O'Neill gives his backing for a United Ireland team

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Originally Posted by Blanchflower

So you would not object to the UK Parliament passing a law to say that everyone from the ROI is a UK citizen? .

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they tried it , we objected...

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Originally Posted by EalingGreen

Where have I ever denied that there are two national identities in "the north" [sic]?

As for the political claptrap which you seek to insert into the argument, I find it all contemptible.

My view of what the situation should be (as opposed to what FIFA may say it should be) is simple.

There are two Football Associations in Ireland and therefore two international Irish football teams, each equally valid.

Therefore, I simply believe if you are an Irishman born in NI, you should play for the IFA team and if you are an Irishman born in the ROI, you should play for the FAI team.

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I applaud you for clarifying on how you would like FIFA to write their rules. Unfortunately not everyone feels the same as you do on this island and wouldn't agree with your oversimplification of the issue at hand as stated above.

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Originally Posted by EalingGreen

On which point, I don't see how representing NI makes one either "more British" or "less Irish", since those are political, not sporting concepts. Rather, it just means you're a Northern Irish footballer.

Beyond that, all I would add is that no-one should be made to feel their off-the-field identity is in any way affected or diminished by the fact they are representing NI on the field, nor should they face any selection criteria other than purely footballing ones.

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Yes and the moon is made of cheese and the streets are paved with gold. C'mon EG the world doesn't work like this surely International football is, by the definition of it's title, dependant on the nationalistic leanings of players instead of their other concerns (money, success, fame etc) which have ruined the club game imo (I would argue that nationalistic leanings are at the very core of the game).

If you hold a ROI passport, feel Irish and you've always wanted to represent the ROI football team then it would be a travesty in anyone's minds (bar yours and a few of your OWC mates) to prevent you from playing for your country.

Just follow club football form now on until FIFA iron out all those nationalistic tendencies that ruin International football.

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Originally Posted by RogerMilla

they tried it , we objected...

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So you would object. Therefore you are a hypocrite.

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Originally Posted by EalingGreen

This will have come directly from Wells, who we know met FIFA officials in Sydney to discuss this issue. Is he likely to have got it so obviously wrong a second time?

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Having seen the man in action I wouldn't put it past him.:D

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Originally Posted by Guidedbyvoices

[quote=paul_oshea;955508]



You are like a school teacher correcting a pupils work. Can you not contribute to the thread in a constructive manner instead of sliding in with your punitive Jibes.I see you have over 6000 posts in a few years which is sad on its own right but judging by most of what you have contributed recently surely most of them are utter sH!te. Anyway you are not in the same league of intelligence as Geysir, Ealing etc etc so don't even attempt to pick any holes in their posts

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ok, i promise then, but surely that should be sad "in" ;)

Seriouslly though, i "tried" to contribute but the hamster is spinning to fast, and the wheel just keeps coming back to the same point, so I gave up. If you don't go off topic and contribute, I promise I will then contribute too!

So when are the IFA going to write to the FAI to inform them of no change in the situation?

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Originally Posted by Blanchflower

So you would not object to the UK Parliament passing a law to say that everyone from the ROI is a UK citizen? And then the FA using said law to pick ROI players to play for England.

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To my knowledge any ROI citizen can play for England anyway if any of their grandparents was born pre 1948 in the ROI (this would cover nearly everyone).

The difference here is that most of our population would rather throw themselves off the top of the Cliffs of Moher than represent England in International football. For any that do though good luck to them.

The situation up the North is therefore not comparable.

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Originally Posted by Blanchflower

So you would object. Therefore you are a hypocrite.

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you were speaking of a hypothesis, i was speaking about history.

I voted to repeal articles 2 and 3 , but i firmly believe that northern nationalists should play for us , call me a hypocrite the day your hypothetical event occurs and when i object to it, until then keep your pronouncements about what I am to yourself. i believe there is an internet adage "attack the post , not the poster" you would do well to keep to it .

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Originally Posted by youngirish

To my knowledge any ROI citizen can play for England anyway if any of their grandparents was born pre 1948 in the ROI (this would cover nearly everyone).

