The John Delaney Thread

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Originally Posted by DannyInvincible

As CTP highlights, we all know well Delaney would be basking in the success by association had we qualified. He'd be publicly thanking Martin and there'd be videos produced by FAI TV of him appearing in the changing room to celebrate with the players. There'd be sing-songs, drinks bought for fans and he might even have taken to the pitch to cheer-lead the crowd.

I guess my post was primarily an articulation of frustration at the man's eternal (and self-enforced) lack of accountability. If there was a sense that Delaney would ever have to answer serious questions in respect of his management of Irish football - be that in a few days, a few weeks, a few months or whenever - I wouldn't be overly bothered by his present ghosting.

Dan McDonnell makes some excellent points here, but no-one's ever going to get an opportunity to put them to Delaney. That's why Delaney should be in the public/media spotlight and shouldn't be let hide away from the consequences of his decisions and governance.

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And you thought I was serious. That's terrible. Just terrible.

Kerr's last job was managing the Faroes in 2011. Since then he's worked as an analyst and co-commentator. Since then the only job I can remember him being linked with the Nigeria senior manager job, along with Bryan robson. To the best of my knowledge, no club in England, Scotland or Ireland has offered him a position. Whatever about a position in the FAI, is he happy just to sit on the sidelines?

I think he's still sore enough to want to prove a point. If Roy can come back then Brian can.

'Denmark hammering is not just on O'Neill or the players - it stops at John Delaney's desk too': https://www.independent.ie/sport/soc...-36332782.html

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Originally Posted by Tommy Con man

And year upon year it continues to oversee the decline of Irish soccer's status and reputation.

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-We've qualified for two Euros in a row and were very close to a World Cup, having previously qualified for one major tournament in eighteen years.

-We performed very well at Euro 2016, a mere seventeen months ago.

-We have beaten Germany, Bosnia-Herzegovina, Italy, Austria & Wales over the last two years.

-Our underage sides are performing better than they have done in years.

-Dundalk produced our best every club performance in Europe in 2016, with Shamrock Rovers having raised the bar a couple of years earlier.

-Stephanie Roche finished runner-up in FIFA Puskas Award.


What fictional status & reputation does he think we had previously? Okay we probably had some higher profile players but that's the case with most international teams now. England have gone from having Scholes, Gerrard, Lampard & Beckham to Jordan Henderson & Jake Livermore! Italy don't have players like Del Piero or Pirlo anymore.

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The industry in England now has a globalised workforce. The FAI has failed chronically to keep up with the competition.

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Yes, John Delaney is to blame for the Sky generated globalisation of the English Premier League. 'Keeping up' should have been a formality.

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Once again on Tuesday night Irish players were exposed for their basic inability to control the ball and pass the ball - the fundamental building blocks of the trade. Anyone with a passing interest has been banging this drum for at least 20 years. A shoddy indigenous culture is repeatedly producing shoddy footballers.

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Shoddy Premier League footballers for the most part, as it happens!

Terrible article. There's enough to throw at Delaney without conjuring stuff up when we're in a bad moment. Big deal if he hasn't been in the public eye in the aftermath of the disappointment? Fair enough I can see the argument, but just because he gets involved in the celebrations doesn't mean he's obliged to criticise or defend what happened last Tuesday, what use would it be? He'd be damned if he did, damned if he didn't anyway.

Wouldn't bother Danny, there are a lot of JD fanboys on this site, mostly the ole ole crowd. Funny that:D

Fact is Ireland are not in the World cup, and if a top 16 in Europe is the height of your ambition then good luck to you.
I will enjoy watching Iceland this year in the WCup. Nice of them to plough all their funds from the Euros back into their set up, while our boys just gave most of it to the players and the hangerons, and thats a lot of people these days.

I'll jump at pretty much any chance to criticise Delaney, but don't think him not being in the public eye after the Denmark match is one.

If it's a comparison with him being in the public eye (drunk with fans, lost his shoes etc) after a good result, then I'd say that's the behaviour that should be at issue.

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Originally Posted by bennocelt

Wouldn't bother Danny, there are a lot of JD fanboys on this site, mostly the ole ole crowd. Funny that:D

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Some ball of sh!te.

