yah i get ya could be the spindoctors earning their crust sometimes i think the whole world is existing on 'SPIN' nothing is 'REAL' anymoreQuote:
Originally Posted by BohsPartisan
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yah i get ya could be the spindoctors earning their crust sometimes i think the whole world is existing on 'SPIN' nothing is 'REAL' anymoreQuote:
Originally Posted by BohsPartisan
I think the obstructors should be arrested & forced to give undertaking to obey the law. The state was too soft on the Rossport 5 releasing them while in contempt of court. Clearly being soft on law breakers encourages them to continue to break the law...
Quote:
Originally Posted by pete
Yeah I think we know what you think Pete. :rolleyes:
im all for peacefull protest but this isnt they have attacked cops and the workers who are just trying to make a living .
cops have been taken away from where they are needed to drag these morons of the street .Glin in co. limerick has been left with out any gaurds .
what im ****ed off about is that the goverment gave away this massive resorce of natural gas worth trillions and while bord gais up there prices yet again .
The cops attacked the protesters. There have been plenty of media lies about protesters threatening people etc. but no evidence of such. Media reports are always from "a unnamed source". Have a look at the link I posted to the coverage of the coverage in one of my earlier posts.Quote:
Originally Posted by anto1208
As I've said, Shell's private boot boys.Quote:
cops have been taken away from where they are needed to drag these morons of the street .Glin in co. limerick has been left with out any gaurds
Blame the government and their ideological outlook, not the protesters.
Agreed. Join the dots with the above so.Quote:
what im ****ed off about is that the goverment gave away this massive resorce of natural gas worth trillions and while bord gais up there prices yet again .
I am going to split the socialism debate into a new thread. As a Moderator I am never off topic (I can just change thread title) :D
well i saw it with my own eyes a protester striking a gaurd so thats clearly true.Quote:
Originally Posted by BohsPartisan
if i was laying on the driveway in front of your house stopping you from going to work what would you do ??
if you try to move me yourself you could end up with an assault charge so you call the gaurds who would pick me up ,move me and let you go about your day .
thats all thats happening here shell cant move them themselves as they would get the arses sued of them, so they call the gaurds who are then being accussed of assault .... im sorry its not assault for a gaurd to take you off the main road ..its common sence .
You could be lying. I don't know you so how do I know you're not. Even if what you are saying is true there might be a context and it is nothing to the mass assault the cops have carried out on protesters.Quote:
Originally Posted by anto1208
That isn't what is happening here they are blocking the site not the workers' homesQuote:
if i was laying on the driveway in front of your house stopping you from going to work what would you do ??
Thats not all the Gardaí are doing. They're actually beating up protesters. Protesters have ended up in Casualty - not big burley men mind, aul fellas and women, no Gardaí have.Quote:
thats all thats happening here shell cant move them themselves as they would get the arses sued of them, so they call the gaurds who are then being accussed of assault .... im sorry its not assault for a gaurd to take you off the main road ..its common sence .
I have had first hand experience of "justice" Gardaí style. When it comes to policing protests the Gardaí are thugs (once the numbers are stacked in their favour).
[QUOTE=BohsPartisan;558529]
That isn't what is happening here they are blocking the site not the workers' homes
QUOTE]
fine what would you do if i was laying on the road into your work ?
[QUOTE=BohsPartisan;558529]
That isn't what is happening here they are blocking the site not the workers' homes
QUOTE]
fine what would you do if i was laying on the road into your work ?
plus context or not if they weren't breaking the law the law wouldnt have to remove them , its an offence to make a public nusance of yourself no matter how right you think you are .
do you think the cops honestly want to be there getting abused by these people , dragging old women off the streets .
while im sure some cops are heavy handed these people are asking for it so ive no sympathy at all
[QUOTE=anto1208;558562][QUOTE=BohsPartisan;558529]
That isn't what is happening here they are blocking the site not the workers' homes
Its a daft proposition. If you were laying there because the organisation I work for was endangering your life I would say fair play to you, then I would use my union branch comittee position to try and get our union to back you and presurise the employers into desist from whatever they were doing to endanger your life, your family, your community or whatever.Quote:
fine what would you do if i was laying on the road into your work ?
[QUOTE=BohsPartisan;558796][QUOTE=anto1208;558562]Quote:
Originally Posted by BohsPartisan
im not a member of a union i work hard for my money :D :D
While i agree with that statement lets try keep it on topic.Quote:
Originally Posted by anto1208
From what I can tell this is what is happening:
Protestors are blocking the entrance to the Shell construction site.
Gardai try to remove the protestors by picking them up or dragging them (no other way to do this).
