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Says the self-same poster who introduced the NI team to the thread out-of-the-blue, after 13 other posts managed to keep it to the ROI team.Quote:
Originally Posted by geysir
Silly as well as sad....
As usual, Shakespeare nailed it: "The lady doth protest too much, methinks"
To be fair to geysir, his post concerning the IFA team came after The Fly brought up the topic of 'OWC's brightest', having a laugh at Ireland being 33rd in the rankings, obviously alluding to the ongoing 'Team 33' jibe. I can see why geysir brought up the NI team's place in the rankings, not that it's a crime.
Is it possible that you might just have felt the need to be offended?
Each to his own. Personally, I've little concern how other teams populated with British or other nationals are performing.Quote:
Originally Posted by geysir
Er, yes. Why mention it otherwise?Quote:
Do you seriously think I give a damn if NI are on page one, page 2 or page 3?
I imagine it's largely because they keep losing friendly matches.Quote:
Though I admit, last month for 2 seconds, I did wonder why they were not on page one
Fine, stop going on about it.Quote:
Your rivalry with the Republics team means absolutely zilch to me. I just don't relate or connect with it
It has already. Decades ago, when I lived there. Not that you are representative of or a spokesman for most RoI fans, as far as I can see.Quote:
When will it dawn on you that most Republic fans don't give a fiddlers about the NI team
Most RoI fans don't, you and Ardee Bhoy clearly do. Don't you get bored stirring?Quote:
Get over it if somebody remarks that you have climbed out the back pages of FIFA's rankings.
Nobody really cares
Not really. G's stirring is predictable, we expect and almost look forward to it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Predator
AreQuote:
Originally Posted by Gather round
youQuote:
Er, yes. Why mention it otherwise?
asQuote:
I imagine it's largely because they keep losing friendly matches.
pithyQuote:
Fine, stop going on about it.
inQuote:
It has already. Decades ago, when I lived there. Not that you are representative of or a spokesman for most RoI fans, as far as I can see.
realQuote:
Most RoI fans don't, you and Ardee Bhoy clearly do. Don't you get bored stirring?
life? ;)Quote:
Not really. G's stirring is predictable, we expect and almost look forward to it.
At first glance I thought the discussion had turned to underwear! :eek:Quote:
Originally Posted by Gather round
Really? Fly's post was about 'Team 33' being ranked 33rd, a mildly amusing jibe which works whether NI are ranked 1st in the world, last in the world or anywhere in between.Quote:
Originally Posted by Predator
It was Geysir who gratuitously made the jump from there to having a pop at the NI team (even despite his "point" being completely contradicted by the facts).
Who said I was "offended"? Mildly irritated, perhaps, but that's about the height of it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Predator
Anyway, half the content of any football message board consists of posters slagging off other teams, followed by the other teams' supporters defending them. Do you detect "offence" every time the latter occurs?
Why not play the ball, rather than the man? That is, do you concur with Geysir's clear implication that the NI team doesn't bear comparison with that of the ROI?
This is a Rankings thread, after all...
That's quite funny and earns you 16 points in the Foot.ie Rankings.Quote:
Originally Posted by The Fly
You can use it to offset the 25 points your preceding post cost you...;)
In terms of ranking there always will be a basis for comparison - such is the nature of a ranking system. But I think we have a far stronger pool of players available to us. And, as you know, international footballer managers such as Dick Advocaat are of the same opinion. Indeed the status/ strength an international team holds is highlighted by the quality of opposition they are able to attract for friendly games. Granted this is also linked to financial clout but it's telling that the IFA's perception of what consistutes a glamour friendly is a game away to Albania.Quote:
Originally Posted by EalingGreen
It is indeed.Quote:
Originally Posted by EalingGreen
I am aware of who posted what.Quote:
Originally Posted by EalingGreen
Mildly irritated as opposed to taking offence? I see, I see. I just asked whether you were being a bit hyper-sensitive.Quote:
Originally Posted by EalingGreen
Sometimes, but some people are wont to be offended (irritated) at even the smallest, or vaguest, reference to their team.Quote:
Originally Posted by EalingGreen
I don't agree that that was geysir's 'clear implication'. My opinion is that both sides are fairly close, with Ireland edging it at the minute.Quote:
Originally Posted by EalingGreen
So you don't support the North now??Quote:
Originally Posted by Gather round
;)
Hmm, to be fair him, or even the average Irish citizen would know about 100 times more about the Irish soccer team than yer good self! Not that it would be hard!Quote:
Not that you are representative of or a spokesman for most RoI fans, as far as I can see.
