Drogs penalty-possible FAI Smudge?

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20/10/2008, 11:24 AM
Dodge

Quote:

Originally Posted by sligoman

Why's that? I was under the impression that if Galway got past Derry then they were guaranteed the 4th spot in Europe no matter what. This makes things a bit more interesting for us now*:)

The cup losers only ever get in if they lose the final to the league champions (i.e. double winners). EUFA rank the Cup winners ahead of 2nd in league.

So if, for example, Pats beat galway in the FAI final, and the league table finished as

1 Bohs
2 Pats
3 Derry
4 Sligo

The Euro qualifiers would be (depending on licenses etc etc) Bohs, Pats, Derry. Sligo

Presuming the 1,2,3 in the league is Bohs, Pats, Derry (or Derry/Pats) and Galway lose the semi on Sunday, 4th will be guarenteed Europa League ;)
20/10/2008, 11:38 AM
scej

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dodge

The cup losers only ever get in if they lose the final to the league champions (i.e. double winners).

I thought part of the new UEFA Cup criteria was that losing cup finalists no longer qualify, even if they lose to the league champions.

From Wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/UEFA_Cup)

Cup winners who have already qualified for European competition via league placing will no longer hand their UEFA Europa League slot to the losing finalist. Their place in the competition will instead devolve onto the highest-placed team in the league not yet in European competition.
20/10/2008, 12:19 PM
Dodge

That wasn't implemented. It was proposed but didn't receive enough votes AFAIK. Wiki doesn't reference anything, and the original BBC report that announced it has been changed

So, AFAIK, its status quo with regards to cup final losers
20/10/2008, 12:23 PM
sligored

Quote:

Originally Posted by scej

I thought part of the new UEFA Cup criteria was that losing cup finalists no longer qualify, even if they lose to the league champions.

From Wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/UEFA_Cup)

Cup winners who have already qualified for European competition via league placing will no longer hand their UEFA Europa League slot to the losing finalist. Their place in the competition will instead devolve onto the highest-placed team in the league not yet in European competition.

man city finished behind portsmouth in england last year but man city ended up in europe and i am pretty sure cardiff did not despite being cup runner ups.
20/10/2008, 12:32 PM
Dodge

Quote:

Originally Posted by sligored

man city finished behind portsmouth in england last year but man city ended up in europe and i am pretty sure cardiff did not despite being cup runner ups.

It only works with teams who have qualified for Champions League. So if Cardiff lost to Man U, they'd have been in.

man City qualfied for europe through the UEFA Fair play spot
20/10/2008, 12:33 PM
Nah Nah Nah Nah

Quote:

Originally Posted by sligored

man city finished behind portsmouth in england last year but man city ended up in europe and i am pretty sure cardiff did not despite being cup runner ups.

Portsmouth didn't qualify for Europe through the league. They came mid table. City only got in on the fair play or by playing Intertoto or something like that.

Not sure if this is the way it works but this was my impression of how it worked

If the winners of the cup have qualified for the Champions League (double winners thus in Ireland) tbe place for the cup final goes to the runners up as the CL qualification is seen as better then the qualification for the cup.

If they finished in a place for the UEFA Cup in the league the Cup is seen as greater so they are seen to have taken the UEFA spot that was there for winning the cup and then the UEFA spot for the league goes to the next placed team
20/10/2008, 1:47 PM
holidaysong

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nah Nah Nah Nah

If the winners of the cup have qualified for the Champions League (double winners thus in Ireland) tbe place for the cup final goes to the runners up as the CL qualification is seen as better then the qualification for the cup.

If they finished in a place for the UEFA Cup in the league the Cup is seen as greater so they are seen to have taken the UEFA spot that was there for winning the cup and then the UEFA spot for the league goes to the next placed team

Correct.

And as Dodge stated, it was proposed that cup runnners-up couldn't qualify for the Europa League but it wasn't actually implemented.
20/10/2008, 3:44 PM
passerrby

Quote:

Originally Posted by holidaysong

Correct.

