League of Ireland in Europe 2019

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Originally Posted by RathfarnhamHoop

There are far too many variables involved to form an option based of one game. Using more than one piece of data to form your opinion is literally rule number one of analysis.

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Living in Switzerland I am fortunate (or unfortunate) to get to see 6, if u include Lichtenstein, Swiss leagues teams on TV (and sometimes up close) battle it out in Europe year in year out. From watching these games, mostly Europea games, rounds where the LOI teams have yet to reach I can tell you the general standard of most of the games is pish poor. A lot of it has to do with too many games and lack of interest so most of the time I am watching teams half heartedly play football to half empty stadiums. The novelty of Europa league football year in year out has long gone for a lot of fans here. And not just here, but for a lot of mid ranking countries who will never win a big euro title. For example, last season once basel dropped into the EL, they couldn't even give away the tickets. The interest and level of skill and entertainment only rises if a team gets anywhere near the latter stages, and by that stage the big four nations teams (Italy, Eng, Spa, ger) then also take an interest. So I am saying a lot of the games in the Europea are piddle, but I am not sure what the stats would tell me on that.............

Apollon Limassol knocked Basel out last year, they were well worth it too, sucker punching us on the break. But it was more to do with Basel been **** last season than how good AL were.

So yes I think Qarabag are good. :D

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Originally Posted by bennocelt

Well I disagree, looking at both teams for the first time I think Qarabag are as good a team as Dundalk have played in recent times, up there with that Russian team and Legia were good in parts, any of the Cypriot teams that have played LOI teams in the past have always looked beatable. Don't care about stats, sorry.

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Qarabag were the best team Dundalk played since Zenit St Petersberg. Their technique especially in the first half was way ahead of any side I have seen visiting these shores in recent years in europe.

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Originally Posted by oriel

Qarabag were the best team Dundalk played since Zenit St Petersberg. Their technique especially in the first half was way ahead of any side I have seen visiting these shores in recent years in europe.

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Yeah that's how I saw it, and as some Dundalk fan already mentioned here, the fans knew it too, hence the huge cheer when Hoban scored. I imagine they wilted in the second half due to a lack of full time training, and Id say next week they will be that much fitter. You would be amazed how much a team can improve in one week in terms of match fitness.........(re Cork V Genk as a good example)

They were so good, at HT I was almost ordering a brandy to calm myself instead of a pint of harp ! We honestly thought they would have destroyed us in the second half.

No doubt they will be thinking they are almost home and dry, but if Dundalk can put in a performance like away to Legia (they only equalised in injury time), we might have a chance, its a very tall order though.

Dundalk have had some excellent away results in recent years, but not many wins, the standout was a 2-1 win in Split in 2014, that would do, next best were 1-1 draws v Alkmaar and Legia, but the away wins have been rare, in Lux (twice) & Tallin (once) so its going to need something extra special.

Another stat which is chilling, and just shows how hard any win is in europe for any Irish side (credit Rovers having two already this season), is Dundalk's last home win in either the EC / CL was as far back as 1979, v Hibs of Malta.

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Originally Posted by RathfarnhamHoop

All the games between the two clubs have been pretty even, even the one when rovers were missing half a squad. There was nothing in either game in Tallaght. I feel safe in saying a neutral would call Dundalk and Rovers pretty even.

Who's better Porto or Ajax?
QED

It's not nonsensical, Qarabag have basically guaranteed access to the Champions league every year because the rest of the league is pretty poor whereas in Cyprus there's Larnaca and Apoel to compete with so they don't have that safety net so have to win every round to get into the groups.

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These sort of p1ssing match debates only go round in circles as the subjective nature takes over. But honestly to refer to Rovers missing half a squad for any game against us this season and not to consider that Dundalk had to cobble together an entire midfield and play injured players for what is almost half a season squished in to the first 3 months, isnt very balanced observation.

Nobody is taking away from Rovers result, Dundalk escaped with a draw just about. Aside from what the stats indicate, more neutral observers would in all likelyhood think that there was more about Qarabag. I'm not sure what yer getting at with the 6 titles in a row etc - its possible that Dundalk could have 5 from 6 seasons and you cant say it wasnt competative for the most part or (almost) guaranteed access to CL each year as it might look to the outsider. Anyway we all know that Rovers up their game and bust a gut to beat us - have to considering the Derby games are a forgone conclusion!! ;)

Can we not go back to loving each other on this thread, it's only 1

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Originally Posted by Nesta99

These sort of p1ssing match debates only go round in circles as the subjective nature takes over. But honestly to refer to Rovers missing half a squad for any game against us this season and not to consider that Dundalk had to cobble together an entire midfield and play injured players for what is almost half a season squished in to the first 3 months, isnt very balanced observation.

