Top of the league and still in Europe :pQuote:
Originally Posted by holidaysong
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Top of the league and still in Europe :pQuote:
Originally Posted by holidaysong
Calm down, some of us take longer to write messages
Sorry, it looked like a direct reply to mine.Quote:
Originally Posted by shedite
There is nothing on the InterToto section of UEFA.com about this being the last year of the InterToto Cup... :confused:
At best it has one year left but I think this is the last one.Quote:
Originally Posted by holidaysong
Unlucky in many respects tonight for Shels,if they can cut out all these schoolboy errors in Europe they would probably make the group stages in the next 2/3 years.
The Intertoto is definately on next year but don't make any assumptions about Shels finishing third. We have our eye on that spot and i'm sure Drogs will push for it too.
Steua were the better team on the night but 4-1 was definately not a representative scoreline. But if you are going to give away soft goals like that then what do you expect.
I actually think that Shels suffered from their lack of ambition in Tolka park. Steau were there for the beating in the first leg but Nutsy decided to play for 0-0. If Steau were under a bit more pressure they would have cracked but in the end it was made easy for them.
Got a source on that?Quote:
Originally Posted by Vitruvian Man
Could you point to a link that suggests this?Quote:
Originally Posted by Poor Student
Weso superb when he came on. The most naturally gifted player in the league imo and he looked fit to me - he should have started. Ndo is a bit erratic but very skilful, but to be fair Ritchie had a good game, set up the goal and nearly had another when it was 0-0, so I don't think it is fair saying that playing Ritchie was a mistake.
Crawley is the weakest link in the team - thought the Flemmesiter did well when he came on, has a bit of class about him but no left foot. He will be great cover if Heary ever gets injured.
Hope Cork and Derry have learnt from our successes and failures in the last two years, and do well next year.
I would love to see an Irish team in the group stages even if it is not Shels, I think it would be great for the league.
Good luck to Cork next week, and thanks for all the support from other clubs. I know Shels are far from liked on the domestic stage but we got to stick together in Europe!
Good point. I am looking but I cannot find. I'm begining to wonder if I've confused hearsay with fact.Quote:
Originally Posted by TheOwl
Great debate on rte medium wave on the state of irish football and what needs to be done to progress
Hard Luck Shels, apart from two suicidal errors you played quite well,1-4 is not a true reflection of the game. I think you showed them way too much respect in the 1st leg, they (Steaua) are not good when they are put under pressure.
Some of their team sickened me with their antics throughout the game, their crowd seemed no better. Throwing missiles at the Shels bench, now I wonder if that had happened in Dublin what would the sanction from UEFA have been?
Alan Matthews on RTE seemed to say 'ah well you get that sort of thing over there', doesn't make it right though.
Why was Wes Hoolahan on the bench. Surely at half time it was obvious that somebody to get on the ball was needed.
I know it was a tough match for Shels but Pat Fenlon must shoulder some blame for that performance. Too much heart and not enough skill.
Shels are out of Europe
Out of the Cup
14 points behind Cork City.
Was like the Battle of Bucharest especially in the first half. All Shels seemed to know was to either dive or fight.
Shels were hopeless again until decided to go for it in the 2nd half. Fullbacks again hoofed the ball aimlessly into the corners with no forward nearby.
Crawley was again worse than uselss. Fleming made a hude difference when he came on. Harris was also very poor. Moore did feck all except kick.
I think eL sides need to learn that have to try to win home legs. When we sit back with 5 in midfield we are less effective. Cork City were just as guilty as Shels this season but at least had 2 nil lead. Teams need to use advantage of tight home grounds & summer fitness if want to consistently progress in Europe.
I'm glad to hear the result is not quite a reflection of the quality of Shelbourne's performance. However some of Fenlon's team selections seem poor. It's a pity he couldn't make the necessary changes.
Shels did well with the exception of four moments of defensive madness.
The sad fact is that we can not expect an Irish club to perform better than that until the Irish public and the FAI begin to support us. Comparing Shels and Bucharest is not comparing like with like. One is a multi-million euro industry still cloaked in the shadow of totalitarianism and probably laundering money to pay unbelievably high wages, and the other are a decent side from Romania :p
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Originally Posted by Poor Student
A Bohs fan contacted the FAI and they said as far as they were concerned the Eircom League would have a representative in the Intertoto next year.
