Secret All-Ireland league talks at 'advanced' stage

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Originally Posted by OneRedArmy

Most clubs can't afford to be in the League as it is, never mind if you add in more time off work to be paid for players and longer journeys.

As Maribor says dose of financial reality required allround.

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Are there really that many longer journeys involved. Drogheda, Dundalk Monaghan, and the Dublin clubs would all have a shorter trip to NI than they would have for most of their away trips now ie Waterford, Cork, Galway, Sligo. In fairness Southern Clubs Like Cork, Waterford, Wexford and Cobh would have further to travel but the rest ie midland teams etc. wouldn't see that much difference

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Originally Posted by osarusan

Aren't people always saying how a team needs a national league under the jurisdiction of the football association of the country, or otherwise they won't be allowed a national team? (or something like that)

How would this combined league affect that rule? Or is that what "UEFA....and FIFA will give the necessary backing to the venture" is referring to?

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Liechtenstein does not have a national league

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Originally Posted by Not Brazil

Cannot speak on behalf of all Linfield fans, so offer just my own opinion.

Providing the future of the Northern Ireland international team was "ringfenced", I would be broadly supportive of the concept of a full time, professional, AI League - I believe that it would progress Linfield Football Club to a new level.

It is also worth bearing in mind that relationships between Linfield FC and the IFA are somewhat strained at present - court case pending!

There is a lot of ill feeling amongst a section of the Linfield support towards the IFA - on my way to Institute a couple of Saturdays ago, I was lambasted on my SC bus by some of our club members for being a Norn Iron fan.:eek:

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Yup I agree with you.... however you shouldn't support an association that would shaft our club in an instant.

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Originally Posted by Graemerz

Yup I agree with you.... however you shouldn't support an association that would shaft our club in an instant.

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In fairness Graemerz it is unfair to assume support of the national team equals supports of the administrative body.

Many Ireland fans hold the FAI in contempt but still support the national team (myself included). Its a hard bond to break.

[QUOTE how long are we going to let a few poorly run cash strapped clubs hold back football in this country. [/QUOTE]

dead right cork and drogs should not be allowed run it for us all

Believe it or not folks, but in Northern Ireland there are a few teams in the IL that are big clubs but going bad. Glenavon, Ballymena, Coleraine, Cliftonville & Portadown are all big clubs. If an AIL happened they would get a lot of their “part-time” support back. Although there is a standard deficit at the moment(bar Linfield) the gap between the Northern and Southern teams in an AIL would be wiped out in a matter of a few years.

Also this crap about Linfield and Glentoran being in loyalist areas, is plain silly. We have Cliftonville and DC who would be frowned upon a lot more than any teams down South by the locals and they do not get a pick of bother. So it is a non existent problem.

If the Northern Ireland side is to remain and not be in any long term jeopardy I could be persuaded. But at this present moment in time, I do not think an AIL would make a blind bit of different to the overall popularity on this island.

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Originally Posted by Steve Bruce

But at this present moment in time, I do not think an AIL would make a blind bit of different to the overall popularity on this island.

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Here, you're not allowed to use logic on this board.

Listen to what the nice men are telling you. An AIL will solve all our problems and we will once again return to the land of milk and honey.

Sure don't you remember how the 10/12 team league, summer football, the merger with the FAI, top 6/bottom 6, end of League playoff, summer breaks et al have saved us? I think you are being very harsh on the saviours of Irish football........:rolleyes:

Another hare brained idea from a bunch of clubs who are throwing the dummy over the wage cap.

Money talks boys and girls. Setanta are gonna pump in the monies, and it will happen, their will be a number of clubs falling off the wagon in both leagues and will probably not reappear for a long time. All ireland league iin rugby was trumpeted a few years back in rugby and it rarely features now. Maybe a top 4 provinces model like rugby funded to the tune of 5-10million each a year may make us compete in europe

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Originally Posted by Maribor

Here, you're not allowed to use logic on this board.

Listen to what the nice men are telling you. An AIL will solve all our problems and we will once again return to the land of milk and honey.

Sure don't you remember how the 10/12 team league, summer football, the merger with the FAI, top 6/bottom 6, end of League playoff, summer breaks et al have saved us? I think you are being very harsh on the saviours of Irish football........:rolleyes:

Another hare brained idea from a bunch of clubs who are throwing the dummy over the wage cap.

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IMO, the best thing we can do to increase popularity and image of our leagues is to raise the money to sustain a big advertising campaign to make people more aware of what matches are on and where.

I also think that thousands of tickets should be given away to schools/youth groups etc to be given admittance to any league game anywhere on this island every week.

Facilities need to be more family friendly and I also think their needs to be greater travelling support as this would boost atmosphere and match experience.

All this chopping and changing doesn’t work. A slow progression is more viable and more long lasting than any novelty crowd you can get in the short term.

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Originally Posted by geezer

Money talks boys and girls. Setanta are gonna pump in the monies, and it will happen, their will be a number of clubs falling off the wagon in both leagues and will probably not reappear for a long time. All ireland league iin rugby was trumpeted a few years back in rugby and it rarely features now. Maybe a top 4 provinces model like rugby funded to the tune of 5-10million each a year may make us compete in europe

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I cannot see where we can get this 5-10 million funding from every year

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Originally Posted by geezer

Money talks boys and girls. Setanta are gonna pump in the monies, and it will happen, their will be a number of clubs falling off the wagon in both leagues and will probably not reappear for a long time. All ireland league iin rugby was trumpeted a few years back in rugby and it rarely features now. Maybe a top 4 provinces model like rugby funded to the tune of 5-10million each a year may make us compete in europe

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Wouldn't the barstoolers love it? A Leinster side they can go see in Lansdowne 5 times a year? Look at what the provincial model in rugby has done to the clubs? It's killed them off. A provincial model would be the death of Irish football

This reeks of teams being unhappy with the 65% wage cap forcing them to run in a sustainable manner trying to force the FAI to change the participation agreement. An AIL is a long way off and I do not see major benefits to Irish football from it currently.