Nobody is taking away from Rovers result, Dundalk escaped with a draw just about. Aside from what the stats indicate, more neutral observers would in all likelyhood think that there was more about Qarabag. I'm not sure what yer getting at with the 6 titles in a row etc - its possible that Dundalk could have 5 from 6 seasons and you cant say it wasnt competative for the most part or (almost) guaranteed access to CL each year as it might look to the outsider. Anyway we all know that Rovers up their game and bust a gut to beat us - have to considering the Derby games are a forgone conclusion!! ;)

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I'm not trying to get into any sort of ****ing contest. Dundalk didn't exactly have cobbled together midfields against Rovers now did they? As a reminder the midfields for the first two were Shields, Murray, McGrath and Shields, McGrath McEleney. Whereas Rovers had a 16 year old left back and an attacking midfielder at right back and a bench with an average age of 19 years old, that's a completely different level. My whole point was that Rovers and Dundalk are pretty equal this season which I think the two Tallaght games have shown.

What stats show it? The coefficient that also says Porto are 7 places and 11.500 points better than Ajax? What I'm getting at with the 6 in a row thing is that when you're in the champions league its a lot easier to qualify for one of the group stages and to build up the coefficient. Just for the record Qarabag average winning the league by 0.35 points per game, for comparison Dundalk's average is 0.22, That's a big difference. Once in the group stages their records are actually pretty similar. As I've said already you can't judge a team based off watching one game there are far too many variables involved to do that, including Rovers potentially just finding out their opposition quicker than Dundalk theirs. As for the last sentence the same goes for the other way too. Breaking news: Top two teams want to beat each other. None of this takes anything away from Dundalk but it is seriously worrying the way you guys take suck exception to anything short of absolute praise and even praise of other clubs/players.

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Originally Posted by RathfarnhamHoop

My whole point was that Rovers and Dundalk are pretty equal this season which I think the two Tallaght games have shown.

What stats show it? .

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1 point from 3 matches between the sides shows Rovers remain far from equal

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Originally Posted by Ezeikial

1 point from 3 matches between the sides shows Rovers remain far from equal

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But OTHER than that they were the same 😀

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Originally Posted by marinobohs

But OTHER than that they were the same 😀

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Marino shouldnt you be taking a break from the internet after your embarrassing display in the other thread? This is for european games anyway. Not really something you need to worry about as a proud underachiever.

Nesta would you not say you got out of our last meeting with a lucky 3 points no? Most would. Best ive seen us play against you and I think its a sign the gap is closing. Made you look pretty normal for the first time in years. Bar gannon. Unreal player. The one that got away.

On the field things are even enough . On the league table its another matter but thats down to our games against the hipsters. Wed be top if we managed to put them away.

As for missing players.... You brought in a lad who was starting for watford as a replacement.. Among others. I dont think anyone would buy that dundalk have limited depth. Shields and benson are great players but you coped just fine. Almost have two league winning elevens up there to pick from whereas rovers were fielding kids. We've added depth now with cummins, farrugia and oneill. Bench starting to look better which we need. 14 man game and all that. Dundalk still so stacked though and it will probably carry you to another league. Congrats if so.

The AP v Qarabag debate is a bit silly but a neutral would probably look at the Cypriot league being ranked above the Azerbaijani along with AP beating lazio and marseille in europe last year whereas Q, while qualifying impressively to the CL group stages, didn't exactly set the world alight when there. The club coefficient tells a different story but we know all the coefficient stuff is a bit problematic, league and club alike. Footballs about more than points or we wouldn't bother watching it!

Two good sides though, with great pedigree in europe and both our sides will be doing well to go through. Think rovers are handling it better so far in that they are winning games, but dundalk find ways to win even when they arent playing well. That's why they are champions elect.

Good luck with qarabag. On balance id rather you dropped into the europa but in the spirit of football supporters sticking together.....

