Rugby Union 2009

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Originally Posted by OneRedArmy

Its been said for at least 2 years than if Hayes goes we are in serious trouble and yesterday did nothing to dispell that. We were embarrassed in the scrum by what is generally accepted to be the worst scrummaging nation out of the 6/tri nations. God help us if we don't improve drastically before the Boks. Healy can only improve with more game time, hopefully he gets another 80mins on Saturday. Another game will benefit Hayes and Flannery as they were understandably rusty..

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Agree with this, but Australia have improved upon this area dramatically over the past 6 months. Also in that time period they have played 13 games together as a unit...we played none.

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Originally Posted by OneRedArmy

I thought O'Gara answered his critics fairly soundly, good line kicking and reasonable territorial stuff. ..

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Agreed again, and he was quite strong going into contact. Howler of a pass to O'Driscoll for the opening try but re-gathered himself pretty well thereafter, considering the quality of some of the ball he got.

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Originally Posted by OneRedArmy

Our rucking was very poor, body angles too high and no aggression. Add in Kaplan's usual pedantry and the result was that Pocock and Palau dominated the breakdown. Heaslip and Ferris are barnstormers in the loose but are going to have to learn to get stuck in quicker rather than loitering in midfield. ..

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I can't help but feel that Heaslip is way too arrogant at times...his one handed ball carrying, and his liking to stand off at the base rather that get stuck in worries me. I do like Ferris' agression though and disagree with you in saying he spends too much time in midfield.

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Originally Posted by OneRedArmy

Before Fitz got injured I'd have liked to see him or Earls play at 12 against Fiji. Wallace has good hands and a clever brain but he doesn't break the gain line enough and doesn't free up enough space for O'Driscoll.

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Cant agree with this. I was never a Paddy Wallace fan, until Sunday. His line breaks were good, tackling was immense and he provided excellent out-half cover when needed. His best game for Ireland by a mile. He didn't break the line enough primarily because he's an inside centre and our game plan doesn't really suit agressive running from inside channels.

Earls would be wasted an an inside centre simply because it would not allow him to use his electric pace. I see Earls definitely now our left wing for the 6 nations given Fitzgeralds unlucky injury.

The team for Fiji is along expected lines, only issue I have with it is Shane Horgans selection. I know he's playing really well, but at 31 is coming to the end of his career because he won't be getting in ahead of the likes of Earls, Fitzgerald, Bowe etc, and up and coming talent like Darren Cave would be more worthy of a shout on this occasion I feel. Same with Leamy getting the nod ahead of Sean O'Brien.

Anyone watch the match against Fiji?

Jonathan Sexton was exceptional - finally O'Gara has real competition. Sexton ran with the ball more in one game, than O'Gara has for the past few years. Admittedly, he was playing against Fiji, whilst ROG was playing against Australia and did well, but still.....
I'd start him against South Africa, though Kidney will probably keep O'Gara at 10, but - come the 6nations, a changing of the guard is due!

The IRB are going to kill the game if they don't help the Fiji's and the Romania's of this world. Fiji were a massive team physically but they played like they'd never seen each other, which, before last weekend, they pretty much hadn't.

We really didn't learn much from yesterday, although a good boost of confidence for Sexton.

I would start him next weekend. He needs game time against the big countries and at this stage we know what O'Gara can and can't do.

Our front row is almost giving me sleepless nights, I really fear for them next weekend. Depending on how strict the referee is we could be absolutely mullered in the scrum.

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Originally Posted by OneRedArmy

Our front row is almost giving me sleepless nights, I really fear for them next weekend. Depending on how strict the referee is we could be absolutely mullered in the scrum.

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I know what you mean about the front row. If we had some depth there, and quality depth at that, I'm convinced that we would/could win the World Cup.

Just got a call from somebody in the know who tells me that ROG has been left out for Sexton, and Stringer is back on the bench for Reddan....

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Originally Posted by joeSoap

Just got a call from somebody in the know who tells me that ROG has been left out for Sexton, and Stringer is back on the bench for Reddan....

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http://www.rte.ie/sport/rugby/2009/1124/ireland.html

Ireland team to play South Africa on Saturday at Croke Park, kick-off 2.30pm:

R Kearney (Leinster); T Bowe (Ospreys), B O'Driscoll (capt) (Leinster), P Wallace (Ulster), K Earls (Munster); J Sexton (Leinster), T O'Leary (Munster); C Healy (Leinster), J Flannery (Munster), J Hayes (Munster); D O'Callaghan (Munster), P O'Connell (Munster), S Ferris (Ulster), D Wallace (Munster), J Heaslip (Leinster).

Replacements: S Cronin (Connacht), T Buckley (Munster), L Cullen (Leinster), D Leamy (Munster), P Stringer (Munster), R O'Gara (Munster), G D'Arcy (Leinster).


Good side, the front row remains my main worry. Sat will be a big test, if we are as good as we think we are, we need to win it.

Suprised by that, thought ROG had done more done enough with his performance against Australia.
Although I think the decision to play Sexton will probably cost us the match, it will be good for his development. Fair play to Kidney, EOS wouldn't have made that change in a million years.

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Originally Posted by Leeside Swagger

Suprised by that, thought ROG had done more done enough with his performance against Australia.
Although I think the decision to play Sexton will probably cost us the match, it will be good for his development. Fair play to Kidney, EOS wouldn't have made that change in a million years.

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How will he lose the match,Place kicking/positional kicking/passing/tackling/ball in hand?