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Originally Posted by LeixlipRed

Wouldn't the barstoolers love it? A Leinster side they can go see in Lansdowne 5 times a year? Look at what the provincial model in rugby has done to the clubs? It's killed them off. A provincial model would be the death of Irish football

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And what exactly is this provincial model?

A 4-team league? That'll really have the fans flocking in.

By the way, isn't this secret six thing blown out of proportion a little? Didn't Nick Leeson come out and support the wage cap a day or two after Galway were allegedly in the thick of this group against that very thing? The newspaper report as usual is vague on hard facts and big on speculation.

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Originally Posted by Graemerz

Yup I agree with you.... however you shouldn't support an association that would shaft our club in an instant.

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I will continue to support my Club AND my Country - no matter how difficult the IFA try to make that.

If the IFA shaft our Club, I would be fully supportive of any application by Linfield FC to join the Eircom League - notwithstanding these current developments.

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Originally Posted by Mr A

This reeks of teams being unhappy with the 65% wage cap forcing them to run in a sustainable manner trying to force the FAI to change the participation agreement. An AIL is a long way off and I do not see major benefits to Irish football from it currently.

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They're dead right to be looking to somehow circumvent the wage cap. It's an unfair system, conceptualised to stop crazy chairmen committing financial suicide. All things are not equal in the world of football and to try create this situation is ridiculous. At this moment in time Pats, Bohs, Drogs and Cork have all the cash. We may not like it but we have to accept it. We can all bleet on about the perils of property developers but this is the route that these clubs have chosen take. Be it on their heads if they fail.

The reality is that the eircom league's top clubs are competing for players with clubs in England's league 1 and 2 . How can they compete with a wage cap slapped on their heads? Isolated national wage caps are nonsense as competition is not limited to Ireland. With proper punishments for insolvency, wreckless trading or any financial irregularities, wage caps wouldn't be necessary. In other words, clubs need to have enough sense themsleves to know what wages they can afford. If they don't then it's their necks on the line.

Setanta are currently paying up to 10k per eL game & maybe 50k per Setanta Cup game (includes sponsorship). How much would they pay for All Ireland League sponsorship + say 30-40 games? Would extra 200k revenue make enough difference to clubs?

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Originally Posted by Postman

The reality is that the eircom league's top clubs are competing for players with clubs in England's league 1 and 2 . How can they compete with a wage cap slapped on their heads? Isolated national wage caps are nonsense as competition is not limited to Ireland. With proper punishments for insolvency, wreckless trading or any financial irregularities, wage caps wouldn't be necessary. In other words, clubs need to have enough sense themsleves to know what wages they can afford. If they don't then it's their necks on the line.

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On a separate, but related note, is it correct that athletes get special tax status in the Republic (like artists, writers etc)?

If so, this might raise a problem for any all-Ireland League whereby Northern clubs would have to outbid their Southern counterparts when it comes to paying wages (i.e. in order to equalise their take home pay).

All other things being equal, a player would surely sooner accept e.g. €750 per week from Dundalk than £500 pw from Newry City. There might be other financial implications we haven't thought about, as well. For example, is it correct that VAT is not levied on gate receipts for sporting events in the Republic, the way it is in NI?

Also, differing levels of Government support (e.g. for facilities), or tighter/more lenient regulation, might also serve to prevent a level playing field?

How do Derry City fare at present?

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Originally Posted by EalingGreen

On a separate, but related note, is it correct that athletes get special tax status in the Republic (like artists, writers etc)?

If so, this might raise a problem for any all-Ireland League whereby Northern clubs would have to outbid their Southern counterparts when it comes to paying wages (i.e. in order to equalise their take home pay).

All other things being equal, a player would surely sooner accept e.g. €750 per week from Dundalk than £500 pw from Newry City. There might be other financial implications we haven't thought about, as well. For example, is it correct that VAT is not levied on gate receipts for sporting events in the Republic, the way it is in NI?

Also, differing levels of Government support (e.g. for facilities), or tighter/more lenient regulation, might also serve to prevent a level playing field?

How do Derry City fare at present?

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Maybe the players (from both sides of the border) could just be paid by the government like the gaa players :D:D:D

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Originally Posted by EalingGreen

On a separate, but related note, is it correct that athletes get special tax status in the Republic (like artists, writers etc)?

If so, this might raise a problem for any all-Ireland League whereby Northern clubs would have to outbid their Southern counterparts when it comes to paying wages (i.e. in order to equalise their take home pay).

All other things being equal, a player would surely sooner accept e.g. €750 per week from Dundalk than £500 pw from Newry City. There might be other financial implications we haven't thought about, as well. For example, is it correct that VAT is not levied on gate receipts for sporting events in the Republic, the way it is in NI?

Also, differing levels of Government support (e.g. for facilities), or tighter/more lenient regulation, might also serve to prevent a level playing field?

How do Derry City fare at present?

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The VAT thing is correct - Derry pay VAT on gate receipts whereas the other eL clubs don't.

In terms of personal taxation, Sportsmen aren't tax-free like artists / writers / musicians - they pay tax just like any other employee would - however after they retire they can claim a fairly hefty tax rebate.