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Originally Posted by ontheotherhand

Marino shouldnt you be taking a break from the internet after your embarrassing display in the other thread? This is for european games anyway. Not really something you need to worry about as a proud underachiever.

Nesta would you not say you got out of our last meeting with a lucky 3 points no? Most would. Best ive seen us play against you and I think its a sign the gap is closing. Made you look pretty normal for the first time in years. Bar gannon. Unreal player. The one that got away.

On the field things are even enough . On the league table its another matter but thats down to our games against the hipsters. Wed be top if we managed to put them away.

As for missing players.... You brought in a lad who was starting for watford as a replacement.. Among others. I dont think anyone would buy that dundalk have limited depth. Shields and benson are great players but you coped just fine. Almost have two league winning elevens up there to pick from whereas rovers were fielding kids. We've added depth now with cummins, farrugia and oneill. Bench starting to look better which we need. 14 man game and all that. Dundalk still so stacked though and it will probably carry you to another league. Congrats if so.

The AP v Qarabag debate is a bit silly but a neutral would probably look at the Cypriot league being ranked above the Azerbaijani along with AP beating lazio and marseille in europe last year whereas Q, while qualifying impressively to the CL group stages, didn't exactly set the world alight when there. The club coefficient tells a different story but we know all the coefficient stuff is a bit problematic, league and club alike. Footballs about more than points or we wouldn't bother watching it!

Two good sides though, with great pedigree in europe and both our sides will be doing well to go through. Think rovers are handling it better so far in that they are winning games, but dundalk find ways to win even when they arent playing well. That's why they are champions elect.

Good luck with qarabag. On balance id rather you dropped into the europa but in the spirit of football supporters sticking together.....

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Oh dear, obviously not up to date 😁 Maybe check out how the "Kearns is innocent "campaign is going before coming in here spouting rubbish.
Anyone care to tell him ?
BTW underachieving is better than going bankrupt and misappropriatibg tax payers money don't you think ?

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Originally Posted by marinobohs

Oh dear, obviously not up to date 😁 Maybe check out how the "Kearns is innocent "campaign is going before coming in here spouting rubbish.
Anyone care to tell him ?
BTW underachieving is better than going bankrupt and misappropriatibg tax payers money don't you think ?

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Ill leave you to it. You have a tremendous ability to lose debates all on your own and without the help of adult supervision.

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Originally Posted by ontheotherhand

Ill leave you to it. You have a tremendous ability to lose debates all on your own and without the help of adult supervision.

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Four. More. Games 😁
Maybe your adult supervisor can explain it to you.

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Originally Posted by marinobohs

Four. More. Games 😁
Maybe your adult supervisor can explain it to you.

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PM me if you'd like. You can explain what you are trying to say and i'll show you again why it doesn't work. Happy to help a student. It will save everyone else the spectacle of you posting inconsistent ramblings to the point you get threatened with a ban.

Unless you have something to say about european football that's useful?

Lads has anyone considered the possibility that marinobohs is special needs ?
I think we should give him the benefit of the doubt.

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Originally Posted by sbgawa

Lads has anyone considered the possibility that marinobohs is special needs ?
I think we should give him the benefit of the doubt.

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Honestly, im only responding to him because he implied he was a student and its entertaining/alarming to see his lack of clarity. I usually don't engage with internet wums because you never know the backstory.

The bookies who don't do bias have a good idea of how difficult a job dundalk and Rovers have.
Quarabag are 1/5 ON to qualify for the next round and while they haven't put up odds yet for the Europa league matches (other than straight match odds,) they have Appolon 4/9 ON to win the match .
Dundalk have a safety net but it is strongly likely we will have both teams lose the next leg, either team progressing would be a massive accoplishment

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Originally Posted by ontheotherhand

On the field things are even enough . On the league table its another matter but thats down to our games against the hipsters. Wed be top if we managed to put them away.

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So your saying that Rovers would be top if they had won 3 of the games that they lost?

For Finn Harps their number is only 13.

Fine margins, huh?

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Originally Posted by Ezeikial

So your saying that Rovers would be top if they had won 3 of the games that they lost?

For Finn Harps their number is only 13.

Fine margins, huh?

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Fine indeed. The width of a crossbar, a shoelace on Danny Mandrouis boot or so often in your own case, the whim of a referee in the dying minutes of a game when a dundalk player goes tumbling to the ground after a particularly violent gust of wind.