They will get scratches from being dragged on the ground.
If the protestors resist by pushing the gardai or other means then they can be arrested for attacking the gardai.
This is a law & order issue, the gardai have no option but to do what they are doing & seems they are being as reasonable as can be expected.
There are pictures on Indymedia of a female protester being grabbed by the throat by a Garda and pictures of the marks on her throat afterwards. Did I not post the link to that? I've been at a sit down protest before where the Gardaí did not drag people away (which is what you expect and accept) bu tcame in hitting people who were defenseless with their batons. Of course they had removed their numbers. You expect to get dragged away. The usual thing is to make it hard for them rather than actually fight back.Quote:
Originally Posted by pete
Good enough for her to be honestQuote:
Originally Posted by BohsPartisan
If this is true, it's nice to see the guards are finally starting to get fed up. Their lily-livered approach to the whole thing so far was starting to grate. Water Cannon and riot police should have been deployed up there weeks ago
Didn't these protesters mammys ever tell them there's no use crying over spilt milk? Stopping people doing their jobs and intimidating people over spilt milk would be ridiculous if it wasn't so dangerous
I have to say that is a dispciable attitude and if it happened your wife or mother you wouldn't be too happy about it. The woman was engaged in a peaceful protest. If they drag her out of the way fair enough but grabbing her by the throat? If you think that's ok I hope you are someday the victim of police brutality. :mad:Quote:
Originally Posted by Lim till i die
As for the "intimidation", you are still believing media lies even though you know the media lie about people in Limerick?
Of course I've been the victim of police brutality. It all depends on what you define as brutality though because with the benefit of hindsight I probably deserved it at least half the timesQuote:
Originally Posted by BohsPartisan
My wife or mother wouldn't be stupid enough or pig-headed enough to get into that situation in the first place.
Peaceful protest my eye - They're OBSTRUCTING work
Quite frankly if you don't want to be caught by the throat don't get involved in idiotic protests
As for the intimidation I believe my fathers friend who called to the house the other day. He doesn't work for Shell, he's not American, he's not a PD, hes not the devil, he's just an ordinary man who lives in county Mayo and is disgusted by what he's seen and heard in his locality. Now maybe he's a liar, maybe all the people who have spoken to him are liars. But isn't it just as likely that the "protesters" are liars..........
He could well be disgusted by something he's "heard" but who's to say if what he's heard is true or not. Who's to say how easily he gets disgusted. Thats the beauty of hearsay.
Obstruction does not = violence. Was Ghandi a violent protester. Martin Luther King? Yet these were tactics he espoused. When cops beat up people they are breaking the law but who are you going to complain to? The cops? Give me a break.
Who's to say what you hear isn't lies? Who's to say how easily you get disgusted? The beauty of hearsay indeed......Quote:
Originally Posted by BohsPartisan
Where did I say obstruction = violence??
You want to know what else Obstruction doesn't equal? - Protest ;)
Are you seriously trying to compare the various ranchers, middle-class types and busy bodies protesting in Mayo with Gandhi and Martin Luther King :eek:
Don't get me wrong I never had much time for Dr. King but cripes man :eek:
I stand by my opinoin that that "protester" got what was coming to her. If she wasn't there it wouldn't have happened and quite frankly the guards have shown unbelieveable restraint throughout, Although whether they would have showed such restraint if faced with a working class crowd is debateable and possibly an issue for another day
I can't believe what I'm reading.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lim till i die
1. I personally know people who have been at the solidarity camp in Rossport. I believe what they say because I know they have witnessed this first hand. They have no track record of lying and don't see why they would start now.
2. As I said I have first hand experience of police brutality at peaceful protests.
3. Obstruction can = protest it is a valid tactic which is often used (I mentioned MLK because he espoused this tactic)
4. The Morris tribunal has attested to the fact that the cops are corrupt, plant evidence, fabricate testimony etc.
Join the dots.
Moderator: We have discussed this for 6 pages now, lets keep it on topic & no personal attacks.
======================================
I don't think either side will agree at this stage.
One side believes obstruction is valid protest while the other side believes it is illegal.
Interestingly Peter Cassells was appointed to the mediation group which recommended the pipeline route be altered. Shell agreed to this too. Has he betrayed his former unions colleagues? Does ICTU or SIPTU have an opinion on this topic?
Cassells betrayed the trade union movement along time ago. Himself and the ICTU leadership are quite right wing. Not sure what position Siptu took, I know both them and ICTU made muted protests against the jailings of the Rossport 5.
