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Mr.Stats man, tell us all about his stats in the final third of the field then. He's entirely frustrating to watch. Always has to beat 6 men and run into a corner before crossing a ball when all he needs to do is put his head up and look for a simple pass.Quote:
Originally Posted by Charlie Darwin
He does have that problem, and yet he still sets up a large propotion of our goals and has begun to score his fair share too.
Monaghan Town... so close...
'What can be done to establish a meaningful connection between Irish domestic football and the national team?': http://www.goal.com/en-ie/news/3942/...ful-connection
Letter in today's Times. Did anyone here write it?
Quote:
Sir, – According to figures in The Irish Times on Saturday, the overall attendance at five Airtricity League of Ireland games on Friday night last amounted to a meagre 7,754.The majority of the “wonderful” Irish supporters who caused so much merriment when celebrating the defeats at Euro 2012 obviously have not recovered from their exertions and long travelling to go out and support local soccer.But, no doubt, these dedicated fans will soon turn out in big numbers, as they did thousands of miles away, to boost crowds at League of Ireland matches. – Yours, etc,
I like the idea of each Premier team having 3 or 4 centrally contracted players, use some of the money we have earned at major championships to directly resource the league - would take some wage pressure off the clubs and give a long term viable professional football option to players. It might stop a lot of players playing in the lower leagues cross channel when a option is available at home.Quote:
Originally Posted by DannyInvincible
*Airtricity League of Ireland Premier Division games.Quote:
the overall attendance at five Airtricity League of Ireland games
Jesus that annoys me when 99% of the time people just completely flat out ignore the First Division as if it doesn't exist.
great post spudulka.Quote:
Originally Posted by Spudulika
so what your saying is the vast majority of the fans in poland are not football supporters? why because they dont support a loi team or go to matches that is a crazy judgement. i know loads of lads in my area that play junior soccer and got tickets through their junior club and went to the finals not just players but also committee members, managers, and supporters of those junior clubs. that is just in my area im sure it was the same all over the country so i would say the 'vast majority' of the supporters in poland actually play football every week in this country or are actively involved in the running of junior/intermediate/schoolboy clubs. football in ireland is not all about the loi, that makes up a small percentage of football people/supporters in this country.
above post in response to this sorry :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Lim till i die
I think the judgement more relates to people who "support" Man Yoo, the Gooners, Chelski etc rather than an Irish team. I don't think involvement in junior soccer is prohibitive to the LOI in the same way the Premiership is.Quote:
Originally Posted by republican
For example; I myself was involved in underage / junior soccer for years, (before work took me abroad) but the difference with me and other mentors / committee members etc was that I was a regular at Turners Cross on a Friday night - while the rest of the committee supported Liverpool.
thats a fair point but he said the vast majority of people over there were not football supporters and going to poland was their holiday for the year which is incorrect from where i was looking. also on the junior/loi/premiership debate, every player and committee member in every loi club also support an english team ie united, liverpool, chelsea so its ok for them to follow an english team aswell as a loi team but not ok for me 'for example' to support an english team because my local club are a junior club and not loi, and because of this people like me are not football supporters??Quote:
Originally Posted by Real ale Madrid
There are a lot of people here who support English teams as well as their domestic club - there is no one model of being a supporter. Your experience isn't really typical though - most people who follow football in Ireland do so via their Sky Sports subscription and don't get out to help the domestic game.
It's all about the Premier League. :(Quote:
Originally Posted by republican
Do they? Plenty of supporters of the League of Ireland have no interest whatsoever in the Premier League/SPL. Why would they?Quote:
Originally Posted by republican
no interest whatsoever :) yeah so they go to watch loi on fri and dont watch anything again until followin fri :)Quote:
Originally Posted by DannyInvincible
Well I don't know about anyone else, but that's exactly what I do. I have no interest whatsoever in the English football leagues, and have more interest in sticking needles in my eyes than watching Scottish football.Quote:
Originally Posted by republican
Yup similar here. I watch the odd game if nothing else on or if it possibly could be a decent game. Wouldn't go out of my way to watch a game and find myself turning games off fairly quick as I get bored more easily watching it on telly. I'd say I turned off or only half watched 90% of the euros as I found other things to occupy my mind when getting bored watching it.Quote:
Originally Posted by nigel-harps1954
Alot of my mates have gone the same way. I actually can't remember the last game on telly (Barr Ireland Croatia and Ireland Spain) that I watched start to finish without turning it off or going doing something else.
