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It's very unlikely if he had signed that he'd have played in that match. The experience of Riordan would probably put off most young players from going to Celtic. Personally I'm glad he's chosen a club where he is pretty much guaranteed a starting position as he needs games. At this stage Championship games would be good for him. The only problem is that it means another Irish player will miss out, probably Murphy.Quote:
Originally Posted by galwayhoop
He didnt turn down AC Milan. The fact that celtic were chasing an Arsenal reserve tells you a lot about their standing in world football...
that is not even a valid argument ... by that twisted logic does it mean that man utd would lose to arsenals reserves ... or does the fact liverpool are chasing a hamilton acidemical player show us their standing in world football?Quote:
Originally Posted by Billsthoughts
i think if you read through the thread you'll see i have no problem with stokes going to sunderland, however i don't think that you can call the last 16 of the champions league some make weight european game!
i know it's off topic but i would like to hear eirebhoy's take on the riordan situation at celtic
then why dont you join a celtic forum and you and eirebhouy can discuss celtic matters to your hearts content.....Ireland and celtic are not mutually interchangeable.
there was a simple enough logic at work in previous post....he will be playing a higher standard of football week in week out with sunderland than he would be with celtic.
By the way re Stokes, he played a lot of his games at Arsenal on the wing. Is this just because Arsenal have a lot of reserve forwards or is this potentially where he will play?
look celtic is valid in this scenario as it was one of the options for stokes to join. the riordan situation was raised by another poster and there may be a valid reason why he is not getting 1st team football or it may be the reason why stokes chose not to sign for celtic. therefore valid questionQuote:
Originally Posted by Billsthoughts
i agree with you that celtic and ireland aren't interchangable but celtic are a very valid part of this discussion as are charlton and sunderland.
not convinced that the championship is much higher standard than SPL
But that "logic" was flawed. Outwith two or three teams the Championship is, relatively speaking, of poor quality when compared to previous years. Stokes opted to fatten his bank balance at the expense of developing as a footballer. His loss.Quote:
Originally Posted by Billsthoughts
GH - as for Riordan, he's smartened up his act and will now see more game time as a result. Not sure I like the fact that WGS sees him primarily as a left midfielder - after all, he's scored the best part of sixty goals in the last three seasons playing through the middle - but then I'm not the manager. And WGS is in credit on his decisions as far as I'm concerned.
:ball: PP
how would he develop more as a footballer at celtic then he would at Sunderland?
How????
surely your logic is flawed?
Its a poor league in Scotland full stop.
Why would he go to Celtic?
are tickets for their games against Milan so hard to come by????
Billsthoughts I 100% agree with you. Anyone who would suggest that Stokes would develop into a better player playing against Dunfermiline, Inverness etc week in week out in entirely one sided games needs to pull their head out of their a*se and take a look around. He would have been better sticking to the Arsenal reserves where the quality of players is far better.
Celtic would be a s**t move for him in every way. 4 or 5 games a season against decent opposition is not the way for young players to develop their talents. The SPL has been responsible for developing the skills of exactly 0 top class young players in recent years (that includes McGeady he wouldn't get a run out regularly in a decent league at the moment). At Sunderland if he's a success he will be playing in the Premiership very soon. If he's not f**k him he wasn't good enough. Next.
Celtic would be a s**t move for him in every way. 4 or 5 games a season against decent opposition is not the way for young players to develop their talents. At Sunderland if he's a success he will be playing in the Premiership very soon. If he's not f**k him he wasn't good enough. Next.[/QUOTE]
At last, a bit of sense. Let's not finish him before he has started. If he's going to be a star, let him be. We'll talk him out of the game at this rate! Sunderland it is. Let's take it from there!
Also, we revered Keane as one of our greatest players. Surely we trust him enough to look after one of our brightest talents. He couldn't be in better hands!
Quote:
Originally Posted by pete
There isn't much money in the Championship with most clubs in debt and I doubt if Sunderland are any different. I am not sure where Quinn would get extra money beyond whatever he paid for Sunderland. He's hardly a billionaire. 2 million is quite a lot for a player untested in the hurly burly of the Championship.
With Sunderland on the same pts as Wednesday, I shall be eyeing his progress with interest ;)
I see you're relatively recent to this Forum. There are many who would take a much different view but I do wish Stokes a successful career.Quote:
Originally Posted by DeNiro
After spending 2 mill you'd at least expect Keane to persist with him if he has a slow start to his Sunderland career. He did so with Connolly. At Celtic he could easily turn out to be warming the bench most of the season.Quote:
Originally Posted by DeNiro
Quinn is just the figure head not putting up much money as far as I know.
Wether people agree about keane being one of our greatest players is irrelevant, its fact he was..your forgetting where sunderland were when he took over
I have no doubt Keane will support Stokes because he is one of HIS signings. Managers do that. I don't think his nationality will come in to it at all in the long run. If he doesn't cut the mustard, he'll get rid of him but he will give him a chance because he's signed him. Wonder does it mean the likes of Murphy won't get his game anymore.
Positive vibes from Sunderland fans on the signing:
http://boards.footymad.net/mboard/fm...mid=2134573969
Strachan has been asked about this a lot and he says he see's him as a left sided midfielder. He's up against Maloney and McGeady for a place there. I found it odd that he wasn't getting a lot of action from the bench (why was he signed in the first place?). I don't think Stokes would have been a backup striker. Sno is the youngest player in the squad, was bought for £70k and he was given plenty of chances earlier in the season. If Stokes was on form heading to the Milan match he'd have started.Quote:
Originally Posted by galwayhoop
On paper Celtic doesn't look like a great move because of the league they play in but I think it was certainly the best option. Confidence is just as important as ability in football. Robbie Keane is rarely in form at club level when an Ireland game comes around and it shows. Stokes would be getting plenty of shooting practice and most likely plenty of goals.
Celtic have played almost all of Europe's best teams in recent years. If he's good enough to step up to that level then he's good enough to play for Ireland. As I said, you can always use the poor league excuse but what players has that affected? Larsson? Viduka? Di Canio? van Hooijdonk? Cadete? Nakamura? Sutton? All those players improved in their time at Celtic.
You don't need to be playing week in week out in the premiership to fulfil your potential. Stokes would have played around 15 huge games a season against decent opposition. The rest of the time he's scoring goals and high in confidence. I think Robbie Keane would be much better player for Ireland if he joined Celtic.
He has moved to Sunderland now anyway but you won't keep me away from a Celtic discussion. :)
irrespective of whether you think SPL is better than the Championship or not, i know that the premiership IS a better standard, and there is hope of him playing there next season if Sunderland can get a run of form. That alone would sway myself to join Sunderland if i was the player.
I think we've just seen why Arsen Whinger felt he didn't need Stokes: his babies have just beaten Liverpool's semi-babies 3-6 at Anfield in the Carling Cup quarter final. Some awful defending but enjoyable game it has to be said and Arsenal able to break quickly. He is on record as saying Stokes just wasn't fast enough for a forward of his.
Stoke's chances of getting into the Premiership must be pretty slim, yes Sunderland may make the play offs but thats a bit of a lottery at best a 50/50 chance. Automatic promotion would require a phenomenal run. Charlton with a get out clause, should they drop, would have been a good choice. Maybe he has a get out clause if Sunderland fail to get promoted?
Eitherway I think he is a good buy at £2 million, what he might gain in value outweighs any value he might lose IMO.