhere for the good of the game, yet the game and association is f**ked.Quote:
Originally Posted by sidewayspasser
Time to resurrect this thread I reckon.
Never a dull moment at the FAI:
https://www.rte.ie/sport/soccer/2020...-owens-claims/
So, it seems that the new Independent Chairman & CEO are telling porkies about the Board approving the MOU with the government.
There is also a concern over how the likes of Barrett, Owens, Quinn and the new LOI Director were appointed, as the roles weren't advertised. I'm not sure exactly which roles were filled without a formal process, but it appears that some/most were part of Quinn's Visionary Group.
Rea Walshe keeps her job despite close ties with JD, and offering him free formal legal advice against Bar Society regulations.
Quinn has backtracked a bit on the 10 year Council tenure limit, saying that it will now be subject to an assessment olf skills, proprietry etc.
And of course the key argument seems to be the actual make up of the 12 man Board, with the government/FAI MOU saying it should now be 6 independents and 6 elected from the "football family" but the football family are saying they should hold the balance of power. It is currently 8 elected, 4 independent. FIFA & UEFA have written in support of the 6/6.
I'm a little bit unsure how I feel here. In ordinary circumsdtances you'd think 4 independents on a board of 12 should be enough, but Irish football is far from ordinary. Council has been complicit in the FAI's failure for decades and the the old Board was clearly a shambles. You just can't trust the "football people" to do the right thing in this country. The 6/6 split looks high to me, but I'd like to know what's common in comparable organisations.
Could be a tasty EGM coming up!
This was discussed on Game On on 2FM last night.Quote:
Originally Posted by Stuttgart88
On the 16 member athletic board, two are independent. The gymnastic and swimming boards both have nine members, with two independents. The boxing board has ten members, with three independents. Cricket has 12 members with five independents. Instead of a board, Rugby and GAA have management committees, with ten and sixteen members respectively, and both with no independent members.
You can listen back to it here - https://2fm.rte.ie/2fm-shows/game-on/ - under Game On Full Show 05 08 20
It's the first segment of the show, Tony O'Donoghue discusses the makeup of the other sporting bodies' board around the ten minute mark.
There's that, but then how many of those organisations are quite as in the red as the FAI?
I listened to the OTB interview with Ross and McSharry. the question was put to Ross, ‘when did 4 turn into 6 independent board members?’ and for the next 11 minutes he waffled on and on and i’m none the wiser.
Perhaps the FAI should be garbed in sackcloth and ashes until they demonstrate evidence of competency in a transparant and functional structure. I seriously doubt that the 6 independents would be interfering in football centric matters.
What happened at the EGM? Did they first check out the accounts, look deep into the bottomless dark hole, had a look at the bailout plan and thought 6 + 6 doesn't look too harsh?