Can happen at live games too were you end up chatting amoungst each other more than watch the game if they are boring but that rarely happens.
If anyone is on Football365 forum, there is an interesting thread on there called 'FAO Irish' with a poll asking why people on there don't go to LoI games. Some interesting answers, the main reason is 'I've been to a few games but the standard is rubbish'. Other things brought up, but very rarely mentioned on here, are the lack of continuity in squads (I can sympathize with this, I swear one season Bobby Browne used over 50 players) and the lack of it being a 'social event'. That one got me thinking, is the root of the event junkie mentality that we're only really ever looking for a days craic and a few pints- the source or venue of the event is never important, because no-one will think badly or laugh at you if you're going on the lash?
(god I miss last season when worrying about the league meant wondering if Shels would win their game in hand :( )
Ah sure what were you worried about. Don't you know about our inability to defend from the 88th min onwards.
Surely the standard displayed by the national team in poland invalidates this hoary old argument?Quote:
Originally Posted by MagicMon
I actually think this is a huge part of it. A lot of people go to sporting events as much for the day out and craic as the actual event.Quote:
Originally Posted by MagicMon
If you look at the bigger attended Rugby and GAA matches most people make a day out of it. It's very hard to do this on a Friday night. How many grounds in the league can you actually go to and have a few pints, watch the game and head home or where ever? I'd say you can do it in the majority of Rugby grounds anyway. When people talk about facilities at grounds this is a big one lacking. In saying all that Monaghan, Dundalk, Cobh and Kildare all have/had bars so it obviously is more than just that.
its about making the connection between the singing at International games and the singing at League games. Im actually kind of serious.
Find me one non-League supporting person who wouldnt enjoy sitting with league fans and singing We are Bohs to the tune of Gold by Spandau Ballet (for example ;) ) and ill show you a person who doesnt really enjoy football for what it is.
Honestly, the question is how do we start connecting with those people who enjoy the buzz of an international game? Barstoolers exist unashamedly - that is without question - and they are a lost cause as far as im concerned. But there are some genuine football fans out there who clearly do enjoy the thrill and "craic" of the live game that we need to tap into somehow but we need to make that connection and it needs to come from "us". How is that achieved? (million dollar fcking question i suppose)
The media must take some of the blame, they hype up the English game so much, while at the same they tend to ignore LOI.
The Fai needs to rethink its media strategy of the league for next season, as Clubs need the media exposure to get bums on seats, once the clubs get bums on seats its up to the clubs to get these people back week in week out.
I rarely if ever watch the EPL, it bores me to tears, and I know plenty more that have lost interest.Quote:
Originally Posted by republican
Somehow it's got to be made seem to be desirable to go to games here. How that will happen is beyond me at the moment though. I look at all the reasons suggested why people don't go - poor facilities, bad standard of football, attitude of the supporters to "barstoolers". None of them ring true to me.
Facilities - Don't buy this for a second. If Pats v Rovers (for example) were to play their upcoming league game in the Aviva instead of Tallaght, does anyone think it's going to attract 20,000, or even 10,000 supporters ? On the other hand if Man U were playing Liverpool in a competitive game at Richmond park does anyone think for a second that anyone would say "ah, Richmonds a kip, I'm not going to that "?
Standard - Honestly think the standard of the league over the last few years has been very good, better then it was 10-15 years ago. Yet crowds haven't increased. Pats this year are playing probably the best football I've seen them play, but crowds continue to be poor.
Attitude of existing fans - Heard Colm Foley trot out this old chestnut on MNS this week. I don't believe for a second that a) anyone likely to be offended by any negative comments ever had any intention of going to a game or b) anyone has ever had any grief at an LOI game for being a "barstooler"
As it stands It looks to me like an Irish team will have to be getting to the knockout stages of the Champions League (never mind the group stages) with all the hype that entails, before the great Irish football public start to take notice. And even then I'd have my doubts if that would entail regular attendance. We're grand for an International every couple of months, or of course for those all important once in a blue moon trips to tournaments, but Irish football fans just don't do commitment it seems.