Hmm. Besides the obvious hypocrisy, it's more an objection to the status of the North of Ireland and its institutional bigotry that have existed out of its very creation.Quote:
Most RoI fans don't, you and Ardee Bhoy clearly do. Don't you get bored stirring?
Not to mention the predictable paranoia (& hypocrisy again) displayed by its fans on here!
More like the subsequent ( & continually entertaining) displays of paranoia....Quote:
G's stirring is predictable, we expect and almost look forward to it.
And Fly, more pitiful than pithy.
;)
Pred, those paranoia scars run deep!
Not compared to you, evidently. But let's go on the pith and compare notes.Quote:
Originally Posted by Fly
Don't worry, both our teams will be back on the skids soon enough, probably.Quote:
At first glance I thought the discussion had turned to underwear!
Aye, you have a stronger pool, but in practice not that much stronger, or maybe even under-achieving. Anyway, such potential can be overstated. Wales have more players than us, and disproportionately more playing in the English Prem. Yet we've outpointed them in the last three tournaments.Quote:
Originally Posted by IFK
Bully for him. The most obvious effect of Dick's boys playing Croatia reserves rather than NI's in a half-paced friendly was that they lost- against us I expect they'd have won. And so presumably improved their hopeless recent ranking.Quote:
And, as you know, international footballer managers such as Dick Advocaat are of the same opinion
You bet it does. On the strength of their recent hosting of Brazil's globetrotters, Estonia have really boosted their strength and status in World football. I believe they boosted their normal crowd quite a bit despite charging EU 100 at the gate.Quote:
Indeed the status/ strength an international team holds is highlighted by the quality of opposition they are able to attract for friendly games
In reality glamorous visitors- like big city centre stadia- are incidental to status and strength, frequency of qualifying for tournaments etc.
Gormless way for Kennedy to describe it. If we really must have a PR spin in IFA marketing, I'd call Albania, Montenegro etc. 'exotic' instead. In practice, NI won't play or even invite France, Spain, Germany, Argentina etc. in the foreseeable future because we'd lose money on the deal. Given a likely low crowd and high fee to the visitors.Quote:
Granted this is also linked to financial clout but it's telling that the IFA's perception of what consistutes a glamour friendly is a game away to Albania
Indeed. As this series has barely started, best to refer the WC qualifiers.Quote:
Originally Posted by Predator
I think I am fair to Geysir. Merely pointing out that, in posting regularly on the NI side, he isn't typical nor representative of RoI fans here. Or, a bit more crudely, like you, me, Pred, EG, etc., he's one of the 'usual suspects' on related threads.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ardee Bhoy
Obviously I support another team and don't pretend more than a passing knowledge of the Republic's side. Much of which is provded by posters here, including you ;)
Look, we know you'd do anything to achieve a united Ireland (apart from actually live in it, maybe). But that's hardly relevant to a discussion on FIFA rankings, is it?Quote:
it's more an objection to the status of the North of Ireland and its institutional bigotry that have existed out of its very creation
Unsure exactly what you mean by that.Quote:
Originally Posted by ifk101
Anyhow, whilst FIFA's Rankings have many debateable aspects, nonetheless I consider them valid to use when comparing two teams from the same Confederation, provided a long enough period is used.