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Originally Posted by bennocelt

Fact is Ireland are not in the World cup, and if a top 16 in Europe is the height of your ambition then good luck to you.

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Calm down Ruby Walsh, respectable/good showings at major tournaments is the height of my ambition to be honest. You're right there.

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Originally Posted by bennocelt

Wouldn't bother Danny, there are a lot of JD fanboys on this site, mostly the ole ole crowd. Funny that:D

Fact is Ireland are not in the World cup, and if a top 16 in Europe is the height of your ambition then good luck to you.
I will enjoy watching Iceland this year in the WCup. Nice of them to plough all their funds from the Euros back into their set up, while our boys just gave most of it to the players and the hangerons, and thats a lot of people these days.

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Fact is Italy aren't either and neither are Holland, Northern Ireland, Scotland and Wales. I suppose Delaney is at fault for those as well. I am not sure the KSI have a huge debt to pay off on their 18,000 capacity stadium so they were able to put more of the money back in to the game. To describe anyone who can actually see that it's not all Delaney's (Satan in an FAI suit) fault as an ole oler is ridiculous and not worth responding to.

Ole, ole, ole,me no like John! ��

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Originally Posted by DeLorean

Yes, John Delaney is to blame for the Sky generated globalisation of the English Premier League. 'Keeping up' should have been a formality.

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The globalisation of the EPL isn't something Delaney can control, certainly, but did Conlon strictly mean that the ultra-rich EPL was direct competition for the FAI and that the FAI should be keeping up with its level?

I got the sense that by "competition", he was more referring to other countries (rather than the EPL itself) who now have a greater number of players playing at higher levels of the game in England at our expense and our apparent or perceived inability to keep up with those countries.* Although maybe that's more or less the same thing ultimately, considering those are now the players who increasingly set the enhanced EPL "benchmark"...

*Critics could point out that the LOI is ranked 39th out of 55 European leagues; a poor rating in the grand scheme of things. Fair enough, we're never going to be in the top five with the likes of Spain, England or Italy, but there's no reason why we shouldn't be aiming for the top 20 - after all, the Cypriot league is ranked 18th, just to use an example - which should in turn help us maintain a higher national standard, help us produce a greater number of higher calibre players and assist the international team in at least providing it with a greater number of options and enhanced strength in depth. In saying that, it's not as if the LOI's ranking has been in recent decline either, we've never been at a level equating to that of the EPL, nor has the standard of the league ever even really "kept up" with the level of our main international competitors' leagues in the past either. The historical disparity between our national team's performance, which has generally tended to be of a second or third-tier rating, and the level or quality of our national league, which would probably be rated around fifth-tier if leagues were seeded into pots or tiers like international teams are, has always been a bit of a European anomaly.

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Shoddy Premier League footballers for the most part, as it happens!

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It is fair to say that we have fewer and fewer players playing in the top flight as the years pass though. At the same time, I do accept that that would be an inevitable consequence of the EPL's globalisation, as there are just so many more high-calibre options around the world now for EPL clubs from which to choose rather than just having the pick of the best players from the UK and Ireland. It probably is the case that you always had higher-calibre players scattered around the globe, but EPL clubs simply didn't have access to them in the past like they've always had with Irish players or like they do now.

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Big deal if he hasn't been in the public eye in the aftermath of the disappointment? Fair enough I can see the argument, but just because he gets involved in the celebrations doesn't mean he's obliged to criticise or defend what happened last Tuesday, what use would it be? He'd be damned if he did, damned if he didn't anyway.

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For me (and I'd assume many others who don't have much time for Delaney), complaints about him hiding away from the glare of the public arena in the aftermath of last Tuesday are really just a convenient stick with which to beat a dislikeable scapegoat and I resent you trying to curb our witch-hunt. :p

No, in seriousness, the complaints are more an articulation or "bubbling over" of an enduring frustration over the man's brazen lack of accountability. As I said before, if I had a sense that he'd ever be properly subjected to scrutiny and legitimate questioning by the media or even his own organisation - those who profess to be custodians of the game and of whom the rest of us are (often paying) supporters with a stake in Irish football - his present ghosting wouldn't really bother me as much, but questions aren't even permitted at AGMs and dissent is pretty much non-existent.