Call me crazy, but yes. I do think it could attract upwards of 10,000. For the day out to a nice stadium more than anything else. It's been proved, a big day out at the Aviva, with the cup final (albeit, actually a big occasion), can attract upwards of 15,000.Quote:
Originally Posted by TonyD
I honestly believe, we're there a 18 team Premier Division, with 18 teams of a reasonable size, (aka, the current 11 Premier clubs with the bigger First teams, Limerick, Longford, Waterford, Harps and Athlone, Wexford and a Galway team), all playing in big shiny stadiums with bars, corporate facilities, proper media areas, and comfort for fans, there would be a significant rise in attendances.
I honestly believe it.
All the Loi needs IMO is professional administration to stop clubs frequently going broke and out of business, Delaney and Co provide amateur management at blue chip rates, funds that could be used to properly manage the league.
I love the Loi, I am happy with the facilities and the football, if our grounds were suddenly filled with EPL commodity fetishists and the professional paddies of Poland then I am off to the Irish league, because we do not need these peoples validation.
The league does have a credibility deficit that like our national debt cannot be eliminated overnight but with careful governance we could have a more stable and slightly better attended league.
All the LOI needs is for rubbish talk like this to stop. You don't want them at Sligo, send them our way. We'll happily take their money. I'd rather have 10,000 plastic fans at a match than stick with the regular 500 die hards just about keeping the club afloat anyday.Quote:
Originally Posted by redarmyfaction
You're missing the point. If Manchester United and Liverpool played in Richer every week people would complain about the facilities. If it was a one off, they probably wouldn't care so much. Rovers moving to Tallaght goes to show how important a decent stadium with good facilities is in increasing attendances. I have absolutely no doubt that Finn Harps and Limerick will see increased attendances once (if) their stadiums get off the ground.Quote:
Originally Posted by TonyD
Sufficient unto the day is the evil thereof, but you mistake my argument I am not an Loi snob, inverted or otherwise, I am a pragmatist and I enjoy the league for what it its, I don't think it its rubbish to ask that emphasis be placed on a properly run league where the small things are done right and Harps can survive on attendances of 500, rather than fantasising about 10k in Finn park.Quote:
Originally Posted by nigel-harps1954
Quote:
Originally Posted by redarmyfaction
I don't really see how you can reconcile these statements.Quote:
Originally Posted by redarmyfaction
You don't think it could be a combination of these factors amongst others? The league has a serious image problem, unfortunately. Crap facilities, an inferior standard relative to what can be beamed into the living room on a satellite dish and a perception of the league's supporters as parochial, cliquey and bitter are all part of that image problem, not to mention the financial issues and mishaps experienced by clubs on a seasonal basis. It all appears very amateurish. And at times, it quite simply is.Quote:
Originally Posted by TonyD
Furthermore, Ireland as a nation has historically been suspicious of football - think of the GAA - and "exporting" any interest in the game served to benefit certain interests. A culture of supporting teams in a better-quality league across the Irish Sea developed and that phenomenon - which seems odd to us and most football fans across Europe who are aware of it - feels perfectly normal and natural to those in Ireland who are embroiled in it.
Plenty do. It's just channelled across the Irish Sea, unfortunately.Quote:
Irish football fans just don't do commitment it seems.
In the first instance I was being facetious in the second I was explaining this to youQuote:
Originally Posted by osarusan
I certainly think there's a lot to be said for the argument that we need to somehow turn games into 'events'. How that is to be done is a difficult one but every little helps and the more professional you can make your match day operation the better.
Was in Jackman last Friday for the Harps game and got the father to tag along for once.
Twenty or so American tourists showed up out of the blue and the banter with the lads in the shed - as well as a decent spectacle on the pitch (three goals, a penalty, a sending off) - made it one of the best atmospheres I've experienced in Jackman in the few years I've been supporting Limerick.
In the car home the father said, "You'd have to be absolutely made of stone not to leave there with a smile on your face tonight." And he was right. Obviously the US contingent is something that can't be maintained and won't often - if ever - be repeated, but it made the night somewhat special. I get to home games every time I can, which is about 80% of the time - I'd go there if I was the only one or if it was packed to the rafters, whether we won every game 5 - 0 or got hockeyed - but I could still appreciate just how much the atmosphere and banter - even aided by a gimmick like those tourists - can turn it from my weekly fix of Limerick FC (which not every Limerickman needs) to an event, a release and all-round entertainment and craic.
The facilities are never gonna be as comfortable as the couch at home or as warm as the pub in town but they'll never be able to mass-produce the atmosphere in a LOI ground. If we can built that atmosphere and maintain it, it could be a marketing executives dream.