How awful are RTE's panellists?

Eoin on his time in South Africa. Good and bad.
That message he found even harder to transmit at Amazulu in South Africa. “Long before going as a coach I had played in Pretoria and it was fabulous. I knew South Africa. At our club, Vincent Julius was one of the first black players and when, at the end-of-season dinner dance, the chairman said he had to leave after the food we all walked out. Ruined their night.

“But this was apartheid in reverse. Basically, I was used as a bit of a pawn to test the water with a black club and see how a white coach would go down. It was only pre-season and I was saying to these guys ‘look, I’m Irish. I’m not racist, I have no political affiliations. I’m here to help your club’. Didn’t matter a damn, they just didn't want a white coach.

“There were death threats, stones thrown, spat at. I had to change hotel rooms because I was getting anonymous calls saying ‘we are coming to kill you if you don't listen and go’. And the cops said ‘don’t take this as a joke’. So it was scary. Then at one training session a crowd of 40 formed and surrounded me. I argued with them and tried a different tack, ‘just let me get on with my work’. But then one came from behind and said ‘you are not listening. Last time. If you come back we will kill you.’ Fair enough. You win.

Well I never knew that, but it does explain why he's here.

These days 99% of the players are black or coloured (hangover from apartheid divide and conquer classifications) but most of the coaches are white, a couple with Irish connections, Owen da gama is currently in charge of Bloem Celtic. Sammy Troughton once of Glentoran was in charge of Black Aces until he got canned when they were bottom of the league, they stayed up in a play-off I think.
Hristo Stoichkov was in charge of Sundowns (SA's Man City loads of money but they still can't win anything) Ruud Krol is manager of Orlando Pirates, Former Dutch U21 manager Foppe de Haan is Ajax Cape Town's coach.

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Some of ye may have got this email today on the various punditry for yday's England game, worth a read! Imagine for one day, just throwing Dunph into a BBC studio.


Well, Gary Lineker had good news for the English nation yesterday, telling them the BBC’s sources had reliably informed him Stevie would be playing through the middle against Slovenia, “at the head of the diamond”.
Gary, the two Als, Hansen and Shearer, and Lee Dixon then based their entire pre-match analysis on their source’s disclosure, which was unfortunate because the information was thoroughly incorrect.
Roy Hodgson tried to warn them, insisting Stevie would, most probably, play on the left, but Lee Dixon hoped, trusted and prayed he was wrong.
“If he’s playing on the left today we should all pack up and go home,” he sighed.
Match time. Stevie on the left. Lee dusting down his rucksack. But wait, goal. England. Up and running?
Half-time. Fantasy World Cup Punditry, all of them in the one studio. Ready?
Hansen: “Once England got the goal the confidence levels surged, they were excellent.”
Eamon Dunphy: “They just didn’t grow in confidence at all after the goal.”
Lineker: “The goal really settled them, didn’t it? They pushed on from there.”
Ronnie Whelan: “You’d think they’d have kicked on from when they scored, but they actually got worse.”
Roy: “England’s crossing has been absolutely outstanding.”
Giles: “Some of the crossing was just awful.”
Shearer: “Rooney looks more confident, he’s getting around the pitch a lot better.”
Dunphy: “It’s shocking to see Rooney so subdued, he’s been reduced to a shivering wreck.”
Shearer: “They look much more comfortable on the ball, they’re passing it with a purpose, with pace, they’re closing down – a much better performance, it’s encouraging.”
Giles: “They’re much better than they have been, but they couldn’t have been worse.”
No arguments, then. Second half. England held on. Full-time. Ready?
Lee Dixon: “A great performance.”
Dunphy: “Shocking . . . absolutely incredibly bad . . . pretty awful stuff.”
Hansen: “The commitment was there, the spirit was there, the enterprise was there, the creativity was there, they passed it better – they could have scored five or six quite easily. Capello will obviously be delighted with the performance.”
Giles: “If that’s the shackles off what’ll they be like when the shackles are back on?”
’Arry Redknapp: “We played with pace, we got after them, we pressed them, there wasn’t a weakness in the team.”
Dunphy: “They were astonishingly poor.”
Lineker: “He looked more like the Rooney we know.”
Ronnie: “Rooney is a major worry, his form, his body language, his demeanour, everything.”
Dixon: “Gerrard was outstanding.”
Dunphy: “I can’t believe how bad Gerrard was today.”
’Arry: “Across midfield we were top drawer.”
Giles: “Barry got worse as the game went on, Milner, Gerrard and Lampard the same.”
’Arry: “Bring it on! Whoever we play we’ll be difficult to beat.”
Ronnie: “If they don’t improve they’ll go straight out, it was a very, very inept performance.”