The clearest example of how much the gap has closed is probably not in the head to heads, on field battles or relative gathering of points by the finest of margins though - it's in how much you seem to post about Rovers versus any other topic. Methinks the lad doth post too much..........maybe you're getting worried?

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Originally Posted by ontheotherhand

Fine indeed. The width of a crossbar, a shoelace on Danny Mandrouis boot or so often in your own case, the whim of a referee in the dying minutes of a game when a dundalk player goes tumbling to the ground after a particularly violent gust of wind.

The clearest example of how much the gap has closed is probably not in the head to heads, on field battles or relative gathering of points by the finest of margins though - it's in how much you seem to post about Rovers versus any other topic. Methinks the lad doth post too much..........maybe you're getting worried?

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My loathing of all things Rovers has been consistent for a long time. If Rovers fans keep posting their delusional fantasy, I'm likely to continue to set the record straight or call out this sort of nonsense

Rovers have narrowed some gaps, by their own very pathetic standard in recent years - the distance to the top of the table has been 22 to 25 points in each of the last 3 season.

Rovers current 2.04 points per match average in 2019 (51 points from 25 matches) would not have got them above 3rd place in any of those seasons.

Rovers have a lot more improvement to make before I'm likely to get even mildly worried

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Originally Posted by ontheotherhand

Honestly, im only responding to him because he implied he was a student and its entertaining/alarming to see his lack of clarity. I usually don't engage with internet wums because you never know the backstory.

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A student ? WTF are you on ? I was in Belfield to see Bohs playing UCD 😳
There really is no cure for that level of stupid.

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Originally Posted by ontheotherhand

Fine indeed. The width of a crossbar, a shoelace on Danny Mandrouis boot or so often in your own case, the whim of a referee in the dying minutes of a game when a dundalk player goes tumbling to the ground after a particularly violent gust of wind.

The clearest example of how much the gap has closed is probably not in the head to heads, on field battles or relative gathering of points by the finest of margins though - it's in how much you seem to post about Rovers versus any other topic. Methinks the lad doth post too much..........maybe you're getting worried?

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Why are you wasting your time with this troll it's like wrestling with a pig, it's pointless and you are only going to end up covered in muck.
Most of the dundalk posters have pm me to agree he is an embarrassment to them. Imagine what he will be like when dundalk slip, probably disappear.

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Originally Posted by sbgawa

Why are you wasting your time with this troll it's like wrestling with a pig, it's pointless and you are only going to end up covered in muck.
Most of the dundalk posters have pm me to agree he is an embarrassment to them. Imagine what he will be like when dundalk slip, probably disappear.

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The very epitome of a pointless post - posting to encourage others not to discuss something that they have already posted and been called out on!

It does prompt me to update an earlier post

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Originally Posted by Ezeikial

Rovers current 2.04 points per match average in 2019 (51 points from 25 matches) would not have got them above 3rd place in any of those seasons.

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Following todays draw in Cork, Rovers current average of 2.0 points per match would not have achieved a top two league finish in any year since 2012

A poor Drogheda team took second place that season; Cork's demise appears to have opened the door for Rovers to emulate that Drogheda 2012 performance

That Drogheda team was one of the greatest to ever play the game

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Originally Posted by marinobohs

A student ? WTF are you on ? I was in Belfield to see Bohs playing UCD 😳
There really is no cure for that level of stupid.

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You're saying this online version of you is you fully matured? Going to stick you on the ignore list so.

Ezekial, is at least replying with reasonable evidence backing up his point, even if he seems a bit clouded by loathing. It is a bit odd that a person defines themselves by hatred of another club rather than love of their own but Dundalk are a fairly unloveable outfit.....

This weekends game are a case in point for how close it's gotten. Close but Dundalk still stronger. Dundalk digging out a result against Pats even when they didn't very play well whereas Rovers dominated Cork but couldn't get 3 points. If we had one of Hoban or Kelly the league table might look a lot different but we have Aaron Greene.....god love him he tries but he just can't finish under any sort of pressure at all. Maybe we won't fix that next year but if we do I'd think it will be a longer and more competitive title race. Would think Dundalk have it wrapped up now. Maybe we will meet each other in the Europa League final for some revenge.