I know it's only the FAI but I can't find any referance on the web to the intertoto being cancelled. You'd think UEFA would have it on their website considering it's one of their competitions.
:D Now now people in glass houses shouldn't throw stones ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by Passive
Thanks for that Vitruvian. I'm investigating it on a site that's good on European competitions to see what they've heard.
I posted this on the Cork forum but I'll post here too. As a matter of interest Hajduk were beaten 8-0 on agg by Debercen of Hungary in this round tonight.
I like it :DQuote:
Originally Posted by Passive
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Originally Posted by Passive
LOL :D
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Originally Posted by Éanna
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Originally Posted by Vitruvian Man
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Originally Posted by harry crumb
Glad to see I'm not the only one who thinks Fenlon isn't a great manager. Obviously, can't argue with what he's won (on the biggest budget in the league), but he has seems to have a habit of making poor tactical decisions. Whatever about Hoolihan (who was supposed to be carrying an injury and not fit enough for 90 minutes), Ndo looked class as well when he came on, yet he only got ten minutes over the two legs. Crawley looked the weakest link last year as well as this, yet Fenlon keeps him in because of his European experience. This over a ten-times capped Irish international who also has European experience! Fleming hardly put a foot wrong, I thought. Crawley hardly put a foot right. When Shels had a go, they weren't far off matching Steaua (who deserved to go through on what I saw tonight; didn't see the home leg).Quote:
Originally Posted by Poor Student
Still, 4-1 was harsh, which at least is an improvement on the last time an Irish (club) side played out in Bucharest. We've gotten more coefficient points than last year already, and Cork are still in. So it's not all bad!
Would agree with most of this (especially about pushing on at home), although I thought Harris had a decent game. He had to shoulder a lot of responsibility back there for a guy who hasn't played much this season, and I thought he did ok.Quote:
Originally Posted by pete
In Fenlon's defence he is a very young manager. I hope he cops on and learns though instead of repeating the same mistakes his whole career. He has more European experience than practically any manager in eL history.
Ah the joys of the internet! You have one reply suggesting that it's never been more popular and that the replyer is "pretty sure" there'll be a competition next year.Quote:
Originally Posted by Poor Student
Meh. He's around three years now - enough to know that if you've got the best player in the league by a distance, you don't keep him on the bench. As for repeating mistakes, the Hibernians result was probably the worst result in recent eL history (even Longford managed to beat Carmarthen in one game, but Shels couldn't beat them in either leg) due in part to Fenlon knowing a draw would suffice (in part also due to bad luck and bad refereeing), yet against KR the next year, he went for the same risky tactics. They worked that time, but it doesn't bode well for learning from mistakes.Quote:
Originally Posted by Poor Student
I'd somehow have assumed Bert Kassies forum would have a group of hardcore researchers updating me on the answer to my question quoting a UEFA committee meeting in seconds. :(Quote:
Originally Posted by pineapple stu
I think he misses Alan Matthews/John McDonnell. It may be extremely harsh to suggest but Shels "slump" (if you can call it that) has come since Eamon Collins arrived at the club.Quote:
Originally Posted by Poor Student
Must say I was disappointed with the 5-man trick being repeated this year. I thought it suited our personnel last year, but I also thought the signing of Crowe would have changed that.
Pat Fenlon has to shoulder all of the blame.
He didn't pick the team to do the job and they lost as a result.
The sendings off were mad and alot of errors but doesn't take it away .... Shels didn't have their best possible team on the pitch for the job and Fenlon is answerable for that.
Hoolahan and Ndo .... glaring holes in Shels game and when they came on ... they proved it.
Crawley and Cahill were soo sooo bad tonight. Cahill was unreal, what a nightmare he was having .... in a game where everyone on the pitch has to put in 110% .... lord above .... never had a chance on that side.
Where is Williams ..... Fair play for playing Delaney and all credit for trying him out .... its done now ... and we all know it hasn't worked .... has he burnt the drawing board ..... Williams needed to be there tonight end of.
And there was really beatable tonight ..... has beens ... there for the taking if Shels wanted to. The scoreline was not a reflection of how that game went.
I said it last week ..... If Fenlon picked the right attacking team and played positive forward football it was possible ... he didn't pick that team ..... Shels didn't deserve anything out of it so they cant complain.
