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I agree that it's very sad GT to see two young people who should've had long lives ahead of them heading for the grave -but the selfish angle is no worse than with any other substance abuse. You only have to read the "Your drunk stories" thread here to see any number of instances where individuals (myself included) narrowly avoided getting a toe-tag.Quote:
Originally Posted by Green Tribe
People tend to think they're bullet-proof on pretty much any drug.
I don't think it's selfish. It's down to the person themselves to do the drugs and they're hardly thinking about their families at the time.Quote:
Originally Posted by Green Tribe
I just heard on the radio that the second Waterford guy died. It's very sad that these three people have died in such circumstances. I was already put off cocaine by a report in IT a while back, this just reinforces it.
I'll find it interesting to see how the tabloids portray these three deaths over the next few days. Will they publicly criticise Katy French's drug use and vilify her, like they did to Kate Moss? Or will they go with an approach that suggests "she didn't know what she was doing"?
And how will they portray the two Waterford lads? Will they get as much press as Katy French?
The photos of George Best on his deathbed hasn't put anyone off drink abuse, so I doubt this episode will put anymore people off cocaine.Quote:
Originally Posted by Green Tribe
Imo, what should be done is to hold up these three cases as examples that anyone in any economic situation can be affected by this drug and that the risks are equal for everyone.
Make that 3Quote:
Originally Posted by Green Tribe
http://www.rte.ie/news/2007/1208/waterford.html
Tragic
Every line has a grey cloud.
Excuse the jumbled cliché, it just neatly captures my sentiments; that the silver lining to this cloud is that the media publicity WILL have an affect on the attitudes of some of the takers of the extortionately priced, and extremely unhealthy drug (vis-a-vis its bedfellow ecstasy for eg) that is cocaine. It's very easy to become addicted to coke and because it doesn't alter one's consciousness all that much consumers don't think it could be doing them much harm. Similarly, the day after is a breeze compared to a proper alcohol hangover so in some cases people may look at it as actually being good for them!
More importantly for me though is that the media onslaught should provide a wake-up call to analyse the broader problem of Ireland's addictions generally, with emphasis on the over-indulgence of alcohol, a significant contributory factor in so many deaths, and bad health generally.
I think it's somewhat disingenuous of people to be vitriolic towards people who take drugs when they themselves may have a dependence on alcohol. It's one and the same issue for the most part; relying on substances to fill some self-imagined void. Moderation is acceptable, excess isn't. Education is key in my opinion. For example, the Herald reported that she had taken a mix of pills and coke. If she did then the chances of death are dramatically increased. I don't think many people realise the dangers of poly-drug use. Unfortunately, our Minister for Drugs (something Carey?) seems like a retard, an eyes-to-heaven sort from the 'well whad'ya expect kids, drugs kill' school of thought. People will always take drugs, educate them on how they work and how they may be bad for you, ie respect people, then you'll begin to see improvements. Being snotty and just castigating people is useless. Just good parenting really isn't it?! :)
what a post extremely well written, dead right in all you say:)
right!!!!!:confused:Quote:
Originally Posted by SaucyJack
its dave chapelle, the american comedian.
Rick James used to use coke as the reaosn behind some of his strange behaviour!
Quote:
Originally Posted by kingdom hoop
Id say for every 1000 people taking coke this media coverage might make 1 stop for good 3 or 4 stop for a weekend or so (untill they have a few pints).
The rest will pile out the excuses to themselves to make it ok. At the weekend i heard
the mixing drugs excuse ( they took coke pills speed etc)
The they where up for days thursday night friday sat sun .
Even redbull got blamed.
The problem is people that take drugs just dont believe what the goverment tell them why ? because its normaly a load of bull. 1500 people die from lung cancer each year that figure rises to nearly 5,000 with other smoking related deaths , its the same for deaths from drink. thousands die each year from legal doctor prescibed drugs. So a goverment that profits from selling these drugs, tell you not to take the illegal ones that they dont make any money out of its very hard to believe them.
These kind of deaths are totally avoidable through eductation but the goverment still take the "drugs are bad , dont do drugs " approach
Edit :
Just been on the news that there are 2 more guys in hospital in critical condition from coke.
probably should be split but didnt want to start another thread. I said it earlier, but if this is true, there must be some dodgy coke going about at home....
its being cut with rat poison and horse tranquiliser ketamine, in all fairness you would go out to the shed at home or the traps at work and sniff the poison , so why in hell would you pay for it and snort it up your nose , fools
All coke in ireland is cut you will never get "pure" coke the amount of coke in what people are buying is between 7 and 45%, the rest could be anything.