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Originally Posted by ontheotherhand

You're saying this online version of you is you fully matured? Going to stick you on the ignore list so.

Ezekial, is at least replying with reasonable evidence backing up his point, even if he seems a bit clouded by loathing. It is a bit odd that a person defines themselves by hatred of another club rather than love of their own but Dundalk are a fairly unloveable outfit.....

This weekends game are a case in point for how close it's gotten. Close but Dundalk still stronger. Dundalk digging out a result against Pats even when they didn't very play well whereas Rovers dominated Cork but couldn't get 3 points. If we had one of Hoban or Kelly the league table might look a lot different but we have Aaron Greene.....god love him he tries but he just can't finish under any sort of pressure at all. Maybe we won't fix that next year but if we do I'd think it will be a longer and more competitive title race. Would think Dundalk have it wrapped up now. Maybe we will meet each other in the Europa League final for some revenge.

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Apart from maybe 20mins at the start of Dundalk's game against Pats last night Dundalk dominated the match and were unlucky not to win by more than 1-0.

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Originally Posted by ontheotherhand

You're saying this online version of you is you fully matured? Going to stick you on the ignore list so.

Ezekial, is at least replying with reasonable evidence backing up his point, even if he seems a bit clouded by loathing. It is a bit odd that a person defines themselves by hatred of another club rather than love of their own but Dundalk are a fairly unloveable outfit.....

This weekends game are a case in point for how close it's gotten. Close but Dundalk still stronger. Dundalk digging out a result against Pats even when they didn't very play well whereas Rovers dominated Cork but couldn't get 3 points. If we had one of Hoban or Kelly the league table might look a lot different but we have Aaron Greene.....god love him he tries but he just can't finish under any sort of pressure at all. Maybe we won't fix that next year but if we do I'd think it will be a longer and more competitive title race. Would think Dundalk have it wrapped up now. Maybe we will meet each other in the Europa League final for some revenge.

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This weeks games, where Dundalk extended their lead by two more points proves the teams are getting nearer ? This weeks games obviously put them further apart - 2 points further apart to be exact.
That “reasonable enough evidence” for you ?

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Originally Posted by ToberonaTornado

Apart from maybe 20mins at the start of Dundalk's game against Pats last night Dundalk dominated the match and were unlucky not to win by more than 1-0.

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Fair enough. I only caught the first half which was dominated by Pats for the start and then by Dundalk for the end as you say but White Horse on the match thread said it wasn't a great Dundalk performance and even enough overall? I've read match reports that had Dundalk dominating or it being back and forth. Didn't seem at their best to me and I'd expect you to beat Pat's handily but in fairness, you rested three of your best players and still won the game. Wish we could stick teams away when we dominate......wouldn't mind loaning us Georgie Kelly would you? I'll drive up and pick him up myself. Will even give you Aaron Greene in return......

POSTPONED: Next Saturday’s league fixture with @DundalkFC
has been postponed due to their European game

We lose more money on a gate when its rescheduled on some random Monday night to give Dundalk a better chance of earning way more money. Clubs should be compensated if they have to cancel games due to other teams being in Europe.

Dear FAI fixture coordinators,
Schedule teams that have European football to have home games during potential European runs, its not rocket science.
Sincerely,
Everyone with a pair of braincells to rub together.

That's a fair point if a club has a home game called off to facilitate Euro game the euro club should have to give them their average gate on the night in question and then when the game is refixed it's pure profit for the non Euro club

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Originally Posted by RathfarnhamHoop

Dear FAI fixture coordinators,
Schedule teams that have European football to have home games during potential European runs, its not rocket science.
Sincerely,
Everyone with a pair of braincells to rub together.

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Far too much logic in that suggestion for the FAI to even consider it.

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Originally Posted by Nah Nah Nah Nah

POSTPONED: Next Saturday’s league fixture with @DundalkFC
has been postponed due to their European game

We lose more money on a gate when its rescheduled on some random Monday night to give Dundalk a better chance of earning way more money. Clubs should be compensated if they have to cancel games due to other teams being in Europe.

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Sligo should not have had a home tie against Dundalk scheduled for this weekend. Dundalk should have been scheduled with a home tie and be the ones missing out on the home gate. It is grossly unfair on Sligo.