The problem is, I felt his tactics were poor in Europe last season and they somehow luckily got by to face Deportivo. I feel perhaps this has set Fenlon back a bit in how he should approach European games tactically. Irish teams must adopt a positive attitude more like they did against Glens. In the first game a five man midfield containing Jason Byrne was stupid. If you're going to play a 5 man midfield, play 5 midfielders! You don't need to show Steaua that much respect anyway as to play one striker. Shels have a decent pair of strikers, they should have started them.
Spot on!Quote:
Originally Posted by Poor Student
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Originally Posted by Poor Student
Pat Fenlon played with Bohs against Bordeaux and were really unlucky to not get anything out of that game, with an unreal lineup to play against .... he was unreal himself that night and more than held his own .... all end to end ... attaching football. IF they sat back that night .... they would have been hammered.
Shels have an easier job tonight and sat back/played negative football/didn't give themselves the best chance.
Fenlon is around long enough to know what kind of a game had to be played tonight .... he failed to pick the team for it ...... it is his fault. No excuses !!
Rosenborg were hammered 5-1 tonight by Fredrikstad. It seems they really are there for the taking. :(
Shels opponents are an average team so this 'unlucky' tag they will no doubt get is rubbish. Lack of ambition, lack of courage, call it what you like. The basic truth is that while we all(rightly) have a go at the FAI for their lack of involvement in our league, let's look closer to home at our managers (maybe not Rico this year, we'll see) who continue to put out teams to try not to lose instead of trying to win against non match fit sides. Remember that used to be our excuse when our sides were in pre season
What's happened there, incidentally? If they don't get into the Group Stages this year, they could be looking at serious financial problems surely?
Valerenga won 4-1 against Haka today with Steffen Iversen and Tore Andre Flo scoring!
Totally agree.Quote:
Originally Posted by hoopy
Are there any Longford fans who want to call for Shels to be banned from representing the country in European football again. ;)
Yeah .... have to agree with you there.Quote:
Originally Posted by hoopy
To be honest ..... if it was good football played by Shels tonight, i wouldn't mind that 4:1 scoreline .... if it was entertaining, quality football .... this 'play it safe' and 'stop the play' and 'pack the midfield' worked ... i'll give you that but the game is up now.
Shels didn't play ball and were punished. What is p!ssing me off is that (a) they didn't give themselves the best chance and (b) if they had, they could have strolled away with it, knocked two goals in and enjoy the rest of it ...... it would have been Shels fans cheering each pass at the end.
Ahh ...Fúck it anyway !!
Another thing is if we had a constructive media that could evaluate the game properly, in a balanced informed way .... the message might filter across but .... the papers tomorrow ..... have a look and just see how they report this game ..... and whats even better is looking for a motive as to why they report this way !!
I thought it was very strange to play Jason Byrne in midfield where he doesn't offer much. If going to play 1 forward then drop either Crowe or Byrne!
Steaua Manager again...
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Even though they have yet to beat the Irish champions, Becali was in bullish mood after the draw. "Our executive president Mihai Stoica told me that Rosenborg were the most beatable seeded team in the draw," he said. "We are 80 per cent qualified for the group stage."
Shels are an ok side with some good players. Steaua are better technically and better team overall. Still in saying that, we shouldnt have let in 4 goals like that.
The tatics for europe have to be looked at. Were not really a defensive team and i dont know where felon got the impression we could soak up attacking football for 80 odd minutes.
The amount of bad individual errors was unbelivable. Its like looking at rabbits caught in a headlight trying to clear the ball. There was very little composure in the side until the subs came on. Curtis Fleming may be old but he looks the business IMO. Very composed, reliable, makes few howlers.
Fenlon has to rebuild the team. The team needs serious cash to put a team together that can make it to the 3rd round. Rosenborg were there ready to be knocked out.
Crawley had a right "Longford" tonight, Delaney looked shaky and nervous with errors to match, Cahill ? Was he playing?
Losing Rodgers so early seemed to unsettle them though after Shels hit the post at 0-0 Steaua looked a bit nervy.
Too many non performers tonight for Shels.
Didn't hear Nutsy afterwards but I presume it went like "You can't be making those sort of mistakes at this level cos these type of teams will punish you" yada yada yada.
If Shels had been tight and hadn't made mistakes at the back it could have been 1-1.