Attendances 2023

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Originally Posted by placid casual

But the relative size of dundalk is irrelevant to the discussion.
Why are dundalk the only team getting less fans than last year?
My own guess on that is that these dundalk fans thought the "kenny era" was the norm for dundalk and not the exception. Considering you had a relatively decent season last year (qualifying for europe) one wonders if something else is the reason for the slight decline in numbers.

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It's relevant to the point I responded to though :cool: Which is the limit to the number of fans that Dundalk seem able to attract.

Louth GAA play all their league fixtures on a Friday night this year and it's being played since March and with 5 GAA teams in the town and one in every parish just outside the town definitely impacts the attendances. I know lads who play gaelic who would be at Oriel every night there was no GAA on

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Originally Posted by oriel

A big factor in the Dublin clubs with lesser extent to UCD, is up top 1k, possibly 1500 away fans are going to the derby games, this is boosting figures at Shels and Pats mostly, and probably Rovers, Bohs are at capacity for most games so are fairly consistent.

Now Shels and Bohs are still posting decent home crowds, and fair play, but they will still be getting 1k away fans up to 6 times a year with the upturn in LOI interest, especially in the capital.

Dundalk's may be down a little, but even during SK era and 3 leagues in a row, we only got 4k+ on rare occasions, 3-3.5k big games, but often just below 3k.

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Bohs have a maximum of 450 away fans this season

304 in attendance at UCD.

4754 at Pats Shels in Inchicore. The usual home end sellout with around 700 away fans

https://twitter.com/stpatsfc/status/...413562883?s=46

1,004 in Finn Park.

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Originally Posted by nigel-harps1954

1,004 in Finn Park.

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You said there would be under 1000 , not like you to be so out of touch with whats happening in Harps..

Brandywell sold out as usual but definitely loads of season ticket holders not there. 3,400 est.

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Originally Posted by sbgawa

You said there would be under 1000 , not like you to be so out of touch with whats happening in Harps..

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I have let everyone down and need to apologise.

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Originally Posted by Candystripe

Brandywell sold out as usual but definitely loads of season ticket holders not there. 3,400 est.

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3,274 given on FAI Connect.

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Originally Posted by nigel-harps1954

I have let everyone down and need to apologise.



3,274 given on FAI Connect.

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I was near enough Nigel. If we keep playing like we did in the first half it'll drop below, 3000 during the summer. A terrible 1st half of football.

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Originally Posted by Candystripe

I was near enough Nigel. If we keep playing like we did in the first half it'll drop below, 3000 during the summer. A terrible 1st half of football.

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Still not playing well? From the outside it would have looked like a routine home win.

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Originally Posted by Candystripe

I was near enough Nigel. If we keep playing like we did in the first half it'll drop below, 3000 during the summer. A terrible 1st half of football.

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The covered all seated stand on the east side had a lot of empty seats. It's capacity is approx. 2,500+ and it looked as if 1,500+ were in attendance!

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Originally Posted by sbgawa

You said there would be under 1000 , not like you to be so out of touch with whats happening in Harps..

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At least it was more than my expectation of 999, if it went under the 1,000 mark!

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Originally Posted by culloty82

304 in attendance at UCD.

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There was at least 4 Sligo Rovers flags on display, maybe only 4 away fans as well! :confused:

Well all the College students are gone now as the Campus shuts down generally at this time!

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Originally Posted by nr637

The covered all seated stand on the east side had a lot of empty seats. It's capacity is approx. 2,500+ and it looked as if 1,500+ were in attendance!

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Remember Derry started selling terrace tickets this season for either side of the Mark Farren stand. Unless you've a Southend stand ticket you can't get past the gate to get access to it. They only started doing that 4 weeks ago.

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Originally Posted by placid casual

But the relative size of dundalk is irrelevant to the discussion.
Why are dundalk the only team getting less fans than last year?
My own guess on that is that these dundalk fans thought the "kenny era" was the norm for dundalk and not the exception. Considering you had a relatively decent season last year (qualifying for europe) one wonders if something else is the reason for the slight decline in numbers.

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Its not irrelevant but there is definitely a tendency to overestimate a fanbase and what expectations are. I would say that Dundalk FC have a solid/consistant fanbase of about 2500. To get over 3k regularly a good away crowd is needed. A bumper crowd over 3.5-4k needs to have a side that is competing for the league, against a fellow rival or a big cup tie. A sellout circa 5k would be a winner takes all last night of the season or a cup semi depending on opposition.

