Are we any good?

In answer to your questions Gather_round.

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Originally Posted by Gather round

You'd be adding one large urban area (500,000+?) for a total of two. It's still only marginal. There are more fundamental reasons why the LoI is weaker than those in similarly sized countries (Croatia, Denmark, Norway?).

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Yes I agree with you that Ireland as a whole has really only three cities of any reasonable size (I'd throw in the Cork urban area also) but it doesn't take a city of over 500 thousand people to support a football team. Both NI and the Republic have a similar number of towns of over 25 thousand people (about 11 or 12 each by my count) which should be enough to support a club in an all Ireland league. Obvously bigger towns and cities can support more than one team so we could eventually end up having a large number of competitve teams spread around on both sides of the border. I agree that demographics is not the only probelm but to provide the financial support teams require to be competitve you need a decent sized urban area with a sizeable fan base. Rural areas cannot support large football clubs that are going to be competitive in Europe.

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Originally Posted by Gather round

How does this compare- with the countries above, say? 2 million of 6 million odd people in Ireland live in suburban Dublin and Belfast. Is that so different from 1.5 million of 4 million?

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The number of decent sized towns or cities is more important as mentioned above and this could be effectively doubled by any such merger.

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Originally Posted by Gather round

From your point of view (as clearly the stronger league), why merge with the weaker? How much stronger would it make the merged league? Not very, I guess. How stronger would Linfield be? Arguably not at all. They wouldn't be the clear favorite every season. And- unlike other notional moves across leagues, say the Old Firm to England, they wouldn't have the carrot of much greater income from TV.

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Initially Linfield may not be much stronger but surely a more competitive league that's better supported would in the long run ensure the bigger clubs like Linfield would reap the benefits over time. Other than the number of titles in the record books I don't see how being the dominant force every year in a league can be beneficial to any team.

As for TV money then I'd say it's a safe guess that all the clubs involved in such a merger would receive more income from TV coverage due to the extra interest any such merger would generate. Attendences I'm sure would also initally rise. It would be up to the clubs and the associations to ensure that this initial interest would be built upon.

Anyway as I said this is not the only problem and it is possible to have two separate leagues competing at a better level than currently is the case. Unfortunately I do believe the demographics in Ireland are a major obstacle.

Anyway it's all pie in the sky stuff at present though but who knows what may happen in the future with the Setanta cup now being a reality anything is possible.

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Originally Posted by seanfhear

If the old firm were transfered to the the championship or first division in england they would create quite a stir.On a smaller scale if linfield and glentoran merged with the bigger clubs in the south it would create an attractive product for fans and tv companies.All clubs would have to improve.By meeting this challenge standards would be forced upwards

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i have to say i agree with Gather Round more so than this point. If the leagues merged I think that, while attendances might rise temprorarily, after that i think we are really kidding ourselves into giving far too much credit to the armchair fan who only occasionally will drag himself off his arse for an international in Croker. There are also those who totally dismiss the Eircom League, deny its existence even, in favour of the more commercial and satisfying support of a premiership team. These are people who will never follow a local team unless success (in terms of Europe) is guaranteed.

It boils down to the Govt., the FAI and the clubs (league and junior) coming together and setting out a plan for the future in terms of all aspects of the league - from financing and grants to how the clubs are run. The sports minister should also be involved heavily and the Govt. should examine all available opportunities to help the countries football clubs.

At the moment, the FAI is doing a bit (credit where its due) but the clubs are really left to their own devices in a lot of respects. Its just not working, attendances are not increasing in any significant way, in a lot of cases they have decreased.

One thing is for certain, and i mean no offence here, because of the nature of the average Irish football fan (lazy and uninterested), the league wont thrive until it is already self sustainable and relatively successful.

Once the league is successful, it becomes a cycle and the offshoots of this success will be bigger pool of players, bigger pool of better players, the best players having more options on where to play, better performances by the national team and regular qualification for the international team.

Its pretty exciting if it can be pulled off.

The Eircom League could never get enough interest unless a multi billionaire came in and gave clubs a lot of money to bring in players from like Brazil, Argentina, Chile and Africa.

Even still, sometimes I'm convinced people wouldn't go watch an EL game even if Zidane and Maradona were on the damn pitch.