From my perspective he's demonstrated he's measurably better than O'Gara at the last three. O'Gara is a soft tackler and the Saffies absolutely love running down his channel. The first two areas of the game (placekicking and positional kicking) are the ones that tend to crack under the pressure. I think Sexton's up to it, Saturday will be a huge test, but the potential benefits outweigh the negatives IMO

Very surprised that ROG has lost out but to be fair Sexton did incredibly well on Saturday and when he came on in the HC Semi Last year he was calmness personified. That said the Boks back row will target him early, A massive step up for him but from what I have seen and heard of him he has the game.

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Originally Posted by OneRedArmy

How will he lose the match,Place kicking/positional kicking/passing/tackling/ball in hand?

From my perspective he's demonstrated he's measurably better than O'Gara at the last three. O'Gara is a soft tackler and the Saffies absolutely love running down his channel. The first two areas of the game (placekicking and positional kicking) are the ones that tend to crack under the pressure. I think Sexton's up to it, Saturday will be a huge test, but the potential benefits outweigh the negatives IMO

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Lack of experience at this level. Its not really possible to compare him to ROG at this stage, he's only had one international and a handfull of HC games. Granted he does look like a good player alright but he hasnt been tested at this level.

He will be our outhalf at the world cup im sure, so its important he gets experience of these big matches, its a calculated risk by Kidney and i just dont think we will win on saturday. I do hope im wrong though.

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Originally Posted by Leeside Swagger

Lack of experience at this level. Its not really possible to compare him to ROG at this stage, he's only had one international and a handfull of HC games. Granted he does look like a good player alright but he hasnt been tested at this level.

He will be our outhalf at the world cup im sure, so its important he gets experience of these big matches, its a calculated risk by Kidney and i just dont think we will win on saturday. I do hope im wrong though.

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I was asking specifically what part of his game you feel will let him down?

Boks are missing quite a few, from what I can gather: Botha, Du Preez, Buger & Du Plessis are all doubtful. The Springboks front row is overated, they destroyed the Lions but the Lions front row was crap. I dont see any reason why Ireland shouldnt win this.

I think its a great decision - will give RO'G a boot in the @rse at the very least - one which he himself would even say is long overdue. I hope Sexton plays well - he showed last season in the HC semi that he was comfortable in the surrondings and I think its a great idea to start him against a really good team who look half knackered after a really long season. If we can get on the front foot up front then he has every chance of enjoying a good game. Kidney was never afraid to throw in young lads over the years with Munster and more often than not he has been a good judge - hope this continues at international level.

Its about time we started trying the odd thing during these Autumn international games - we beat both Australia and South Africa a few years ago and where did it really get us?

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Originally Posted by OneRedArmy

I was asking specifically what part of his game you feel will let him down?

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Do you not think experience is important? Theres no one area of his game that will "let him down" as you say, its not that simple.

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Originally Posted by Leeside Swagger

Do you not think experience is important? Theres no one area of his game that will "let him down" as you say, its not that simple.

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If it was the first game of the 6N then experience might be a factor in Kidneys decision

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Originally Posted by Leeside Swagger

Do you not think experience is important? Theres no one area of his game that will "let him down" as you say, its not that simple.

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I think experience is overrated. Otherwise you'd never change a team. Sexton is talked of like a young lad, when in actual fact he's 24.

In terms of the South Africa game, I'd be surprised if Sexton turns out as being the reason we lose. I would see our front row and competing at the breakdown as much bigger worries tbh. As long as we get parity in these areas and he isn't stuck with poor quality back foot ball I think he'll be fine.

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Originally Posted by centre mid

If it was the first game of the 6N then experience might be a factor in Kidneys decision

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Kidney has said that he has picked him to see how he responds ie. to gain the experience of a big test match. Shrewd move by Kidney and it will stand to us in the future im sure.

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Originally Posted by centre mid

Boks are missing quite a few, from what I can gather: Botha, Du Preez, Buger & Du Plessis are all doubtful. The Springboks front row is overated, they destroyed the Lions but the Lions front row was crap. I dont see any reason why Ireland shouldnt win this.

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Lions front row > Ireland front row? Doesn't make sense to me. Flannery would have more than likely been in there but don't think his addition would improve the scrum by as much you are making out.

Sexton plays because we have a fantastic coach that looks beyond the next game, and is targetting the next World Cup. He is the next in line and deserves his chance, pure and simple. This is not a case of O'Gara being dropped. It's a case of experimentation. We are no longer dealing with Eddie O'Sullivan or Warren Gatland, who's ambition lay strictly with winning the next game no matter what. So what if we lose on Saturday. So what if Sexton fcuks up. He gains invaluable experience playing against the best team in the world in a pressure cooker environment. It will prepare him for cauldrons like Twickenham and the Stade de France for the 6 Nations should Kidney want to pick him. So far, he has done everything asked of him, and a little more. I have no fears for his ability on Saturday. My only concern is that he can be a little petulant when things aren't going his way (his stamping on Mafi's face in Thomond Park a couple of seasons ago springs to mind), but hopefully he has grown out of that and give us the option of two world class out-halves to choose from in major competition.

I can see us winning this one, but my main worries lie in the usual areas. The front row will take another hiding...thats for sure so we must limit basic errors that concede scrums. Their lineout is the best in the world bar none. Again, keeping the ball alive when we are in possession as much as possible is imperative. Heaslip for me is a worry. Defensively he has to step up to the plate and get involved a lot more in the tight. That said, I'm confident that we can secure enough quality first phase possession to keep the Boks pinned back, where they will concede penalties. They don't like pressure and it tends to rattle them. France did it to them expertly a couple of weeks ago, and a similar game plan can undo them.

Incidentally, Paddy Power offers 3/1 on Sexton scoring 15 points or more. I'm having a cut off that...:cool:

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Originally Posted by joeSoap

Incidentally, Paddy Power offers 3/1 on Sexton scoring 15 points or more. I'm having a cut off that...:cool:

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Saw that, good price alright.