I was quite impressed with Dinny last night on the Panel. Talks a lot of sense, is articulate and didn't agree with Dunphy most of time. In fact the latter was quite isolated without his "I agree with Eamon" senior analyst buddy. Surprised though that Dinny knew about the personal life of one of the USA players (Donovan?) which Laughing Bill and Dunphy found hilarious. In fact LB made some total non sequitur about one of the women at the end which made no sense and which threw Dunphy in to hysterics. Unprofession slagging someone off about their private love life but...I'll say no more.

By the way, as you listen to Dunphy slag off England, you might be interested in who one of his tips was to reach the Final:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hA5wy...eature=related

Changed his spots. Now there's a surprise.

And by the way, Dinny and Brady were more positive about the England performance in the evening than Giles and Dunphy. When the latter two aren't jeering Ireland, they carry it on to England. That's what they do, that's what they've always done, despite one of them recommending people to back England for the Final. Pathetic.

To be fair to Dunphy most punters are getting a roasting!! Funny that he has now Holland in his uptodate tips - never mentioned them at the start

BBC were a joke yesterday - total opposite to RTE. According to hansen Gerrard was brilliant in the Algeria game, tracking back, linking, etc. According to RTE he wasnt doing anything in the centre. Gerrard was rubbish in the Algeria game
Gabby Logan was a joke yesterday, what kind of interview was that!!!

Has anyone seen Keegan on ITV, he is by far the worst, even saying England played well against the USA!

And according to ITV news later that night, England are going to play Argentina in the quarter finals!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Mark Lawrenson was nauseating yesterday. RTE should offer him a huge contract and poach him from the BBC so I can listen to somebody who actually knows something about football!!!

Lawrenson's "should have been a plumber" comment was bad right.

Though I thought his point about England looking for the killer pass when they'd have been wiser to keep the ball was correct.

His bias in commentary is terrible though, I'd expect it from the farce that is Clive Tyldsley on ITV, but not from the BBC.

With the exit of France and Italy, I am bracing myself (if it hasn't already happened) for a major onslaught by the G & D and Laughing Bill on Trappatoni.

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Originally Posted by OwlsFan

With the exit of France and Italy, I am bracing myself (if it hasn't already happened) for a major onslaught by the G & D and Laughing Bill on Trappatoni.

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would you expect them to praise the two former champions?

Hamann was very knowledgeable, as is Ardles although he talks a bit quickly. <.<

When Irwin speaks he usually has something worthwhile to say, as does Kilbane.

I don't really like Whelan, his knowledge is limited. Johnny Giles even moreso although at the very least to his credit if he doesn't know something he won't spoof it like Dunphy would.

Dunphy and Souness are monkeys who I presume are only there for entertainment since they certianly don't bring useful insights to the table.

Cunningham is probably my favourite panelist, I don't know why he isn't there. Good speaker, good tactical insight and knowledgable too.

Just imagine Shoddy on the panel, be glad you have Gilsey, Brady, and screwball Dunphy, at least they know a bit about soccer .

Brady is the most boring pundit I've ever watched. Never smiles.

Thats one thing i can't stand, when they never smile ala Brady and Hamann so far. The rest are more upbeat and up for a laugh.