The reasons for not having a bigger average attendance are pretty obvious and done to death, ranging from facilities, weather, holidays, current cost of living pressures maybe even LoITV, (of course other clubs also have some or all of these issues too) and clashing with other events - mainly Horse/Dog racing at Dundalk Stadium to the mentioned GAA scheduling, which has been deliberate and targeted ie GAA fixtures between 2 larger Dundalk sides on the same night as a 'Cat A' game in Oriel and similar but to a lesser extent United Park. This isnt a paranoid anti GAA assumption but a genuine openly spoken about issue. When Louth GAA open their new stadium and can play actual home games rather than having to go to Navan eg its already planned to play inter-county league games on the same night. Championship games are scheduled by Croke Park but there will still be some local push to be the Friday night game. As Louth seem to be improving rather than being a basketcase for 40 odd yeays its is an issue of concern for Dundalk and Drogheda United. It will be necessary to counter this with planning fixtures with the FAI either by moving matchnight like S Rovers or looking at the 2 sports home and away sechedules. Local games I cant see much to be done, as Louth GAA have set targets for their own attendance growth to help pay for the County Ground and theyve had green eyes the the potential crowds, seen at LoI games in the 2 towns over the years. Its now less a soccer v GAA thing and more a pragmatic 'we have to come up with new income for this new and now €25million costing stadium (and growing). The County Board and Fitzer may yet rue campaigning against the proposed, costed and Dept of Sport accepted groundshare at/with DkIT!!

Then theres the very Irish bandwagoner who will follow the success rather than their passion for a club or county. LoI fans do seem to like to turn attendances in to some sort of p1ssing match as if it was worth actual league points and I think PC with your stated love for Dundalk FC you are falling in to this puddle of pish - The Kenny Era was over 2018 and the Bradley era and your current norm will end one day also so not sure what that point is? Stats on % of population attendances at games suggest that LoI punches quite well relatively in general as does Dundalk. Averages could and maybe should be better though so we, as a club, should be looking at what can be done and mitigate the plethora of excuses made by the floating fan that is not just the Oriel is a kip laziness. There are probably more pressing issues the club needs to deal with but Id like to see a real push on season tickets during the close season, Id even go as far as employig people to go door to door, look at instalment based payments, and see if there is anything else that could be offered as a season ticket holder bar the overall reduced cost in to games - many people may have €15 a week to go to games but not the guts of €200 in one go and during the expensive christmas period. Are there half season tickets on sale now for example? The very patchy form isnt a help of course, even when winning its a tough watch at the moment and a subsequent drop in crowd does show a fickle side to the Dundalk fanbase. Its hard to break the cycle of a team not inspiring crowds yet the crowds are needed to resource the better calibre of player. The club have been very open about this transition phase, rebuilding, and trying to balance things with qualifying for Europe. Yr1 achieved, great chance to maximise that income with a favourable draw, Yr2 is anyones guess with the way the league is this season but if its success then Yr3 the chips will be down for the squad to get the crowds enthused again!

Very interesting post- As someone who worked in Louth over the years unlike many other provincal towns I would always have considered Dundalk & Drogheda staunch soccer towns . In saying that Dundalk in particular used baffle me with the amount of GAA clubs in the town 6 or 7 from recollection compared to a staunch gaelic football town like Tralee with only 4 or Portlaoise with only 1 gaa club. The one other thing about Dundalk was those coming into the town for work or college came from big GAA areas like Mid Louth, Monaghan & Armagh so we ended up talking more about football than soccer often in the workplace we were in . The Gaelic top 2 league divisions in Louth were also more competitive & well ran than i expected and they used play fri or sat evening to avoid junior soccer on sundays when i was there.With regard to fixtures clashing , there seems to be 3 good times to draw a crowd or play a match , fri evening, sat evening or Sunday but with TV games sundays are used less & Less by all sports so fri & Sat evening only 2 runners for all to play games.
It varies across the country what sports are strongest , in Limerick where i live both Treaty FC & Limerick Footballers struggle to get a 1,000 supporters where as the Hurlers & Munster rugby are massive operations in comparison & could pull anything from 10,000 to 40,000 supporters depending on competition stages, be thankful Rugby & Hurling arent big in Louth !

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Originally Posted by Abbeyman

Very interesting post- As someone who worked in Louth over the years unlike many other provincal towns I would always have considered Dundalk & Drogheda staunch soccer towns . In saying that Dundalk in particular used baffle me with the amount of GAA clubs in the town 6 or 7 from recollection compared to a staunch gaelic football town like Tralee with only 4 or Portlaoise with only 1 gaa club. The one other thing about Dundalk was those coming into the town for work or college came from big GAA areas like Mid Louth, Monaghan & Armagh so we ended up talking more about football than soccer often in the workplace we were in . The Gaelic top 2 league divisions in Louth were also more competitive & well ran than i expected and they used play fri or sat evening to avoid junior soccer on sundays when i was there.With regard to fixtures clashing , there seems to be 3 good times to draw a crowd or play a match , fri evening, sat evening or Sunday but with TV games sundays are used less & Less by all sports so fri & Sat evening only 2 runners for all to play games.
It varies across the country what sports are strongest , in Limerick where i live both Treaty FC & Limerick Footballers struggle to get a 1,000 supporters where as the Hurlers & Munster rugby are massive operations in comparison & could pull anything from 10,000 to 40,000 supporters depending on competition stages, be thankful Rugby & Hurling arent big in Louth !