And as Dodge stated, it was proposed that cup runnners-up couldn't qualify for the Europa League but it wasn't actually implemented.

afaik it is in after next season
20/10/2008, 3:51 PM
Dodge

Any sources? Couldn't find any

(and don't mean this to be smartarsey, genuinely I've been looking for stuff on europe next year)
20/10/2008, 3:58 PM
Rovers Maniac

Quote:

Originally Posted by passerrby

afaik it is in after next season

Pretty sure the new rules were being brought in with start of this new Europa League or whatever it is called now. But that is open to correction but i thought that was the one thing i gathered from the whole thing. :o:)
20/10/2008, 4:06 PM
higgins

Quote:

Originally Posted by Billy Lord

Rovers were deducted all points earned pre-examinership.

They had to punish you somehow so came up with the magic 8 points (which just happened to be your total at the time) for the accounts being the same two years running.

Rovers were not docked a single point for going into examinership.
20/10/2008, 5:06 PM
passerrby

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dodge

Any sources? Couldn't find any

(and don't mean this to be smartarsey, genuinely I've been looking for stuff on europe next year)

am 95% sure but will get confirmation and get back to you
29/10/2008, 4:26 PM
holidaysong

Are Drogheda going to get a points deduction then or what? :confused:
29/10/2008, 5:23 PM
Rovers Maniac

Quote:

Originally Posted by holidaysong

Are Drogheda going to get a points deduction then or what? :confused:

Licsening Committee are to meet next monday in regards to it.
29/10/2008, 5:30 PM
holidaysong

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rovers Maniac

Licsening Committee are to meet next monday in regards to it.

Thanks.
29/10/2008, 5:44 PM
Mr A

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rovers Maniac

Licsening Committee are to meet next monday in regards to it.

But will they only be discussing Drogheda I wonder...
29/10/2008, 5:52 PM
pete

It is the Licencing Body (or similar one) that issues the points deduction so until they sit Drogs keep their points. It is correct the Examiner asked that City situation be decided quickly. I would be amazed is Drogs did not get 10 point deduction as it was explained that we got it for entering Examinership & as such nothing really to do with licencing or 65% rule which have yet to be decided.

From the outside Drogs look in much worse situation. CCFC would be gone if we did not sell Mooney (to pay Examiner up front) & we would not have been able to afford even modest repayment of debts if didn't have the potential for significant cut of Doyle transfer.

I still can't understand how Drogs can afford to pay the Examiner 250k up front & not afford to pay debtors. :confused:
30/10/2008, 11:55 AM
HarpoJoyce

Quote:

Originally Posted by pete

It is the Licencing Body (or similar one) that issues the points deduction so until they sit Drogs keep their points. It is correct the Examiner asked that City situation be decided quickly. I would be amazed is Drogs did not get 10 point deduction as it was explained that we got it for entering Examinership & as such nothing really to do with licencing or 65% rule which have yet to be decided.

From the outside Drogs look in much worse situation. CCFC would be gone if we did not sell Mooney (to pay Examiner up front) & we would not have been able to afford even modest repayment of debts if didn't have the potential for significant cut of Doyle transfer.

I still can't understand how Drogs can afford to pay the Examiner 250k up front & not afford to pay debtors. :confused:

Application for Examinership by Shamrock Rovers, Cork City and Drogheda United was always about protecting the name of the club and never about recognising responsibility towards their creditors.

I have defended Drogheda Utd.'s actions in recent years because I believe 'investment needs to be rewarded' (climbing up the table, increased European participation)
But now I'm with the Revenue Commisioners on this one. They have my best interets at heart.
30/10/2008, 12:18 PM
Rovers Maniac

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr A

But will they only be discussing Drogheda I wonder...

Do you expect Harps to get punished?
30/10/2008, 12:34 PM
Dodge

Quote:

Originally Posted by pete

I still can't understand how Drogs can afford to pay the Examiner 250k up front & not afford to pay debtors. :confused:

Drogheda have some very wealthy directors behind them. Not that hard to understand surely?

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