Watched the BBC's analysis of the England match yesterday. Although they were scathing of the team and the management, they didn't (or weren't able to) offer any opinion on why England were so outclassed.
A lot of talk about tactics and "dreadful defending" but the only one that could see the bigger picture was Harry Redknapp. For me, he correctly pointed out the different footballing culture and style of play that Germany and the other big guns are operating in.

Ronaldo, Ronaldo, Ronaldo. I turned over from RTE as the panel went on ad nauseum as usual about him ("See, we told you we were right"). They were even prepared with the clips so it all pre-planned. He wasn't effective ok (putting it mildly) and a few comments to that effect would have been fine, but it was the usual Panel stuff about him like a bone they won't let go. The match itself seemed to be very much second fiddle to his performance.

There are five things you are guaranteed from the RTE Panel: (a) They will attack the Irish manager no matter who he is, (b) Giles will repeat himself and say "I know I am repeating myself", (c) Laughing Bill will laugh especially now that he has had his teeth whitened (d), they will attack Ronaldo and (e) Giles will say "I agree with Eamonn" and Dunphy will say "I agree with John".

But then I suppose I am like someone with a bone which I won't let go :)

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Originally Posted by OwlsFan

Ronaldo, Ronaldo, Ronaldo. I turned over from RTE as the panel went on ad nauseum as usual about him ("See, we told you we were right"). They were even prepared with the clips so it all pre-planned. He wasn't effective ok (putting it mildly) and a few comments to that effect would have been fine, but it was the usual Panel stuff about him like a bone they won't let go. The match itself seemed to be very much second fiddle to his performance.

There are five things you are guaranteed from the RTE Panel: (a) They will attack the Irish manager no matter who he is, (b) Giles will repeat himself and say "I know I am repeating myself", (c) Laughing Bill will laugh especially now that he has had his teeth whitened (d), they will attack Ronaldo and (e) Giles will say "I agree with Eamonn" and Dunphy will say "I agree with John".

But then I suppose I am like someone with a bone which I won't let go :)

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Normally I would take all the punditry with a pinch of salt but this tournament has found me paying more attention than is healthy all in the name of putting together podcasts that highlight the shortcomings of both commentary and punditry teams.

Do you ever get the feeling that they forget that we are listening?

Funnily enough the commentary at the end of the Argentina-Mexico match and the start of the Netherlands-Slovakia match dropped out, looks like RTE haven't paid their phone bill.

As I write I'm clipping some of that stuff for the latest podcast.

If you're interested have a listen

http://slightlyoffthepoint.podbean.com/

or on itunes you can (if you like) subscribe for free

http://bit.ly/cBrYFX

all feedback welcome!

Yeah the Ronaldo stuff is excessive. He was poor last night but he was hardly the only one.

In fairness to Giles he's usually spot on with regard to his tactical analysis. He was dead right last night picking up on Spain's lack of width, starting to play very similar to Arsenal, something that may cost them in later ties particularly with Capdevila's reluctance to get forward. Not that the BBC picked up on that, too busy with the "we're all having a laugh act". They may have their faults but RTE's panelists are still streets ahead of what is available across the water IMO.

I'm surprised BBC found any time to analyse the match what with all the talk about Lampard's disallowed goal. Oh wait, they didn't.

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Originally Posted by OwlsFan

But then I suppose I am like someone with a bone which I won't let go :)

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I believe I've heard you mention them once or twice right enough ;)

Is the punditry that big a part of the experience for you, that you should find their shortcomings so objectionable? Personally, I find their banter entertaining but when it comes to analytical thinking and forming opinions of games/players/miscellaneous people/etc., they're superflous. I can do that myself.* If the window dressing indulges in contradictory rants, it's no skin off my nose. All of which may be horrifying to some RTE suit who sees their function as enlightening the masses but I suspect their priority is also entertainment over substance/consistency of opinion. I find it interesting that someone should have become so genuinely aggrieved with them though. I guess it depends how seriously someone takes them.

* I will say regarding video analysis, that Kenny Cunningham is the only pundit I find thought-provoking or insightful.