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Don't get me wrong, his attitude is super, but there are hundreds of thousands of young lads who would have gone out there with a super attitude. He reads the game badly, is slow and short. As a defender no amounts of attitude, heart or bravery can make up for those shortcomings
Good attitude alright but you can see why Man U let him go. He's small for a centre-half and he lacks pace. Makes up for his shortcomings by running around like he's got a nest of wasps in his underpants.Quote:
Originally Posted by backtowalsall
He is not the finished article and I don't know how good he is going to be, I think it's worth pointing out that at West Brom & Sunderland he has been usually played at right-back.
But he is young and learning a lot, I hope the coaching at Sunderland is good. He has come a long way since his Brighton days.
Don't rate him at all. Then again Ii dont rate many of the current players bar 3 or 4
He's rarely played at right full for Sunderland, centre half more often than not.Quote:
Originally Posted by Qwerty
Maybe he's the answer to our right-wing problems!
i disagree with that. I do think a positive attitude and bravery can overcome a lack of natural ability, and some other shortcomings. I find it very hard to criticize players that give 100% (kilbane and mcshane for example). When you have superman Ireland who is blessed with the talents listed above, yet doent give a flying fook about playing for his country - give me McShane anyday. Mcshane can be judged in about 4-5 years - the same amount of time it took Richie Dunne to master the center half position. If i recall correctly, Dunne started off at right back for Everton as well. McShane and Dunne will be a good heart of the irish defence for years to come.Quote:
Originally Posted by backtowalsall
Dunne's talent was obvious from day 1. It was his commitment (to football rather than to Ireland) that was in question!Quote:
Originally Posted by billybunter
O'Dea looks to have more natural talent than McShane, so is a better bet for the next 4/5 years.
He turned away from one shot during the game so there goes that argument for him.Quote:
Originally Posted by carloz
He really went down in my estimation yesterday. He had a poor game.
And the penalty he gave away was criminal. And I don't want to hear this "He is learning" rubbish. An under 16 schoolboy player wouldn't be thick enough to drag a player to the ground on the edge of the box.
All he had to do was get goalside of the player. He was never going to put one past Given from there anyway.
Quote:
Originally Posted by sullanefc
Exactly....that was all he had to do which is nothing more than the basic art of defending...at any age or level!
Even after making his positional error why did he not drag the striker down well ouside the box when he knew he couldn't get the right side of him?
He has shortcomings, yes... But like that it's about playing the best 'Partnership' as opposed to the two best centre halves. McShane and Dunne for me... For now.
Also, we forget how young he is for a centre half... The Micah Richards of this world really are the exception.
I think he's gonna get better over time - defenders tend to mature over the years & learn the game as they play; look at Dunne. It's not so long ago the thought of Dunne in the heart of our defence would send shivers up our spine. Now he's an unmovable rock for Man City & Ireland. There's enough raw potential in McShane to be optimistic.
I too think he will improve. Still very young. He has the potential to become another Kevin Moran, who didn't play top class football until he was 23. He lacked pace but soon learnt how to make up for his shortcomings to become a top class centre back for club and country.
He will get better with experience - no doubt. However as already pointed out, he was caught wrong side of the attacker prior to the penalty decision. That's inexcusable IMO - especially when we are protecting a lead with only a few minutes to go in the match.
Very poor player and to think the powers that be are selecting him and the likes of Alex Bruce.......we are doomed!Quote:
Originally Posted by sullanefc
The more games he plays the more I am being proven right. I would agree with carloz its a double edged sword, because of the attitude and determination he has he often gets caught out cos he uses less of his head and more brawn. If only the other Irish players had half the application and determination he had then we would be way better off. But he definitely appears to be getting "worse" rather than better i.e. more things happening and getting noticed with every game.......Quote:
It is obvious that he would put his head on the line for Ireland.
Sometimes as well his positional sense was attrocious and he was in places i would expect to see a winger or attacking midfielder, he needs to realise that even if the players in front of him cant do, he cant be going up trying to do it for them.....hopefully its just the same as Dunne was when he was younger i.e. inexperience and he will eradicate this from his game.
Ya, just like with koller. But there will be the usual crowd on here getting blinded by "objectivity" ;)Quote:
All he had to do was get goalside of the player. He was never going to put one past Given from there anyway.
I doubt Richards would impress beside John O'Shea either tbh. :)Quote:
Originally Posted by dr_peepee
I think this was a big factor. I'd expect Dunne to organise the defence far better than O'Shea. Expect a better performance from McShane next time he plays with Dunne.Quote:
Originally Posted by eirebhoy
Games with McShane - O'Shea at centre half:
Czech Republic (H) 1-1
Wales (A) 2-2
Games with McShane - Dunne at centre half:
San Marino (H) 5-0
Wales (H) 1-0
Slovakia (H) 1-0
Slovakia (A) 2-2
Czech Republic (A) 0-1
Hard to read anything from so few games, but it does look that we are less likely to concede with Dunne - McShane than O'Shea - McShane
I rate McShane very highly, but even if you think he's an average centre-half by EPL standards (which I think is as low as you could rate him), he's still one of our best options at that position.
Who would you rather have in there?
-Andy O'Brien who I think is the epitome of average central defenders (should definitely be in the squad though)
-Joey O'Brien: why the **** was he playing centre-half for us against Germany?
-Darren O'Dea: a good prospect but hasn't broken into the Celtic first team.
-John O'Shea: has the physical attributes for the position but not the brain/guts. Also not playing there for his club.
-Alex Bruce: Championship level centre-half, still young and could improve. Possible for the future but not yet.
-Paddy McCarthy: Championship level centre-half, was captain of his old club. Tons of ability and hard as nails, but gives away a lot of fouls and gets a lot of cards. Hopefully will smarten up with time.
When you look at that group of centre-halfs, McShane for me is at least the best of a bad bunch. O'Dea, McCarthy, and Bruce could still make the grade later on, but as far as current contenders McShane is pretty clear first choice for me alongside Dunne.