Another thing I would note in conclusion is that our senior team is ageing. That and the fact we don't really have creative players coming through is an obvious concern and significant responsibility for that must rest at Delaney's doorstep.

You make good points otherwise though, as ever, that are difficult to refute. Fair enough, it's not exactly an emergency and we're not presently in free-fall, but there is a fear that recent successes paper over cracks. There's an ominous sense of concern that we're riding our "luck" a bit given our poor structural base and planning - we can't and won't get away with it forever - and that we're in for a rude awakening in the near future, the play-off result perhaps being the wake-up call for that. At the very least, we could be ensuring that things look a bit more certain or optimistic for the future, so we could always be doing better in that sense. :)

The bigger Cypriot teams are bankrolled by rich owners. Only about a third of the squads of the top two teams in their league right now are Cypriot

The cost of living is a lot lower there too, which helps. They're also known for not paying players, but presumably the up-front bundles of cash are enough to tempt players in the first place.

Heh, OK, ignore Cyprus. It was just one example I plucked out of the list of European leagues ranked around 20th. Based on our population and resources, I think we could realistically aim to be at a similar level to leagues like Belarus, Sweden, Bulgaria, Azerbaijan, Israel, Croatia or Denmark if a proper long-term development plan was put in place. All of those leagues are ranked between 16th and 25th. Obviously, it's very much idealistic given the neglect of the domestic game in this country, but that's the level we should be striving for and possibly could have been at were it not for the decades of neglect.

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Originally Posted by DannyInvincible

The globalisation of the EPL isn't something Delaney can control, certainly, but did Conlon strictly mean that the ultra-rich EPL was direct competition for the FAI and that the FAI should be keeping up with its level?

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No, definitely not, but he seemed to think the FAI should have been able to keep up with the challenge globalisation of the PL presented. Impossible in my opinion, the FA can't even keep up with it.

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Originally Posted by DannyInvincible

I got the sense that by "competition", he was more referring to other countries (rather than the EPL itself) who now have a greater number of players playing at higher levels of the game in England at our expense and our apparent or perceived inability to keep up with those countries.* Although maybe that's more or less the same thing ultimately, considering those are now the players who increasingly set the enhanced EPL "benchmark"...

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Yes, exactly. So what a ridiculous point he was making. Are we really expected to compete manfully with the talent from Argentina, Brazil, Spain, Italy, France, Germany, etc.? Of course it has butchered our playing numbers at the top clubs and league generally.

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Originally Posted by DannyInvincible

*Critics could point out that the LOI is ranked 39th out of 55 European leagues; a poor rating in the grand scheme of things. Fair enough, we're never going to be in the top five with the likes of Spain, England or Italy, but there's no reason why we shouldn't be aiming for the top 20 - after all, the Cypriot league is ranked 18th, just to use an example - which should in turn help us maintain a higher national standard, help us produce a greater number of higher calibre players and assist the international team in at least providing it with a greater number of options and enhanced strength in depth. In saying that, it's not as if the LOI's ranking has been in recent decline either, we've never been at a level equating to that of the EPL, nor has the standard of the league ever even really "kept up" with the level of our main international competitors' leagues in the past either. The historical disparity between our national team's performance, which has generally tended to be of a second or third-tier rating, and the level or quality of our national league, which would probably be rated around fifth-tier if leagues were seeded into pots or tiers like international teams are, has always been a bit of a European anomaly.

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I don't know what the realistic expectation should be in terms of where our league should rank. I wouldn't know enough about the other leagues - attendance figures, financial support/sponsorship, etc. Top 20 seems extremely fanciful though, without thinking about it too deeply. Most of the countries you mentioned in post #754 have significantly higher populations than the Republic of Ireland, pretty much double in most cases bar Croatia & Denmark. I know that's slightly crude gauge of where we should or could be at, but it would obviously impact heavily on potential playing figures and attendances.

Despite this, Dundalk and Cork City have beaten the top clubs from three of these leagues over the past couple of years (Belarus, Sweden & Israel), so at least we're competitive in that sense.

