Eligibility proposal

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Blanchflower

Which is a misnomer.


Many people, especially those of the older generation, refer to the NI team as "Ireland". It is the inheritor of the original Ireland team, of course, and therefore has more right to the name.

---

It's not a misnomer, it's a fact. But it is a complexn issue reagrding what was considered for years an illegal occupation etc but I doubt any of us realluy want to go there. A misnomer would be people from NI calling themselves British as they're not actually from Great Britain.

How old are we talking here, people in their 90's? And are we just talking about people from the North? Don't see it happening anywhere else. I've never heard a chant of 'Ireland' at an NI game either, serious question, do you chant 'Ireland' or 'Northern Ireland'?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by osarusan

Wikipedia doesn't clear it up much.

The sentence I've emboldened is interesting.

---

It's the sentence that you didn't highlight that's in issue - the official name of the state ie Ireland. According to Blanchflower this is a misnomer but "a misnomer is a term which suggests an interpretation that is known to be untrue."

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Dodge

How is it a misnomer?

---

Is that a serious question?

You don't understand how using the name for the entire island to describe only part of the island is a misnomer?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Drumcondra 69er

It's not a misnomer, it's a fact.

---

Jeez.:(No-one doubts that it is a fact. That doesn't stop it being a misnomer!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Drumcondra 69er

How old are we talking here, people in their 90's?

---

Middle-aged and upwards. Sammy McIlroy, for example, refers to us as Ireland.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Drumcondra 69er

I've never heard a chant of 'Ireland' at an NI game either, serious question, do you chant 'Ireland' or 'Northern Ireland'?

---

"Ireland" was chanted regularly until the early 70s. Not now.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ifk101

It's the sentence that you didn't highlight that's in issue - the official name of the state ie Ireland. According to Blanchflower this is a misnomer but "a misnomer is a term which suggests an interpretation that is known to be untrue."

---

I'm just pointing out that those who ask people like Blanchflower not to use the term "Republic of Ireland" are being, in my own far from humble opinion, pedantic*.

*Not that a discussion of the name of the state is pedantic. But the usage by Blanchflower etc on this thread seems perfectly logical to me in terms of differentiation of two entities.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Blanchflower

Jeez.:(No-one doubts that it is a fact. That doesn't stop it being a misnomer!

---

To be honest, this is nonsense. A misnomer is a commonly held perception which is actually incorrect.

A factually correct term cannot be a misnomer.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Blanchflower

Jeez.:(No-one doubts that it is a fact. That doesn't stop it being a misnomer!



Middle-aged and upwards. Sammy McIlroy, for example, refers to us as Ireland.


"Ireland" was chanted regularly until the early 70s. Not now.

---

When Alsace Lorraine in France was ceeded to Prussia after the Franco Prussian war should the rest of France have stopped refering to itself as 'France'. Not suggesting this is an exact comparison by any means.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by osarusan

To be honest, this is nonsense. A misnomer is a commonly held perception which is actually incorrect.

A factually correct term cannot be a misnomer.

---

No. It is a fact that the official name of the Southern state is "Ireland". That, however, does not mean that the name is not a misnomer, for the Southern state covers only a part of Ireland.

Collins: an incorrect or unsuitable name for a person or thing.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Drumcondra 69er

When Alsace Lorraine in France was ceeded to Prussia after the Franco Prussian war should the rest of France have stopped refering to itself as 'France'. Not suggesting this is an exact comparison by any means.

---

The boundaries of France have fluctuated through time: the boundaries of Ireland are physical (it's an island) and have not fluctuated. Belfast, for example, did not cease to be in Ireland when the Free State was established (much as the IRFU might like to think it).

Is the capitalisation of "S" in "Southern" not an error?

Cyprus

Drumcondra's original post (part of it)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Drumcondra 69er

However, the name of the 26 county State is also Ireland.

---

Your reply

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Blanchflower

Which is a misnomer.

---

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Blanchflower

No. It is a fact that the official name of the Southern state is "Ireland". That, however, does not mean that the name is not a misnomer

Collins: an incorrect or unsuitable name for a person or thing.

---

Even by the definition you've given, it is clearly not a misnomer. As the name of the state is "Ireland", then "Ireland" is a correct and suitable name for it, so it is not a misnomer.

The fact that "Ireland" is the name of both the island itself, and the state which comprises only a part of that island may be confusing, but it is not a misnomer. This is why I quoted from Wikipedia in an earlier post-

Quote:

---

The state known today as the 'Republic of Ireland' is, and has been, known by a number of names, some of which have been controversial. The state's official title, as in the Irish constitution, is simply Ireland (in English) and Éire (in the Irish language). The term the Republic of Ireland (Irish: Poblacht na hÉireann) is rather the official 'description' of the state, as defined by law. The Republic of Ireland is generally used in any context in which it is necessary to distinguish between the state and the island of Ireland as a whole. Short-hand terms such as the Republic,the State and the South, are also used for the same purpose.

---

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Stuttgart88

Is the capitalisation of "S" in "Southern" not an error?

---

No more so than, say, "South Korea".

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by endabob1

Cyprus

---

Far better example then mine.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by osarusan

Even by the definition you've given, it is clearly not a misnomer.

---

Clearly, it is: the state is misnamed because it has given itself a name which describes an entity of which it makes up only part.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by osarusan

As the name of the state is "Ireland", then "Ireland" is a correct and suitable name for it, so it is not a misnomer.

---

It's not suitable since the state only makes up part of the name it has given itself.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Blanchflower

Clearly, it is: the state is misnamed because it has given itself a name which describes an entity of which it makes up only part.


It's not suitable since the state only makes up part of the name it has given itself.

---

CYPRUS??????????????????

Even as a descriptive term "south" isn't wholly accurate and I've always felt that just because part of the island is known as "Northern Ireland" it shouldn't by default suggest that the rest of the island is "Southern Ireland".

Here in London I'm always asked if I'm from "the North" or "the south" and I always say "the east". I get funny looks.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Blanchflower

No more so than, say, "South Korea".

---

that would account for the capitol N in Norn Iron, but not the S in Southern state you insuinated. there has never been nor will there ever be a state known as Southern Ireland, despite how some ignorant Brits try to make out!!!

Cyprus is de jure (if not de facto) one state covering the whole island. In football terms, the Cyprus team officially represents the whole island.

If, however, you recognise the Turkish Republic of Northern Cyprus then, presumably you don't describe the Republic of Cyprus as "Cyprus".

Equally, when discussing the two parts of Cyprus, it is unlikely that you refer to "Cyprus" and "Northern Cyprus".

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Blanchflower

Clearly, it is: the state is misnamed because it has given itself a name which describes an entity of which it makes up only part.

---

no, the name of the state refers to the state only, not the whole island.

Is "Northern Ireland" a misnomer?