Tipp South & District League 2010/11

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Originally Posted by hooper74

without referees we have no football and nothing to talk about so long may this continue,the referees do their best and like the players make mistakes

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Agreed, and hopefully we'll have a few more after the weekend..............

A 2nd ref was manhandled last Sunday in the Paddy Purtill cup with the player in question recieving a red card! Unfortunately it seemes to have happened quiet a bit in the past weekend!

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Originally Posted by Quietman

Fair point Roberto. From what I understand about the current referee situation is this.......... Firstly, it's the league who appoint the referees to games, and not the referees themselves, so if say a referee does a high profile game this weekend and one of the clubs involved complains to the league about the referees performance, then the league and only the league have to power to move that referee to a lower fixture next week. The problem with accountability is that you must have evidence of the mistake/incompetence. And as none of the local games are recorded then that evidence isnt available. So then what you have normally and I think it's fair to say is this, the losing team complaining about the referee and that comes across then as sour grapes. I also think it's fair to say that the referee on the day might honestly think that he had a good game as he has no other officials there to give their opinions/feedback on the game. And even if the assessor sees a referee having a poor game the assessment will try I'm sure to help the referee progress with advice to take into his next gaame and not to deprive him of games.

I'm actually quite friendly with one of the local referees, hence how I knew about the fees etc...... I believe that the referees met with Clonmel Celtic last year when they had queries regarding referees and that they, the referees would like to have better communication with all clubs and are in fact willing and open to meeting with the clubs. They even approached the league and offered to meet the clubs as a whole pre season!! As for their relationship with the league? It's poor at best. The referees have the same poor relationship with the league as the clubs in that you just can't talk to the man in charge as he doesn't listen. But be under no illusion here, it is the league who appoint the rerferees to all your games and not the referees themselves. In an ideal world the referee assessor would and should make those appointments as he is trained to identify problems and mistakes.d

Actually on the matter of other officials, I note that the Waterford league use 3 officials on all there premier games, why doesn't this happen in Tipp? Is it purely down to money?

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You say the Referees approached the league pre-season to meet the clubs? What was the League's response as it seemed an interesting initiative.

It's interesting you mention that referee meeting with Clonmel Celtic last season as I heard about this as well. In fact I spoke with one of the Celtic reps at that meeting. I would agree with the concept of referees building better relationships with clubs and more open communications. However on the subject of communications, seemingly it was mentioned at that particular meeting that if a club has issues with a referees's performance they should approach him in a civil manner after the game and ask for clarification. The Celtic rep told me that bearing this in mind he approached a referee after the Celtic v Town Munster Junior Cup clash last year to enquire why David Joyce's goal had been ruled out in the last minute to be told 'f**k off, we don't have to explain our decisions to you' I should emphasise that the Celtic rep was not confrontational and very civil in his apporach to the officials.

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Originally Posted by Roberto

You say the Referees approached the league pre-season to meet the clubs? What was the League's response as it seemed an interesting initiative.

It's interesting you mention that referee meeting with Clonmel Celtic last season as I heard about this as well. In fact I spoke with one of the Celtic reps at that meeting. I would agree with the concept of referees building better relationships with clubs and more open communications. However on the subject of communications, seemingly it was mentioned at that particular meeting that if a club has issues with a referees's performance they should approach him in a civil manner after the game and ask for clarification. The Celtic rep told me that bearing this in mind he approached a referee after the Celtic v Town Munster Junior Cup clash last year to enquire why David Joyce's goal had been ruled out in the last minute to be told 'f**k off, we don't have to explain our decisions to you' I should emphasise that the Celtic rep was not confrontational and very civil in his apporach to the officials.

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They are still awaiting a response I believe.................... Clubs were probably never informed!!

Look, all of this won't change overnight............the point is, the referee committee are willing to help improve the local game with the help of the clubs and with the help of their own referees. Meeting with clubs and discussing things is the only way this will happen. Education and discussion!!...............
In theory the referees should be approachable, but it depends on how they are approached. If I walk up to you shouting, chances are you'll shout back. Human nature! I know the referee I know will ask the person seeking clarification to come back after 20 mins.........this allows both the referee and club person to "cool off" and avoids this kind of confrontation.

I also heard today that the other referee that was assaulted was Billy O'Donoghue, probably the oldest referee in Ireland and a fantastic servant to junior football. Whoever the player was, shame on you!!

all this referee talk and the league! have yee heard about the cup or sheild games that were meant to go into extra time then penos, but some refs went straight into penos from full time..those teams that went trough have now earned themselves a replay and now to pay another ref,who made a balls of it!TSDL have a lot to answer to...disgrace really..

