Suggested change to 33 game league

UCD should be chopped? Madness!

Promoted to the Preimier Division, on merit.
League Cup Runners up 2005, on merit.
Still hunting the FAI Cup (and therefore European football, and the Setanta Cup), on merit.
Look set to survive more comfortably than Pats, on merit. (I didn't mention Rovers due to the points deductions).

Sure, yeah, lets turf those ambitionless tossers out and promote someone like Monaghan to the Premier Divison and Mullingar Town into the first division. Sheesh, some people! :)

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Originally Posted by crc

There was lots of controversy when the fixtures came out and Cork were drawn to play their main rivals away twice. The advantage of the extra home game against your nearest rival is fundamentally unfair (and could yet be the difference between Derry and Cork).

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Rubbish!! There's no controversy, as every team ends up playing the SAME amount of games. Due to our country's size, we cannot have a 12-team league played in any other format. That's the way it is, so get used to it. You win or lose the league over 33 games, not on 2 or 3. If Derry end up losing the league, it won't be due to their result at Cork in November, but rather by their dropped points at places like Longford, Drogheda, Pats, and UCD that will decide how they lost the league, games that you would expect title contenders to win.

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(though at this point no one thought Derry would be their main challenger).

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Which proves my point. The league is contested over 33 games, and Derry are the club to emerge as Cork's main challenger in the league this year. They, like everybody else's fate, good or bad, is decided by how many points they picked up from 33 games, not by making an extra trip.

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Originally Posted by mypost

The league is contested over 33 games, and Derry are the club to emerge as Cork's main challenger in the league this year. They, like everybody else's fate, good or bad, is decided by how many points they picked up from 33 games, not by making an extra trip.

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wrong.

This season
Cork beat Derry at home 2-0
Derry beat Cork at home 3-1

all other things being equal (like points picked up against other teams) Cork have a distinct advantage by playing Derry at home one extra time, because they would probably win. That's unfair.

If you don't believe that this arrangement causes controversy, see these threads: one , two , three.
Ironically they're from the Cork forum, but the point is that there can't be much confidence in the league champions if there's less that three points between them and their challangers and they won their extra game at home. If Cork beat Derry in the last game at the cross, and finish on, say, 72 points and Derry finish on 70 or 71, could you honestly say that it was a fair competition between the two.

BTW - I'm not trying to make pre-emptive excuses for Derry not winning the league, I'm just using this years example to highlight the inequality in the 33 game system.

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Originally Posted by crc

BTW - I'm not trying to make pre-emptive excuses for Derry not winning the league, I'm just using this years example to highlight the inequality in the 33 game system.

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So that not you getting a bit hot around the collar no ??? :p

Only kidding .... totally agree with your point. I was giving out yards at the time over it, but it has woren me down and broken me at this stage, i i just give up !! :p

CHF were properly elected to the league as a new club - you couldn't just chuck them out...

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Originally Posted by A face

Just because you are in a crowd beside some fans when they cheer, doesn't make them louder .... i know the Derry fans were further away but from where they were standing, it could have been equally as loud, if not even louder. Its the whole 'near' and 'far' thing. :D

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Nice link!

I was talking to some people over in the hospitality area, incidentally. The far side of the ground to where I was. Should be admissible as evidence? ;)

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Originally Posted by RedNex

no fans/poor ground/no appeal/no ambition/will never make any strides in Europe/no hope

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1) 1000+ on Tuesday. 1000=0?
2) Moving into a new ground in the next year or two
3) When it was announced that a Setanta Cup would go to the League Cup winners, we ditched our policy of playing an U-21 team in the League Cup.
4) UCD 0-1 Everton on aggregate? UCD 3-3 Velbazhd Kyustendil on aggregate? Deluded Cork fans may waffle on about how their 2-0 win in Lithuania was the best eL result ever (a thread I think I saw here afterwards), but that doesn't compare to either of the two above results (especially given the home defeat which followed).

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Originally Posted by pineapple stu

Nice link!

I was talking to some people over in the hospitality area, incidentally. The far side of the ground to where I was. Should be admissible as evidence? ;)


1) 1000+ on Tuesday. 1000=0?
2) Moving into a new ground in the next year or two
3) When it was announced that a Setanta Cup would go to the League Cup winners, we ditched our policy of playing an U-21 team in the League Cup.
4) UCD 0-1 Everton on aggregate? UCD 3-3 Velbazhd Kyustendil on aggregate? Deluded Cork fans may waffle on about how their 2-0 win in Lithuania was the best eL result ever (a thread I think I saw here afterwards), but that doesn't compare to either of the two above results (especially given the home defeat which followed).

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point 4:im not slagging ucd's results-theyre decent efforts
cark beating kaunas 2-0 and then losing 1-0 IS a better result than the two ucd results. simply because the ucd ones constitute moral victories.carks results were actual victories and they went through,
example:Rovers beating vaduz 1-0 on aggregate is a better result than pats only losing 1-0 to real madrid on aggregate.

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Originally Posted by anto eile

example:Rovers beating vaduz 1-0 on aggregate is a better result than pats only losing 1-0 to real madrid on aggregate.

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I think that's stretching the point. I'd love to see Pats lose by a solitary goal to Real more than Rovers beating Vaduz 1-0.

To put things into context, Everton won the Cup Winners' Cup and the English league that year. We were an inch or two from scoring the winning away goal in that tie.

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Originally Posted by anto eile

point 4:im not slagging ucd's results

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That was at RedX (or RedNex or whatever), not you.

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Originally Posted by anto eile

cark beating kaunas 2-0 and then losing 1-0 IS a better result than the two ucd results. simply because the ucd ones constitute moral victories.carks results were actual victories and they went through,
example:Rovers beating vaduz 1-0 on aggregate is a better result than pats only losing 1-0 to real madrid on aggregate.

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That, however, is nonsense.

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Originally Posted by crc

Cork have a distinct advantage by playing Derry at home one extra time, because they would probably win. That's unfair. If Cork beat Derry in the last game at the cross, and finish on, say, 72 points and Derry finish on 70 or 71, could you honestly say that it was a fair competition between the two.

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And if Derry win the last game to win the league, will it be fairer? You're only going to TC to win the league, it's not the San Siro. If you're as good a team as you think, you should be well capable to win down there, if you have to.

If you asked Derry fans, before they went to Drogheda in March, "would you like to go to the last game to win the league?", how many of yous would have said no?

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I'm not trying to make pre-emptive excuses for Derry not winning the league

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Oh yes, you're getting in the excuses early.

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I'm not using this years example to highlight the inequality in the 33 game system.

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Them's the breaks!

True, there is an oddity, but it's the only way that the league can function properly. Put simply, if you have got more points than Cork after 33 games, you will win the league. If you don't, you won't. End of story.