1. I think Pete may be right :eek: :p we've actually descended into he said- she said type nonsenseQuote:
Originally Posted by BohsPartisan
2. Boo Hoo Hoo
3. What they are doing by blocking the road is ILLEGAL.
4. Really?? The Morris tribunal has said all guards are corrupt, plant evidence, fabricate testimony etc. That's news to me........
It said corruption is widespread, thats a pretty damning indictment of the institution.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lim till i die
As for the protest being illegal, to quote you "boo-hoo". Torture is legal in the US, doesn't make it right. The law is set up to suit the rich, of course something that challenges a big multinational's interests is going to be illegal and quite frankly AFAIK to resist unjust laws is just. I'm far more concerned to see justice done than the law observed to the letter.
So the law should be a matter of opinion from person to person about what's just and what isn't??Quote:
Originally Posted by BohsPartisan
I think it's unjust that that mass-mudering Hutu Asylum-seeking scum you and your ilk are protecting is living like a lord off my families taxes. Is it OK if I track him down and bash his head in with a large piece of lead pipe because in my opinion the law which would prevent me from doing so is in this case "unjust"
No. The law should reflect what is in the interest of the majority not a smalll minority of filthy rich blaggers. But that really belongs in the Socialism threadQuote:
Originally Posted by Lim till i die
Believe me, you couldn't possibly live like a lord on what Asylum seekers get from the state. Again thats another thread but safe to say I'm somewhat of an expert on this matter as I compile stats for a major government department that deals with this type of thing.Quote:
it's unjust that that mass-mudering Hutu Asylum-seeking scum you and your ilk are protecting is living like a lord off my families taxes.
I'd imagine you could live like a Rwandan lord ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by BohsPartisan
Pipeline route now defunct, Shell to pay legal costs
Very good news for Shell to Sea from the High Court today.
* The stance of the Rossport Five and Brid McGarry has been legally vindicated.
* The original pipeline route through Rossport is now defunct.
* Shell will have to pay the €1 million costs, including those of the Rossport landowners.
Read all about it!
Whatever about land rights & other issues the Rossport 5 were jailed for contempt of court so that was legal.
I have a mate who goes up to Rossport regularly, as he's doing a photographic piece about it, he said the greatest moment of his life came on Monday, at the public meeting, when 5(or maybe he said 6) Black Panthers from America came to the meeting in support, and did their clenched fist salute
LMAO :D :D :DQuote:
Originally Posted by jebus
On RTEs focus group programme 'Frank Opinion' last sunday lots of the people (from the West) complained about An Taisc & An Bord Pleanala preventing development & stopping jobs being created. There was no mention of Rossport but they mentioned a fish farm & maybe hotel. Would be interesting to know what Shell to Sea people felt about development...
Thats a silly statement Pete. The choice being posed isn't developement or none, the choice is safe, planned, sane developement or unsafe, haphazard, insane developement.
Hmmmm. What was the first one again?
I am sure Shell wouldn't see it in their best interests to build an unsafe terminal/pipeline etc. This has been one big campaign of misinformation, hi-jacked by Sinn Feinn and "Socialists" etc.
Due process has occurred and planning permission was granted. Now move on.
:rolleyes:Quote:
Originally Posted by Philly
Are you sure there weren't freemasons involved too?
Its in Shels best interest to do whatever makes the most profit. Do you remember Ed Norton's job in Fight Club? He used to check out potentially life threatening faults in cars, work out how many fatalities it would lead to, then see which would be cheaper, fixing the problem or stumping up a little bit for compensation. That is the rule of thumb Shel would be following here.
No one is saying that the pipeline is anymore unsafe in itself than any other gas pipeline, just that the potential for disaster exists and as such they should be kept away from populated areas.
By the way, have you not read the article? The Compulsory Purchase Order has been overturned!
but Shels have been making losses for plenty of seasons now :DQuote:
Originally Posted by BohsPartisan
Is that why Shels supremo is called Oily?Quote:
Originally Posted by BohsPartisan
:D :D :D
BohsPartisan
http://www.bbc.co.uk/comedy/guide/im...yspecial_1.jpg
Socialism is an inhuman control mechanism and it is always doomed to failure - unless you force people to follow it with machine gun towers, Iron curtains, secret police, gulags and propaganda. Even then they will rise up eventually.
I never met a single Socialist/Marxist who was not some kind of middle-class control freak who hated humans (especially working class people) following their own personal choices in life.
Does every thread involving Bohs Partisan have to turn into a debate on the merits or lack thereof of socialism? I'm not sure whether it's more annoying, stupid or boring, but it's disruptive whether or which so could BohsPartisan shut up about it, and/or everyone else ignore BohsPartisan?
KTHXBYE,
adam