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Originally Posted by DannyInvincible

For me (and I'd assume many others who don't have much time for Delaney), complaints about him hiding away from the glare of the public arena in the aftermath of last Tuesday are really just a convenient stick with which to beat a dislikeable scapegoat and I resent you trying to curb our witch-hunt. :p

No, in seriousness, the complaints are more an articulation or "bubbling over" of an enduring frustration over the man's brazen lack of accountability. As I said before, if I had a sense that he'd ever be properly subjected to scrutiny and legitimate questioning by the media or even his own organisation - those who profess to be custodians of the game and of whom the rest of us are (often paying) supporters with a stake in Irish football - his present ghosting wouldn't really bother me as much, but questions aren't even permitted at AGMs and dissent is pretty much non-existent.

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Like I said, there is plenty that can be thrown at Delaney. Conlon's piece is opportunistic nonsense though, having a dig just for the sake of it because the opportunity presented itself. There's no substance in the article and it's full of holes and hyperbole.

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Originally Posted by DannyInvincible

Another thing I would note in conclusion is that our senior team is ageing. That and the fact we don't really have creative players coming through is an obvious concern and significant responsibility for that must rest at Delaney's doorstep.

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O'Neill is the one choosing to play the more senior players though, I wouldn't blame Delaney for this either. Hopefully we have some creative players coming through and they just haven't got much of an opportunity yet, Liam Kelly an obvious example but even the likes of Hourihane could reduce the age profile and add an eye for goal. Clearly there are others too and at least we seem to be making inroads at underage level. I think we've enough to work with in the short-term anyway, obviously we're lacking a reliable goalscorer at the moment though.

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Originally Posted by DannyInvincible

You make good points otherwise though, as ever, that are difficult to refute. Fair enough, it's not exactly an emergency and we're not presently in free-fall, but there is a fear that recent successes paper over cracks. There's an ominous sense of concern that we're riding our "luck" a bit given our poor structural base and planning - we can't and won't get away with it forever - and that we're in for a rude awakening in the near future, the play-off result perhaps being the wake-up call for that. At the very least, we could be ensuring that things look a bit more certain or optimistic for the future, so we could always be doing better in that sense. :)

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I think the cracks are well established. Hopefully better structures have been put in place at this stage. Time will tell I guess.

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Originally Posted by DannyInvincible

Heh, OK, ignore Cyprus. It was just one example I plucked out of the list of European leagues ranked around 20th. Based on our population and resources, I think we could realistically aim to be at a similar level to leagues like Belarus, Sweden, Bulgaria, Azerbaijan, Israel, Croatia or Denmark if a proper long-term development plan was put in place. All of those leagues are ranked between 16th and 25th. Obviously, it's very much idealistic given the neglect of the domestic game in this country, but that's the level we should be striving for and possibly could have been at were it not for the decades of neglect.

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How many of these countries have another football creed as their national game, also played in the Summer, and which for decades forbade its members to play soccer? For 6 decades soccer was played and supported primarily by working class people from urban areas. The rest of the country and much of the cities was owned by the GAA and was an integral part of the community. Soccer could not compete and by the time the ban was lifted, the BIG MATCH, MATCH OF THE DAY etc were being broadcast at the exact same time as the League of Ireland games were on. This is not an excuse. It's a fact and club soccer has been playing catch up and always will in this country behind the GAA. There is huge interest ok in soccer but because of expert way the GAA has sown up the country and parish scene, soccer is on a hiding to nothing as far as the clubs are concered. It's just too difficult to break that stranglehold and whether it's John Delaney, Donald Trump, Pope Francis or whoever in charge of the FAI, it is an almost an impossible task to compete with the GAA because that's what it's about.

This is a long way from getting anywhere but it seems to be picking up momentum. 8k signatures since this morning.

https://www.change.org/p/football-as...ead-of-the-fai

10.5k as of 0830.

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Originally Posted by DeLorean

Some ball of sh!te.

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Well said.

Edit: i looked at the date - I didn't realise it was a year old :) I thought a whole load of stuff on JD had just been written above

I'd say it needs to get to 100k to make much difference. If it gets north of 20k the tabloids will maybe pick up on it which would get it going that bit faster.