John O'Shea

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27/05/2008, 3:23 PM
irishultra

I understand that. The guy must have motivational problems or something. I'm suprised with his mantra he even made it as a footballer. Can't believe he's 27 either.

But if he was a bottom level player, John O'Shea would be playing at the bottom level. Kleberson, Djemba Djemba, Liam Miller etc. have been drafted out, yet people like Fletcher and O'Shea have not.
27/05/2008, 3:32 PM
Speakthetruth

IMO Fletcher has been an addition to Utd & especially to Scotland over the years but thats besides the point. Djemba-Djemba & Kleberson (Have you ever seen there names mentioned separately in a post on here?) were not Premier League players nevermind UTD players so were rightfully turfed out. I dont rate him either but at least Miller has showed a certain level of ambition by getting a move and has played consistanly for a Premiership club this season. In addition, People like Phil Neville, Gabriel Heinze, Rossi & even Johnny Greening have earned my respect by not settling for 5 minute cameos at the end of an already decided match and doing what O'Shea is not, making the difference for their respective clubs by contributing in competitive games.
27/05/2008, 3:54 PM
tricky_colour

Quote:

Originally Posted by irishultra

I understand that. The guy must have motivational problems or something. I'm suprised with his mantra he even made it as a footballer. Can't believe he's 27 either.

But if he was a bottom level player, John O'Shea would be playing at the bottom level. Kleberson, Djemba Djemba, Liam Miller etc. have been drafted out, yet people like Fletcher and O'Shea have not.

Maybe nobody put a bid in :)
27/05/2008, 4:08 PM
irishultra

Quote:

Originally Posted by Speakthetruth

IMO Fletcher has been an addition to Utd & especially to Scotland over the years but thats besides the point. Djemba-Djemba & Kleberson (Have you ever seen there names mentioned separately in a post on here?) were not Premier League players nevermind UTD players so were rightfully turfed out. I dont rate him either but at least Miller has showed a certain level of ambition by getting a move and has played consistanly for a Premiership club this season. In addition, People like Phil Neville, Gabriel Heinze, Rossi & even Johnny Greening have earned my respect by not settling for 5 minute cameos at the end of an already decided match and doing what O'Shea is not, making the difference for their respective clubs by contributing in competitive games.

Would Phill Neville have been the same age as O'Shea is now when he left for Everton?
27/05/2008, 4:13 PM
Speakthetruth

Quote:

Originally Posted by irishultra

Would Phill Neville have been the same age as O'Shea is now when he left for Everton?

I reckon he was a year or so older at a guess (without looking it up) and he is now captaining a side who challenged for a champions league spot this season.
27/05/2008, 4:26 PM
Razors left peg

Quote:

Originally Posted by Speakthetruth

I reckon he was a year or so older at a guess (without looking it up) and he is now captaining a side who challenged for a champions league spot this season.

And for years Phil Neville has had to put up with the same amount of abuse that O Shea gets, and he has proven that he is a good player.
27/05/2008, 4:31 PM
Speakthetruth

Not a chance that was at the same level, I seem to remember a stunning MOTM performance against Arsenal a couple of years back PLUS THE FACT IS HE MOVED, O'SHEA IS NOT GOING TO HENCE WILL NEVER PROVE HIMSELF A GOOD PLAYER!! Even only today Pique (who coincidently was called into centre half when Vidic got injured ahead of the mighty Josh) got a move as he knew he wouldnt get football. John O'Shea is nothing more than a glorified Winston Bogarde, a guy who had potential but has gone stale, willing to stay in the comfort zone and collect his cheque.
27/05/2008, 4:33 PM
Razors left peg

Quote:

Originally Posted by Speakthetruth

Not a chance that was at the same level, I seem to remember a stunning MOTM performance against Arsenal a couple of years back PLUS THE FACT IS HE MOVED, O'SHEA IS NOT GOING TO HENCE WILL NEVER PROVE HIMSELF A GOOD PLAYER!! Even only today Pique (who coincidently was called into centre half when Vidic got injured ahead of the mighty Josh) got a move as he knew he wouldnt get football. John O'Shea is nothing more than a glorified Winston Bogarde, a guy who had potential but has gone stale, willing to stay in the comfort zone and collect his cheque.

I didnt say he shouldnt move, only that he is not as bad as he is made out to be on here
27/05/2008, 4:46 PM
youngirish

Quote:

Originally Posted by Razors left peg

I didnt say he shouldnt move, only that he is not as bad as he is made out to be on here

He's rubbish he wouldn't even shine in a struggling side in the Premiership . Anyone who watches him over the years can clearly see if anything he's being complimented with the great players around him that he's used to at United (even then he is still average at best). When he's playing with less talented individuals at International level he has been consistently one of our worst players.

If Ferguson let him leave he would struggle to get regular football in a poorer team. He's more of the Djemba Djemba ilk than the Phil Neville I reckon.
27/05/2008, 4:54 PM
Razors left peg

Quote:

Originally Posted by youngirish

He's rubbish he wouldn't even shine in a struggling side in the Premiership . Anyone who watches him over the years can clearly see if anything he's being complimented with the great players around him that he's used to at United (even then he is still average at best). When he's playing with less talented individuals at International level he has been consistently one of our worst players.

If Ferguson let him leave he would struggle to get regular football in a poorer team.