And the last four years sees ROI ranked 38th in the world, with NI ranked 39th.
When he introduced the NI team into this thread, Geysir implied that ROI are clearly superior to NI, yet he adduces no credible evidence to support this.
Certainly "stronger", arguably "far stronger", I grant you. But football is not played on paper or on Message Boards etc, it is played on grass, where "the whole is often greater than the sum of the parts".Quote:
Originally Posted by ifk101
"Managers" plural?Quote:
Originally Posted by ifk101
OK, Dick Advocaat didn't rate us, but so what? He may not have rated Slovakia the other week, either, before they inflicted Russia/USSR's second(?) competitive defeat in Moscow since WWII! Yet any NI fan could have told him that these days, Slovakia are stronger than they look, too.
Even the best managers can underestimate opponents to their peril, as Sir Alex Ferguson demonstrated on Tuesday by fielding a weakened team against Rangers.
And Geysir is no Sir Alex (even if he may be a Dick).
Wrong!Quote:
Originally Posted by ifk101
Unless there is some compelling footballing reason (usually as preparation for a competitive game against similar opposition - eg Chile vs NI before the World Cup Finals), "financial clout" invariably determines why Associations (not managers, btw) select opponents for friendlies.
Or why do you think eg Brazil play 95%+ of their friendlies away from home, were it not for the £1m+ appearance fee they can command, along with the financial incentive from NIKE (require to see their 'product' on display in as many markets as possible)?
The simple fact is, if NI had an 80k stadium (Croke), or even a 50k one (AVIVA) and could sell it out at high prices every time, then we'd be playing Brazil, England, Argentina etc every time, too.
Or better still, we'd be inviting giants of the game such as Scotland, Wales or, ahem, ROI, to compete in a "glamour" tournament every two years...
(Btw, no-one at the IFA ever described Albania as "glamour". Rather, when under pressure for different reasons, Kennedy promised the fans a "glamour friendly". Then when his original target fell through, it was too late to get anyone decent, since all the decent teams had already sorted their fixture list, in preparation for the forthcoming World Cup)
How do you know he's not typical? Have you done a straw poll of even 5 people??
The North only gets a mention because you accuse people of stirring (wrongly) about their ranking status. When as Geysir says correctly, we just don't care.
There are however other objectionable points about it's existence which I referred to in passing. But only to emphasise yer paranoia.
;)
And to EG, clearly in the last 25 years, Ireland has been ahead of the North in the rankings most of that time.
Though just think how much higher the average would have been with a UI team!
;)
Er, I read the threads. A few people (most prominently you personally, but also including Geysir and the others I mentioned) tend to dominate those on NI. No need for a straw poll, is there?Quote:
Originally Posted by ArdeeBhoy
You and Geysir obviously do care, as demonstrated by posting frequently- in your case, incessantly- on the subject. Basically 'Let's take over the NI team even though it's rubbish and the fans are Orange bigots', 100-200 times per megathread.Quote:
The North only gets a mention because you accuse people of stirring (wrongly) about their ranking status. When as Geysir says correctly, we just don't care
You're the obsessive one on here, Dr Freud.Quote:
There are however other objectionable points about it's existence which I referred to in passing. But only to emphasise yer paranoia ;)
Are you on drugs? There's been a UI team far longer than that- supplemented by good players from beyond- yet you've qualified for one finals out of eight.Quote:
And to EG, clearly in the last 25 years, Ireland has been ahead of the North in the rankings most of that time.
Though just think how much higher the average would have been with a UI team!
;)
Stop trolling, troll.
No, you wondered whether I "felt the need [sic] to be offended". For the record, I was not "offended", nor do I feel any particular "need" for same.Quote:
Originally Posted by Predator
But if sticking up for my team when it is sneered at on a football message board makes me "hyper-sensitive", then I must be Guilty as Charged. Along with every other poster on this Board.