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Don't forget that Dundak is one a half times bigger than either Tralee or Portlaoise. And Drogheda is a decent big bigger again.

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Originally Posted by EatYerGreens

Don't forget that Dundak is one a half times bigger than either Tralee or Portlaoise. And Drogheda is a decent big bigger again.

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That may be the case but it is true, imo, that there are too many GAA clubs in Dundalk and the county as a whole for its size. Some of the clubs in Dundalk are as a result of fallings out and one club becoming two back in the day. Catchments are strictly divided where one side of a street is one club and the other side another club. Dundalk Gaels looked to sell their ground to Tesco and move to a better purpose built facility but the plan was binned as anywere they could secure as a new home infringed on another clubs catchment area. Most of the clubs are intermediate or junior level in Dundalk itself whiich is due to the diluted talent pool. I dont recall the last Dundalk county champion.

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Originally Posted by Nesta99

Its not irrelevant but there is definitely a tendency to overestimate a fanbase and what expectations are. I would say that Dundalk FC have a solid/consistant fanbase of about 2500. To get over 3k regularly a good away crowd is needed. A bumper crowd over 3.5-4k needs to have a side that is competing for the league, against a fellow rival or a big cup tie. A sellout circa 5k would be a winner takes all last night of the season or a cup semi depending on opposition.

The reasons for not having a bigger average attendance are pretty obvious and done to death, ranging from facilities, weather, holidays, current cost of living pressures maybe even LoITV, (of course other clubs also have some or all of these issues too) and clashing with other events - mainly Horse/Dog racing at Dundalk Stadium to the mentioned GAA scheduling, which has been deliberate and targeted ie GAA fixtures between 2 larger Dundalk sides on the same night as a 'Cat A' game in Oriel and similar but to a lesser extent United Park. This isnt a paranoid anti GAA assumption but a genuine openly spoken about issue. When Louth GAA open their new stadium and can play actual home games rather than having to go to Navan eg its already planned to play inter-county league games on the same night. Championship games are scheduled by Croke Park but there will still be some local push to be the Friday night game. As Louth seem to be improving rather than being a basketcase for 40 odd yeays its is an issue of concern for Dundalk and Drogheda United. It will be necessary to counter this with planning fixtures with the FAI either by moving matchnight like S Rovers or looking at the 2 sports home and away sechedules. Local games I cant see much to be done, as Louth GAA have set targets for their own attendance growth to help pay for the County Ground and theyve had green eyes the the potential crowds, seen at LoI games in the 2 towns over the years. Its now less a soccer v GAA thing and more a pragmatic 'we have to come up with new income for this new and now €25million costing stadium (and growing). The County Board and Fitzer may yet rue campaigning against the proposed, costed and Dept of Sport accepted groundshare at/with DkIT!!

Then theres the very Irish bandwagoner who will follow the success rather than their passion for a club or county. LoI fans do seem to like to turn attendances in to some sort of p1ssing match as if it was worth actual league points and I think PC with your stated love for Dundalk FC you are falling in to this puddle of pish - The Kenny Era was over 2018 and the Bradley era and your current norm will end one day also so not sure what that point is? Stats on % of population attendances at games suggest that LoI punches quite well relatively in general as does Dundalk. Averages could and maybe should be better though so we, as a club, should be looking at what can be done and mitigate the plethora of excuses made by the floating fan that is not just the Oriel is a kip laziness. There are probably more pressing issues the club needs to deal with but Id like to see a real push on season tickets during the close season, Id even go as far as employig people to go door to door, look at instalment based payments, and see if there is anything else that could be offered as a season ticket holder bar the overall reduced cost in to games - many people may have €15 a week to go to games but not the guts of €200 in one go and during the expensive christmas period. Are there half season tickets on sale now for example? The very patchy form isnt a help of course, even when winning its a tough watch at the moment and a subsequent drop in crowd does show a fickle side to the Dundalk fanbase. Its hard to break the cycle of a team not inspiring crowds yet the crowds are needed to resource the better calibre of player. The club have been very open about this transition phase, rebuilding, and trying to balance things with qualifying for Europe. Yr1 achieved, great chance to maximise that income with a favourable draw, Yr2 is anyones guess with the way the league is this season but if its success then Yr3 the chips will be down for the squad to get the crowds enthused again!

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All the club GAA games in Louth have been moved to Saturday nights over the next few weeks as they are having midweek rounds of games too. Pity we have no games at home other than Rovers to compare attendances with other games as we always get a bumper crowd V Rovers and they usually sell out the away end.