Ya Rushy that happened last season as well ..... When are simple things like that gonna be straightened out? We all have opinions on Referees and people continue to argue over the standard of Refereeing but to be fair shouldnt we at least expect a ref to know if a game goes to extra time or straight to penalties ???

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Originally Posted by hooper74

without referees we have no football and nothing to talk about so long may this continue,the referees do their best and like the players make mistakes

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I agree with this, and while I get as frustrated as anyone with "what I think" are poor decisions, you still need referees, or you won't have a league.

Note the quote there "what I think"... because that is the most important thing to consider.. In every contested decision that a referee makes, one side will think he was as right, as the other side will think he was wrong.. because refereeing is subjective in the end.

We all see the "right decisions" that our team are given, and we all become Arsene Wenger's and never see what our teams do wrong ...

Referees can make mistakes.. but even if they go through a whole game, and only make one small error, that small error will be used as an excuse as why the team lost

a few of them have attitude problems and i honestly think that they believe that the game is about them and not about the two teams, the best referees that have refereed games are ones who remain anonymous, there are a quite a few approachable referees like michael coady, john teehan and hadnett but by god there are a few who think they are the bees knees!

i do think that referees and clubs should meet to discuss issues and problems within the league. maybe more communication is better

Teehan and coady are probably my favourites alright, they seem to be 2 who will chat to the players and not treat adults like kids. Many of the other refs treat players like babies and this is there chance now to have a bit of power, the whistle is there god.

I agree that there are some good referees in the league and each week when the fixtures come out you are hoping you get one of them. I had a referee last year who I approached at half time about a decision he made. In an orderly and non confrontational manner may I add. He simply said to me his eyesight isn`t as good as it used to be and he just couldn`t see that far down the pitch. Fair play to him for being honest but this surely puts players safety at risk as if players are getting away with late tackles they are just going to continue to make them. I`m sure some of ye could hazard a guess as to who that was!!

Hadnett and Mckell are the best referees in the league and without any fear of contradiction Lyons is the worst by a long long way

Saints v Celtic on Sunday next at 4.30. What is this about. 4.30????

and the least approachable are ?

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Originally Posted by hooper74

Hadnett and Mckell are the best referees in the league and without any fear of contradiction Lyons is the worst by a long long way

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Agreed! Saw McKell several times this year in Waterford. Got through the games without any hassle and ws completely respected by the teams. Pity he doesn't do many local games.......

while we all have good and bad days,mckells performance at peake/celtic in march wasnt a high point.Ask any of the two teams on the day.Attitude towards players on a one to one basis was poor or worse.Hasnt done too many games since .....

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Originally Posted by tipp man

Saints v Celtic on Sunday next at 4.30. What is this about. 4.30????

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Lewis will just have the spud and desert eaten so he can watch it....

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Originally Posted by tipp man

Saints v Celtic on Sunday next at 4.30. What is this about. 4.30????

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You can be absolutely certain that whatever the reason is it is for Saints, Lewis would laugh at Celtic if they requested a kick off time to change

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Originally Posted by zeke

while we all have good and bad days,mckells performance at peake/celtic in march wasnt a high point.Ask any of the two teams on the day.Attitude towards players on a one to one basis was poor or worse.Hasnt done too many games since .....

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:rolleyes:I'd have to agree it wasn't a high point for Celtic, discipline was poor on the day to say the least and anyone with a knowledge of the laws of the game couldn't argue with the three red cards..........true he hasn't done many and the league is worse off for it in my opinion!

And I'm sure Lyons will be superb this weekend and you'll have nothing to complain about!:p

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Originally Posted by Redman028

A 2nd ref was manhandled last Sunday in the Paddy Purtill cup with the player in question recieving a red card! Unfortunately it seemes to have happened quiet a bit in the past weekend!

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This is disgraceful - two referees manhandled last Sunday. There is absolutely no excuse for this and if the TSDL is to survive they must take stern action now to stamp it out. Surely the relevant clubs don't condone this and take their own action.

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Originally Posted by nononsense

This is disgraceful - two referees manhandled last Sunday. There is absolutely no excuse for this and if the TSDL is to survive they must take stern action now to stamp it out. Surely the relevant clubs don't condone this and take their own action.

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From what I hear, it is going to be dealt with, and dealt with hard. Heard possibilities of up to ten year bans for players/coaches/supporters, who cross the line