From a player welfare point of view, Dundalk had no option but to seek postponement as players cannot endure a 9 hour flight from Baku, miss a night's sleep, and then travel early the following day (Saturday) to Sligo.

The alternative would be to play the game on Sunday, but than would potentially mean Dundalk travelling early the next day to Cyprus with no warm down or medical treatment for players following the match in Sligo.

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Originally Posted by White Horse

Far too much logic in that suggestion for the FAI to even consider it.

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For the Rovers UCD game that was grand, no extra travel, gate loss all on the club that's getting extra money anyway, that's how it should be done. The Cork game on the other hand, loads of extra travel and the home team had the game moved from their normal day, that's not fair on anyone. I'd love to meet whoever they have organising the fixtures, seems like its a secondary school kid on work experience at best.

I can completely see the frustration from Sligo here, a Sat night trip over would have attracted maybe 300-400 possibly 500 away fans, and its also the BH weekend, loads would have considered staying over. I can see how the LC semi was postponed on the BH Monday, but again another clubs loses out in Bohs, and to be perfectly honest, I don't think Dundalk had targeted LC as must win, thats a tough one on Bohs.

I dont think Dundalk will get past Qarabag but if they do thats another 500k banked, even without, its onto EL r3 and a chance to still earn more than the current 1.2M , the re-fixed Sligo game will attract min 500 less, maybe as much as 1k thats a big loss for them.

Jeez rathfarnham hoop I hope foot.ie protect your anonymity when the secondary school kids come looking to sue you for defamation comparing them to the fixture scheduler in the FAI

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Originally Posted by oriel

I can completely see the frustration from Sligo here, a Sat night trip over would have attracted maybe 300-400 possibly 500 away fans, and its also the BH weekend, loads would have considered staying over. I can see how the LC semi was postponed on the BH Monday, but again another clubs loses out in Bohs, and to be perfectly honest, I don't think Dundalk had targeted LC as must win, thats a tough one on Bohs.

I dont think Dundalk will get past Qarabag but if they do thats another 500k banked, even without, its onto EL r3 and a chance to still earn more than the current 1.2M , the re-fixed Sligo game will attract min 500 less, maybe as much as 1k thats a big loss for them.

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To be fair to the FAI ( ooooh that’s feels wrong) everyone called for support for our clubs competing in Europe for years. They can’t be arsed to do anything complicated like play European qualifiers against each other in July/August so that, added to the increase in the number of matches ( for the likes of Dundalk dropping down) means postponements are almost inevitable. Perhaps a portion of European winnings retained by FAI and used to alleviate losses by clubs suffering ?
Would love to see the clubs force some action on the farcical fixture list but don’t see it happening.

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Originally Posted by RathfarnhamHoop

I'm not trying to get into any sort of ****ing contest. Dundalk didn't exactly have cobbled together midfields against Rovers now did they? As a reminder the midfields for the first two were Shields, Murray, McGrath and Shields, McGrath McEleney. Whereas Rovers had a 16 year old left back and an attacking midfielder at right back and a bench with an average age of 19 years old, that's a completely different level. My whole point was that Rovers and Dundalk are pretty equal this season which I think the two Tallaght games have shown.

What stats show it? The coefficient that also says Porto are 7 places and 11.500 points better than Ajax? What I'm getting at with the 6 in a row thing is that when you're in the champions league its a lot easier to qualify for one of the group stages and to build up the coefficient. Just for the record Qarabag average winning the league by 0.35 points per game, for comparison Dundalk's average is 0.22, That's a big difference. Once in the group stages their records are actually pretty similar. As I've said already you can't judge a team based off watching one game there are far too many variables involved to do that, including Rovers potentially just finding out their opposition quicker than Dundalk theirs. As for the last sentence the same goes for the other way too. Breaking news: Top two teams want to beat each other. None of this takes anything away from Dundalk but it is seriously worrying the way you guys take suck exception to anything short of absolute praise and even praise of other clubs/players.

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I can pack away the hook, line and sinker for now!

Don't care the excuse, teams in European action should be playing matches on a Sunday in between their European games. Absolutely ridiculous carry on.

Agree 100% , the teams in Europe have huge extra resources available which allows them greater depth of squad. No postponements and if the club's ship a few points in the league so be it.
When we treat our league games with disrespect we undervalued the entire league. When man u play in Europe they play at the weekend because the league is respected