"Some people", perhaps, but not this one.Quote:
Originally Posted by Predator
What was it, then? And in just about every other reference he makes to the NI team?Quote:
Originally Posted by Predator
Fine. Like NI and ROI, we're "both on the same page", then...Quote:
Originally Posted by Predator
Ba-Dum-Ch!!! ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by Gather round
If you say so.Quote:
Originally Posted by Gather round
Wrong, as usual. My only concerns are dealing with the predictable paranoia and hypocrisy every time the North is mentioned in passing from its deluded supporters.Quote:
You and Geysir obviously do care, as demonstrated by posting frequently- in your case, incessantly- on the subject. Basically 'Let's take over the NI team even though it's rubbish and the fans are Orange bigots', 100-200 times per megathread.
Clearly the first and last sentences are both ironic and hypocritical by yer goodself. But we'll spare the finer details.Quote:
Are you on drugs? There's been a UI team far longer than that- supplemented by good players from beyond- yet you've qualified for one finals out of eight.
Stop trolling, troll.
Have you bought that dictionary yet??
;)
As for a UI team, like the earlier post I made (unsurprisingly unanswered by yourself!), are you now saying the North don't exist?? Though I note they haven't (and won't) qualified in 25 years and counting.....
They aren't though and have never been in the past 20 years bar a very short period of time a couple of years ago when Staunton was in charge and we were at our lowest ebb and NI were punching above their weight when both teams were about the same i.e. sh*t. Only a deluded NI fan like could claim your team was every bit as good as ours. Ask anyone in England where I believe you live if NI are as good as ROI at the moment and I'd be surprised if you could find anyone that would agree with your assertion. Anyone that knew anything about International football anyway.Quote:
Originally Posted by EalingGreen
The rankings are a nonsense. NI being anywhere near us in it only serves to drive that point home. How many play-offs for final competitions have you reached in all that time you're meant to be as good as us?
Isn't he head of the UN?Quote:
Originally Posted by The Fly
Strictly speaking, I think we were a bit better: more points, half as many wins again, going into the second half of the 12th game with a chance to qualify as opposed to finishing 12 points behind Czechia. 'Mediocre' and 'slightly less so' would be fairer- you did still finish ahead of Slovakia in that tournament, to be fair.Quote:
Originally Posted by youngirish
With you on the rankings generally, they don't reflect current real achivement because largely irrelevant recent friendlies and long-gone tournaments are included in the calculation. Actually, we aren't that near you (20th and 26th in Europe). A better comparison would be betwen you and Turkey, 14th in Europe despite even NI actually surpassing them in qualification.Quote:
The rankings are a nonsense. NI being anywhere near us in it only serves to drive that point home. How many play-offs for final competitions have you reached in all that time you're meant to be as good as us?
But to follow up Danny I and EG's points, you either accept the rankings (in their entirety), or dismiss them like I do. They're formulaic and the formula is there for all to see, however complex. Accept it, and Gabon and Turkey are better than RoI now; South Korea and New Zealand aren't. Look over a longer period (5-15 years, say) and for much of it NI are only just behind you. However odd it looks.
Fair enough.Quote:
Originally Posted by EalingGreen
A "good" team is a team that produces a consistent and reliable level of performance everytime. Sort of like a functioning public transport system - a tram perhaps?Quote:
Originally Posted by EalingGreen
Then again maybe he did and does.Quote:
Originally Posted by EalingGreen
Dick Advocaat?Quote:
Originally Posted by EalingGreen
"If" and "could" are the key words. Idle speculation.Quote:
Originally Posted by EalingGreen
If the IFA learns how to govern itself, the dreams of a new stadium and the hosting of glamour tournaments can be yours.Quote:
Originally Posted by EalingGreen
Albania won the game, did they or did they not? Bit unfair to be dismissive of them like that, no?Quote:
Originally Posted by EalingGreen