Would not be surprised. Leadership is a dirty word in the current government.Quote:
Originally Posted by Macy
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Would not be surprised. Leadership is a dirty word in the current government.Quote:
Originally Posted by Macy
it will be fun alright, and i hope it wont come to pass. overtime for us has been all but stopped unless in cases that cannot be avoided i.e. court etc, which means i will be lucky to earn 70% of what i did last year and i got my mortgage based on the strength of that.Quote:
Originally Posted by Macy
obviously people think we dont do a whole pile either but i worked nights in dublin city centre the weekend just gone and due to not being able to get people in on overtime we were genuinely stretched very thin on a weekend that would normally not have been that busy.
im not trying to play the poor mouth but its looking like the way things will go we will be working harder for less money if these pay cuts come in.
we have already given up on the pay increase that was due to be 6% over the next 2 years and if we get a 5% reduction as well there will be serious opposition to it
Bold prediction. Want to predict what will create the boom? As far as I can make the last 2 have been Dot.Com & Property.Quote:
Originally Posted by ThunderThighs
How can a boom be sustainable? Didn't we just learn the folly of that?
Based on what? That seems to be pure random speculation on your part.Quote:
Originally Posted by ThunderThighs
http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/4b946536-2...nclick_check=1
Peter Sutherland argues that the Irish economy isn't in as bad a shape as is being reported
Seems to me that he was probably one of the people who influenced and advised Lenihan.
Sutherland is one of the few Irish businessmen left with international credibility (Niall Fitzgerald is another). He's definitely worth listening to (not to say that you have to agree with him). He has an unbelievable CV.
Never mind Lenihan listening to him, put him in his job!!
So does Bertie Ahern. Un-bloody-believable.Quote:
Originally Posted by OneRedArmy
I'm beginning to wonder if Planet D4 is actually in this universe.Quote:
Originally Posted by OneRedArmy
I thought he was under pressure in the UK after "overseeing" Fred the Shreds reign as a non-exec director of RBS?Quote:
Originally Posted by OneRedArmy
I agree. Overall one of the few high ranking internationla irish business people.Quote:
Originally Posted by OneRedArmy
It would seem one of the strengths of the Presidential format of government is that you get to recruit the best people for the jobs instead of beinbg stuck with Dept of Finance drones.
Part of the reason we're in this mess is because too many vested interests at the heart of Government, between Builders, developers and healthcare privateers. We don't need more that are part of even more insidious groups like Bilderberg.Quote:
Originally Posted by pete
Have a look at the Senate to see how highly-qualified government appointees are...Quote:
Originally Posted by pete
I am not talking about politicians. I am not saying it is perfect by any means but in the US they can appoint experts in their field for say 2 years who have already made their money in the private sector. For example: If the head of say the Dept of Finance was useless could the Minister remove him? Surely if the Minister has the same advisors who helped him create the mess advising him (I am not absolving politicians for the mess) how to get out of it it does not suggest a successful outcome.Quote:
Originally Posted by Sheridan
People who made their money in the private sector are at least as culpable for the current mess as those in government, I think we've handed them enough money and power via the bailouts as it is. Wealth != expertise.
The Taoiseach already has 11 nominee's to the senate, and he can nominate two of those to cabinet (except a Tánaiste or as Minister for Finance). FF chose to waste them on failed polticians, future party prospects, and in the case of Harris, as payback to INM.Quote:
Originally Posted by pete
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Originally Posted by OneRedArmy
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Originally Posted by Sheridan
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Originally Posted by Macy
In fairness to Sutherland, he isn't some fly-by-night property developer.Quote:
Originally Posted by Sheridan
Yes, his has a history in big oil and investment banking, but he was Attorney General in his 30s and is an advisor to the Vatican and the UN.
Nobody is perfect, but compared to the incumbents and what else is out there, he's streets ahead intellectually.
Morning Ireland discussing how Sutherlands reputation has been damaged by being on the RBS & Goldman Sachs boards, and that his days at BP are numbered (even if he survives todays AGM). He's up to his oxters in the whole financial system, not the type of person we should be hooking up with now.
Edit - He's just been described as "shoddy goods" by someone from the torygraph
Are you arguing he's worse than the incumbents? Brave statement.Quote:
Originally Posted by Macy
If you disallow everyone involved in a meaningful way in the financial system you have an immediate practical challenge of who manages and leads going forward.
Some people seem to think the answer lies in appointing career academics, however in my experience many are academics precisely because they can't manage and lack effective team dynamics.
Who would you appoint to run the banks and the regulatory bodies?
Not necessarily everyone involved in the financial system, just people like Sutherland who I do not trust to put national interest ahead of business interest. I'm not sure anyone's worse than the current incumbents, but Sutherland is cut from the same laissez faire cloth.
Hurling from the ditch?Quote:
Originally Posted by Macy
It's a very real problem.
I don't trust Sutherland, member of Bilderberg, director of RBS, director of Goldman Sachs, underpressure as chair of BP. I don't see him as a great white hope for Ireland, but if you see that as hurling from the ditch fair enough.Quote:
Originally Posted by OneRedArmy
The likes of Sutherland and his legion have been engaged in what was basically a prolonged criminal conspiracy against the people of Ireland and the peoples of Europe. When something like that collapses, you don't try to reconstruct it, you wipe the slate clean and punish the wrongdoers.