Other drugs in recent years were cut with strychnine and rat poison. What amazes me is some people are sceptical about the pharmaceutical industry, and last weeks programme Prime Time Investigates would give some credence to that. However, they have no problem trusting a Columbian drug dealer......Quote:
Originally Posted by anto1208
They have no option !Quote:
Originally Posted by CollegeTillIDie
True. I'm just about to finish a placement at a Substance Misuse service here in England and the stories i've heard about what local dealers have used to 'bulk' up cocaine, herion etc would make your eyes water.Quote:
Originally Posted by anto1208
I know its stating the blatantly obvious, but these dealers are unscrupulous beyond belief. If anything, it makes me feel more sorry for people who are so desperate they feel the need to put this rubbish into thier bodies.
RIP Katy French
Obviously it's very much conjectural, but I think the effect may be a little more profound.Quote:
Originally Posted by anto1208
The Rubicon to be crossed in relation to addictions is acknowledging that there actually is a problem. It usually takes something stark for people to appreciate their problems. A spate of highly publicised drug-related deaths should be such a spur in this case. People are ripe for manipulation through the media, hopefully this will be one of the rare times something good can come out of such gullibility.
Just like there are still crime gangs long after the Veronica Guerin murder so there will still be cocaine abuse after Katy Frenchs death.
Nothing will change. We've had all this media hysteria before after the death of Lea Betts after taking E in 1995. There'll be the usual fist shaking and outpour of outrage from the press coupled with initiative after initiative from the government but it'll pass.Quote:
Originally Posted by kingdom hoop
Found it interesting that Bertie sent a representative to Katy French's funeral. I wonder will he send one to Kevin Doyle or John Grey's funeral.
Nothing will come of it...Wouldnt mind but the biggest joke is, that about 20 times more people die from drink related deaths per year, and you dont see people goin into a frenzy about that. Aswell as that 55 homeless people died on the street in 2007, nothing being done about that either...
They are going over board on the Katy French thing aswell which is very annoying. 9 pages in the Irish Independent about it yesterday..9 pages.... And saying she was 'Irelands Princess Diana'...it was sad but we have to get a grip, at the end of the day she was a coked up glamour model ffs
I didnt want to say it, but ya exactly.Quote:
Found it interesting that Bertie sent a representative to Katy French's funeral. I wonder will he send one to Kevin Doyle or John Grey's funeral.
I hear today 24-year-old from Bray died of a suspected drug overdose and there was the two lads in the Midlands at the weekend just shows that no matter how much hype and coverage Katy French is given, drugs will still be done.
in fairness if you expected much else you were gravely naive, what makes her death from coke any more hard hitting that the boys in waterford...
The fact that she is a public in your face person? Its no difference to the families but like it or not "celebrities" sell things. In this case Katy is selling the "don't do coke" message.
How the hell is she selling the 'Don't Do Coke' message?
Look kids I mixed coke with heroin and now I'm dead, next time cut out the heroin and make sure your dealer isn't a complete plank or else you'll end up like me, dead.
She took drugs, she went overboard, she paid the unfortunate price. Any of us who do take, or have taken, coke, ecstacy, ketamine, what have you, know the score when it comes to over-doing it, it's not a tragedy simply because it happend to a pretty, rich Dublin girl. If it happened to me two weeks ago the small column in the paper would have probably called me a Limerick junkie, because it happened to her she's suddenly Ireland's Diana? Odd that I remember everyone I know calling her an annoyance before she got carried away at a party.
Am not saying she personally is selling that message coz being dead its kinda hard to do, but they are now using her as a poster campaign for the anti drugs message and tbh bringing it to a very base level, if I can use her mistake to keep my kids away from drugs I will.
And the 2 lads from Waterford got a lot of coverage too so your whole "junkie from Limerick" agrument doesn't stand up sir.
They only got that much coverage because it was the same week Katy French died, otherwise they would have dropped off the papers fairly lively. Not to mention they were relegated to the sidelines in every paper. Plus the papers would have called them junkies if it wasn't the same week she died, they always look down their noses at ordinary drug users and decry them as filth. Katy French however is a lost flower or some crap like that? Absolute ********Quote:
Originally Posted by Magicme
If the media really wanted to make a difference they would out every drug taker in their circle, from ****** ****** to *** *****(not sure if either do take drugs, just using their names) and show how big the problem is. They also wouldn't have promoted Katy French's lifestyle as being ideal when they knew it wasn't, unless of course they all take drugs as well and don't see a problem with it :eek:
in fairness jebus the incident with the 2 lads in waterford got a lot of coverage initially when they were brought to hospital, the reason why their deaths didnt get as much coverage is because their story had been in the news for a week or so and the katy french incident came to light, they didnt receive the same amout of coverage as they were not 'famous' but they got quite a bit.