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No it wouldn't - most young players' grandparents would have been born after 1948. Any such eligibility will eventually die out.

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Originally Posted by RogerMilla

you were speaking of a hypothesis, i was speaking about history.

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Your answer implied that you would object if it happened now.

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Originally Posted by RogerMilla

I voted to repeal articles 2 and 3 , but i firmly believe that northern nationalists should play for us

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Why did you vote to repeal articles 2 and 3 if, deep down, you retain an irredentist and imperialist outlook towards NI?

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Originally Posted by Blanchflower

Your answer implied that you would object if it happened now.

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no , it didn't

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Originally Posted by Blanchflower

Why did you vote to repeal articles 2 and 3 if, deep down, you retain an irredentist and imperialist outlook towards NI?

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Because it was a step to making Ireland a better place , regardless of what you or anyone else feel my outlook to be.

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Originally Posted by RogerMilla

no , it didn't

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Well, that's how I read it and I haven't read anything else to indicate otherwise.

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Originally Posted by RogerMilla

Because it was a step to making Ireland a better place , regardless of what you or anyone else feel my outlook to be.

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You don't genuinely believe in the principle behind it, then, it was just an expedient move?

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Originally Posted by youngirish

To my knowledge any ROI citizen can play for England anyway if any of their grandparents was born pre 1948 in the ROI (this would cover nearly everyone).

The difference here is that most of our population would rather throw themselves off the top of the Cliffs of Moher than represent England in International football. For any that do though good luck to them.

The situation up the North is therefore not comparable.

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I think its actually 47. I also think it has to be a parent and not a grandparent. Your parent if s/he was born before 1947 can apply for a British passport and therefore you can also apply for one.

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Originally Posted by Blanchflower

You don't genuinely believe in the principle behind it, then, it was just an expedient move?

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I believed in the principles behind articles 2 and 3 but to my mind they are now irrelevant. we can move to PM if you want to learn more about my views. ( i doubt you do. )

I voted for the good friday agreement and that enshrined the rights of people born in the north to be Irish citizens , or was i mistaken ?

so the bottom line is for me that anyone up there can apply for and get an irish passport. therefore they can play for the ROI team. am i mistaken again?

now young fellas declaring for one and then changing to another is another can of worms and i have sympathy for both associations when they lose a player that way.

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Originally Posted by Blanchflower

No it wouldn't - most young players' grandparents would have been born after 1948.

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My two grandparents who are still alive were born in 1917 and 1922 and I'm only 28. It'll be a while yet before that's the case (the Northside excepted perhaps ;)).

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so the bottom line is for me that anyone up there can apply for and get an irish passport. therefore they can play for the ROI team. am i mistaken again?

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That, in my opinion ( is that alright with you GBV? :) ), is another debate altogether. So many diferent sums come into the equation, funding, structure etc. It could be an eventual step that would lead to the FAI coaching in NI (nationalist probably) areas, which I'm sure is one of the things NI supporters fear, justifiably so. That in turn would mean complete interference in NI footballing territory, but it could negate the poaching problem, however it would open up a whole load more problems.

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Originally Posted by RogerMilla

I believed in the principles behind articles 2 and 3

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Yet you support irredentist citizenship laws?

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Originally Posted by RogerMilla

I voted for the good friday agreement and that enshrined the rights of people born in the north to be Irish citizens , or was i mistaken ?

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They already had that right.

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Originally Posted by RogerMilla

so the bottom line is for me that anyone up there can apply for and get an irish passport. therefore they can play for the ROI team. am i mistaken again?

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Thanks for stating the obvious yet agin:( The point we're now discussing is what should be the case not what is the case

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Originally Posted by Blanchflower

Thanks for stating the obvious yet agin:( The point we're now discussing is what should be the case not what is the case

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and i repeat , i believe what is the case is what should be the case and no matter how you "discuss" will you change my mind or indeed that of most of the posters here, good on you for trying but not a snowballs in hell.

you have said yourself that the latest UEFA diktat changes nothing..

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Originally Posted by Blanchflower

They already had that right.

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thats why i used the word enshrined rather than created