I am not going to defend any one but what exactly did they do wrong. Seems like a broad sweeping statment above. :confused:Quote:
Originally Posted by Sheridan
Interesting conspiracy theory Sheridan,care to elaborate?Is this like that Zeitgiest film on youtube about the fianancial system in America?Is it a similar conspiracy to that your referring to?Summarise if you dont want to go into detail.I do think theres something dodgy going on.
The crisis was let go this far down the crapper-they didnt have collective world meetings about it till last November.
Its the failure to name realistic alternatives.Quote:
Originally Posted by Macy
Populist conspiracy theory.Quote:
Originally Posted by Sheridan
Over 50% of new mortgages in Ireland the period 2003-2006 were investment loans.
Endemic greed caused what happened and the people of Ireland shoulder a fair bit of the blame themselves. The meedja have consistently played the populist card (what a surprise, tell the people what they want to hear, sell more papers/get more listeners) and tried to blame a small cabal of individuals.
Whilst these people should shoulder their responsibility and be held accountable, the amount of handwashing and retrospective amnesia in Ireland is unbelievable.
I agree with you there ORA and in addition to iI have one problem which is that they say things like we all lost the run of ourselves and we are all the blame etc. Well sorry I did not lose the run of myself and I know lots who did not. I did not take out a mortgage or a car loan and I do not have any debt of any kind. I did not decide to have kids I could not afford. In fact I did not do anything that I could not afford and all my outgoings are sustainable.
Well said.Quote:
Originally Posted by OneRedArmy
I would say it also suits the politicians (both government & opposition) to point the fingers at "the bankers". Exhibit A: Noel Dempsey FF Ard Fheis speech.
I can see how it suits the Government, but I don't see how it suits the opposition? All this happened on FF/PD/Green watch. The banks were a major part of the problem aided and abetted by Government - it just so happens that the main benificaries were the developers and builders who are major backers of FF.Quote:
Originally Posted by pete
I don't actually recall agreeing with the premise in the first place tbh.Quote:
Originally Posted by OneRedArmy
The property developers were the biggest gainers in absolute terms, but in comparative terms you bring a lot more people into the net.Quote:
Originally Posted by Macy
As an example, rank and file gardai are generally seen as being reresentative of "the working man". Yet they have some of the highest ownership rates of investment property, to the extent their union tried to push for a special tax break to get them out of the hole they had dug themselves!!
Cops having several houses is hardly a new thing, however, I'd say a lot of people that had high overtime are now being quite badly hit. Overtime is one of the first things to go (even in the guards). Who was it who allowed the banks to lend based on overtime? The general population isn't faultless (they keep voting FF FFS) - however, they were getting it from every angle that it was a gravy train that would never stop, never mind crash and burn. This was fed by the likes of Ahern and the rest of Government (remember the "suicide" comments about people questioning how sustainable the boom was?), and then facilitated by Government by allowing dubious lending practices by the banks.Quote:
Originally Posted by OneRedArmy
Macy I thinkyour argument that the general population are too stupid to think for themselvs but those coniving big business people are the bad guys is verysimplistic. I have no sympathy for stupid people. If we did reward or refund stupidity were would be as a race of people if you believe in Darwinism.
Def agree with this:)Quote:
Originally Posted by NeilMcD
Here too - no mortgage, no car, no huge loans (credit card apart!), and in a year or two will be ready to plunge into the property market with wife! Im happy that food, etc are going down in price, house prices are down, electricity and gas down, etc etc
Lucky? nah just didnt think buying a mortgage in Longford, etc for 300,000 is a good purchase!
(by the way travel from Sligo to Mullingar and see all the near empty housing estates!!!! Kind of scary really!)
see that silly cow on TV last night - a young teacher trying to "have a word" with Jacob saying she has only about 94 euros left after all her expenses!!!! Wellw hat is she doing with a 300,000 mortgage for a single woman!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! She should resign her job and give it to someone who can appreciate a 40,000 yearly salary
The greed in this country is a joke! When will we ever learn!!!:mad:
There is a noticable trend now. Any one who is able to organise themselves into a special interest group is pleading for special treatment.
The teachers & doctors are moaning this week saying their funding & wages should not reduced but no suggestion where the money will come from. Everyone wants some else to take the cuts.
Teachers are another group of people who feature highly in the investment property owning stakes.
Re the teachers conferences, whilst they have a valid point about special needs teaching (disgraceful situation), they haven't a leg to stand on concerning their remuneration. When you break it down on an hours worked basis the average teacher earns €100 per hour.
Reminds me of the joke that the collective noun for a group of teachers (herd of buffalo, pride of lions etc.) is a whine of teachers.
Women seem to have a fascination with property. The amount of my female friends who were mad to buy houses and were having a go at me for not buying etc. I preferred to read the economic books while they read and watched the property shows. I thought the show recently by George Lee How we blew the boom was a comedy show.
:eek: I want to work wherever those teachers work....Quote:
Originally Posted by OneRedArmy
Any source for this?Quote:
Originally Posted by OneRedArmy
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Originally Posted by micls
Fair point, just did a rough calculation inQuote:
Originally Posted by osarusan
my head (teachers in the family so fair idea of hours and pay) and it's well off anything bar 3rd level.
FWIW it was quoted on Newstalk this morning.