and magicme what are you gonna tell your kids? "once upon a time there was a beautiful girl, she had fame and money and the adulation of idiots, she took cocaine and didnt live happily ever after"
Magicme, if you'd like to inocculate your kids against the prefered method of Coke/powdered substance abuse you could do worse than copy my Mams tactic of inadvertently exposing me to every cold, flu, bug, germ available as young as possible leading to adenoidectomy and tonsilectomy.Quote:
Originally Posted by Magicme
I couldn't snort if I wanted to ...and believe me, as a younder idiot I tried to a couple of times (speed) and bled like a pig within seconds. It was like the feckin Somme ...with me stopping a canon round with my face.
I dont have to. They have watched the news and we have discussed the lads in Waterford and Katy. I happened to comment that she was a beautiful, intelligent young woman and my eldest son said "she cant have been that intelligent if she took drugs". I wanted to leap to her defence but I stayed stum as if he can think that only an idiot does drugs that is all the better.Quote:
Originally Posted by inexile
Would it not make more sense to propoerly educate them on what drugs do , how to react if you find yourself in trouble ( spiked ) rather than using a person that over did it and died as an example. What possible advice from that situation could you use ? dont stay up for 3 days partying on coke pills vodka red bull and speed balls. Actually teach them how to take drugs responsibly. ( i know how crazy that sounds)Quote:
Originally Posted by Magicme
Problem is using things like that to scare kids out of doing drugs back fires because people lump in all drugs they say cannabis will do xyz to you then kids smoke a joint and what happens they have a good time , then they think hey we got lied to i wonder what else they lied about ill try pills , and they have a good time and again think we got lied to again lets have some coke and again they have a good time. then they get it into there heads that drugs are safe ( which they certainly arent ) and start looking for bigger highs stronger stuff mixing drugs etc that how they get into trouble.
Chances are your kids will come in contact with drugs they may not take them but they will be around them they will be tempted they may find themselves in trouble , goverment figures show 51% of people under 25 have tried some drug .using that figure if you have 2 kids at least one will chance it.
I know i wont want my kids to get a criminal record , long lastign health problems or even die from missusing drugs ill be teaching them the facts not scare mongering.Or teaching them to be condesending little *ssholes that look down there nose at people that take drugs.
Humans have used drugs from thousands of years the body can hadle it if used properly the problem is the force explosion of potency of drugs that the war on drugs has pushed.
I agree Jebus 100%,Quote:
Originally Posted by jebus
not sure if Dahamsta will be happy with libelist comments though :)
Next time I'll call them ****** G and R ****** :pQuote:
Originally Posted by citizenerased
Actually a question for the right on brigade here that think drug takers are some form of scum. What would you do if you found out your brother/sister/son/daughter/mother/father/partner had taken, or is taken drugs? Would your opinion of them be less than it is now?
Didnt she try that message a couple of weeks before she died?Quote:
Originally Posted by Magicme
11 pages taken up in some newspapers today about her and her funeral, glorifying a girl who was known for her looks. Its not a career, its a job you can hold while you look beautiful and young.
If it was Joe Soap down the road, how quick are people to point the finger and call them junkies. Her case has been glorified, Michael Healy Ray even referring to her as "Our Diana". Come off it. You have the ability to say no, no matter what circle you are associated with. I have great sympathy for her family, they're the ones left to pick up the pieces and go through the hurt and pain this has caused, just like the families in Waterford and else where.
Someone actually said that? And not in a sarcastic way? :eek:Quote:
Originally Posted by Maz
It was Michael Healy Ray and had been a headline on one or more of the tabloids
If she was Ireland's Princess Di, why didn't we have a day off work for her funeral?
I would compare her more to that vacuous wench sophie anderton than diana spencer/windsor/al fayed ?
who gives a schesser about diana, seriouslly.
Same type of person who gives a schesser about Katy French I supposeQuote:
Originally Posted by paul_oshea
So are you saying I'm "right on brigade" coz I dont want my kids to do drugs, that I dont agree with drug taking? Get over yourself. When you have kids you will understand.Quote:
Originally Posted by jebus
As for the thinking less of people coz of drugs thing thats bull. You love the person but not what they are doing. My marriage was pretty much ruined by drugs so I know what the impact of them can be. Not in all cases obviously but potentially.
Anyway this is all off the point. Another young lad has died needlessly this week.
Not once have I ever called anyone, never mind a drug user, scum.
Moi??;)Quote:
Originally Posted by Maz