I think his point was that there wouldn't be too many people unhappy if barca won it as at least they play good football. Of course most people (Irish anyway) will back the under dog)
BTW barca have only won it once (14 years ago...)
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I think his point was that there wouldn't be too many people unhappy if barca won it as at least they play good football. Of course most people (Irish anyway) will back the under dog)
BTW barca have only won it once (14 years ago...)
Quote:
Originally Posted by londonirish17
Porto have one the European Cup more times that Barcelona. I think that Barca have invested in home grown talent also. Puyol, Messi to name but too but there is a whole load more. I think Lyon are a joy to watch so I would not mind seeing them win. To be honest my original post was that Barca would be the neutrals choice and while there may be the odd exception of people going for Villareal, not sure why as they play pretty defensive football and have just as many foreign players as Barca do.
Messi is an argie
I know that but he has been at the club since he was 9.
When they say homegrown or invest in youth talent I think Messi can fall under that category.
9??? thats messed up..
you have dug your own pedantic grave there anyway Neil.
he isnt from barcelona so he isnt homegrown talent. .
and is there that many actual homegrown players at barca? seemed a lot fo foreign players there as far as I could see...
Not if you read the thread Klein. I was responding to London irish who said that Villareal and Porto have more homegrown players or invested in youth development than the likes of Barca have.
In the sense of bringing your own playes through well Messi is homegrown. If he was born in Madrid it would still not be homegrown so. Do we want the player to be born on the Nou camp and his mothers legs akimbo on the penalty spot. Homegrown in club footballing terms means been brought through the youth structure etc not the place of birth.
Are you inventing your own language here or what? homegrown means homegrown...Quote:
Originally Posted by NeilMcD
Ok so define a homegrown player in relation to club football then.
Is David Beckham homegrown for Man Utd as he was born in London
Is Gary Neville homegrown for Man utd as he was born in Bury
You can take this to the nth degree. To me homegrown in the context of producing players is a player that is developed by the club before they are a pro and makes it to the 1st team. Place of birth is not an issue because where do you draw the boundary of the place of birth
Messi made his first team debut for Rosario when he was 8.
What team was that though was it the senior team.
not according to new UEFA rules.Quote:
Originally Posted by klein4
Players such as Messi, Senderos etc are considered homegrown due to the number of years spent in youth development at a given club.
In a football sense the term 'homegrown' isn't linked to nationality according to both the World and European Governing bodies of the game.
liverpool to go out and arsenal to win competition outright.....
And also there are rules in england about where you can get your academy players from...so are uefa rules better than FA rules?????
My God Neil!!!Quote:
Originally Posted by NeilMcD
Are you making a joke?????
No he ****ing didn't...Quote:
Originally Posted by NeilMcD
Well in an interview he did for a a Uefa magazine programme he said that he was training with Barcelona since he was 9 and they have been giving him growth hormones to help him grow. He visited Barcelona regularly as a kid to train and meet the players. Pretty much the same way Beckham did also. In my view Messi is considered as homegrown as far as Barca is concerned the same way that Beckham is and Neville is for Utd and Senderos is for Arsenal. As karlos said nationality has nothing to do with this as its clubs we are talking about.
Quote:
Originally Posted by klein4
I am asking the question. The guy said He was in the Rosario 1st team at 8 so wondering what relevance that has to do with the thread.
He joined Barcelona when he was 13. He was signed by them in Argentina. One of the main reasons his family moved was the medical support
Did I say he signed for them at 9 no, I said that he was at the club from 9 which is fact.
The FA have rules regarding players under a specific age (14, I believe) only being able to sign for a club within their catchment area. Uefa rule governs players trained during competitive developmental years (typically 14 and up) for a particular length of time at a club (e.g. Messi at Barca). The FA being members of UEFA will follow that rule.Quote:
Originally Posted by klein4
In terms of football going forward, at Arsenal for example the likes of Fabregas, Sendreros, Lupoli etc will qualify as homegrown players despite starting their careers elsewhere and holding a different nationality due to years spent in youth development.
I'm open to correction on any of this but that's my undserstanding of the rule.
No he wasn't. He first moved to Barcelona when he was 13.
FACT!
So Karlos would you agree then that Messi is a homegrown player for Barcelona.
so Neil would you agree that you lied about when messi started at barcelona in order to lend your point more weight?
I would however I'll leave you lovers to debate the merits of it!!! :D :)Quote:
Originally Posted by NeilMcD
I did not lie. Messi said in an interview that he has been at Barca since the age of 9. He visited the club since that age but he could not sign terms as he was too young.
You'll need to produce that article Neil
http://www.fcbarcelona.com/eng/notic...05021416.shtml
http://www.uefa.com/competitions/UCL...803/index.html
http://www.google.ie/search?q=messi+...=&start=0&sa=N
It was an interview on one of those Uefa Magazine Champions League shows. He said he visited Barcelona at the age of 9.
Ah the backtrack begins...
No backtrack at all, I never said he signed for Barca at 9 I said he was at Barca at 9 which is fact.
klein4 can take over from here...
Club or city?Quote:
Originally Posted by NeilMcD
I was at barcelona when I was nine,,.,,does that make me their homegrown talent????????
no! unless of course you signed a scholar or professional contract in subsequent years and got educated on the game by the coaches of Barcelona? It's plainly obvious that never happened. :D :D :)Quote:
Originally Posted by klein4
ah...as they say in France...those who can,can and those who cant ....teach...
Well if that is a dig against Karlos and his coaching its a pretty bad one. I think anybody who puts as much into the game as the coaches do should be applauded for that.
Also Its pretty obvious what has happened here.
Messi was spotted by Barcelona playing in Argentina at a very young age. He visisted Barcelona as a guest of the club from the age of 9. He kept in contact and was watch and recognised that he had a growth problem. As a result when he signed for the club aged 13/14 he was offered medical help by the club and he and his parents moved to Barcelona where he has been ever since. In footballing terms and in the terms that the origingal point was made in relation to Porto and Villareal having homegrown talent, Messi is a homegrown player. I dont think that it could be argued that Villareal have more of an emphasis on homegrown talent than Barelona do. Barelona have produced many young players throughout the years. The original point I made a long way back was that the majority of netural fans seem to want Barcelona to win the Champions League, I think thats a fair assumption. For those that want the smaller club to go through like Porto and Villareal I would argue that Porto have won more Champions League than Barcelona so the argument of same name on the trophy does not hold up there. In relation to producing homegrown talent I dont think that holds up either.
speaking of the French, one of those that 'can't', just guided his side to the quarter finals of the champions league. So there is success in failure. :eek:Quote:
Originally Posted by klein4
:eek: sounds like you wouldnt mind a bit of "Karlos-coaching" yourself if ya know what I mean ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by NeilMcD
Neil - with regards Messi you were wrong(..possibly telling fibs) . accept it and move on.
Karlos - as a great man once said...."there really aint no success like failure...and failures' no success at all..." Houllier is the perfect example of a man who knows the price of everything and the value of nothing. crap manger - out next round.
Stop trying to justify tht 9 year old comment Neil. Let it go...
Stop the pettiness lads.