I go back to the point that if he was so rubbish he would have been dumped long ago like anyone else that Ferguson thinks is surplus to requirements.
I think his biggest problem with us is lack of confidence(And the fact that he is a bad passer of the ball).In Cyprus couple of years ago(the 1 nil one) the anytime JOS came near us while he was warming up most of the fans were applauding like with the other players but there were a couple of muppets that completely forgot about the game to scream at him and abuse the hell out of him, it was ridiculous and he was close enough to hear every word. Now I know that a pro footballer should be big enough not to be affected by something like that but if its constantly happening it is bound to have an effect.
He is head and shoulders our best option to partner Dunne
27/05/2008, 4:56 PM
youngirish

Quote:

Originally Posted by Razors left peg

I go back to the point that if he was so rubbish he would have been dumped long ago like anyone else that Ferguson thinks is surplus to requirements.
I think his biggest problem with us is lack of confidence(And the fact that he is a bad passer of the ball).In Cyprus couple of years ago(the 1 nil one) the anytime JOS came near us while he was warming up most of the fans were applauding like with the other players but there were a couple of muppets that completely forgot about the game to scream at him and abuse the hell out of him, it was ridiculous and he was close enough to hear every word. Now I know that a pro footballer should be big enough not to be affected by something like that but if its constantly happening it is bound to have an effect.
He is head and shoulders our best option to partner Dunne

I would try St Ledger with Dunne to see how he gets on before the qualification matches kick off. I think we'll struggle badly with a central defensive pairing of Dunne and O'Shea so we need to take a risk in a couple of friendlies beforehand.
27/05/2008, 4:58 PM
Razors left peg

Quote:

Originally Posted by youngirish

I would try St Ledger with Dunne to see how he gets on before the qualification matches kick off.

I havent seen enough of St Ledger to give an opinion of him, but he has alot to prove get into a team ahead of a lad that has just won his 3rd Premiership medal
27/05/2008, 4:58 PM
irishultra

He has a good mentality as well. See what he said about the players learning from Giovanni? That is a good mentality to have, and an important quality in our team.

Has everyone gotten over the idea of O'Shea playing in the middle? What about as a DM in a 3 man midfield?
27/05/2008, 4:59 PM
jmurphyc

Quote:

Originally Posted by Razors left peg

He is head and shoulders our best option to partner Dunne

I'd say he's currently in the top two along with O'Brien, but if he carries on not getting enough game time at Utd then he definitely shouldn't be played. An unfit player has the potential to do a lot of damage to us. I would also say that if McShane starts playing regularly again and getting his confidence back he could come in to the reckoning for a starting spot. I'd love to see O'Shea told that he won't get a starting spot unless he moves club to see if he has any ambition in terms of playing for us and to see how much he cares. To be honest though, I get the feeling he'd choose Utd over us.
27/05/2008, 5:00 PM
youngirish

Quote:

Originally Posted by Razors left peg

I havent seen enough of St Ledger to give an opinion of him, but he has alot to prove get into a team ahead of a lad that has just won his 3rd Premiership medal

C'mon Razors I'd agree with you if he contributed anything to the winning of that medal. Taking this season as an example I could have played in the same games and the same positions JOS has for United and they still would have won both the Premiership and the Champions League.
27/05/2008, 5:02 PM
Razors left peg

Quote:

Originally Posted by jmurphyc

I'd say he's currently in the top two along with O'Brien, but if he carries on not getting enough game time at Utd then he definitely shouldn't be played. An unfit player has the potential to do a lot of damage to us. I would also say that if McShane starts playing regularly again and getting his confidence back he could come in to the reckoning for a starting spot. I'd love to see O'Shea told that he won't get a starting spot unless he moves club to see if he has any ambition in terms of playing for us and to see how much he cares. To be honest though, I get the feeling he'd choose Utd over us.

Agree about McShane, I think it is in him to be a good defender but I think he needs to drop a division and spend a couple of years learning to read the game and the maturity that will come when he gets a bit older.
27/05/2008, 5:02 PM
jmurphyc

Quote:

Originally Posted by Razors left peg

I havent seen enough of St Ledger to give an opinion of him, but he has alot to prove get into a team ahead of a lad that has just won his 3rd Premiership medal

There's no point in throwing in medals to say how valuable a player is for us. Can you tell me which games he earned that medal in? When was the last time he had a really good game for Utd?
27/05/2008, 5:03 PM
Razors left peg

Quote:

Originally Posted by youngirish

C'mon Razors I'd agree with you if he contributed anything to the winning of that medal. Taking this season as an example I could have played in the same games and the same positions JOS has for United and they still would have won both the Premiership and the Champions League.

He has still played 37 games in all competitions, he is a good squad player for United
27/05/2008, 5:05 PM
youngirish

Quote:

Originally Posted by Razors left peg

He has still played 37 games in all competitions, he is a good squad player for United

Many of those are late substitute appearances. He only started 17 games.
27/05/2008, 5:07 PM
Razors left peg

Quote:

Originally Posted by jmurphyc

There's no point in throwing in medals to say how valuable a player is for us. Can you tell me which games he earned that medal in? When was the last time he had a really good game for Utd?

My point is just that until we have seen St Ledger do something apart from help a team avoid relegation from the Championship we have to assume that the lad in the Man United team has the edge on him. I really hope St Ledger is a top player but I havent seen him enough, I doubt that most lads on here have seen him regularly enough suggest that he should be in the team, Preston arent exactly on tv every week

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