NI boss targets Republic's Gibson

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31/08/2007, 1:10 PM
Wolfie

Quote:

Originally Posted by geysir

Ealing G in your answer you neglected to read and comprehend the conditional "Putting interpretations of FIFA rules aside."

I would say the likely interpretation is that the "Ireland or Nobody" is a reaction to the IFA and team Manager public bleating about Darron and his choice.
It has affected him and his family.

Yeah - there's an obvious fear amongst the North's support that Gibson could be the thin end of the wedge re dual eligibility.

I think the "Ireland or nobody" comment was probably made in exasperation and in an attempt to categorically reaffirm his desire to take up his birth right and play for Ireland.
31/08/2007, 1:13 PM
gspain

Quote:

Originally Posted by EalingGreen

Sorry, Gspain, but you, too, are falling for the spin and bluster put about by Ahern in his effort to make political capital from this.

Quite simply, whilst Ahern was putting out Press Releases and giving interviews etc, it was the IFA who actually persuaded them to amend the offending Directive.

Dermot Ahern never even got as far as Switzerland, never mind got to meet anyone important! :rolleyes:

Sorry but I totally refuse to believe that one of our politicians took credit for something he didn't do. :D
31/08/2007, 1:16 PM
EalingGreen

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paddy Garcia

That's a bit rich tbh EO - I think I have expressed my disapppointment at the celebratory stance you and your buddies adopt when Ireland lose, go through a hard time (plenty for you to celebrate I grant), drop in the rankings etc etc. Would you therefore concede that your antipathy is politically motiovated.

And to be fair I've not heard anything negative about NI from Gibson, only positive feelings for Ireland. You are looking for a political slant to justify the suite of unhealthy views you have built.

I'd always rooted for the North in the past, but the level of antipathy (& worse) from you guys makes it very hard to warm to supporters of your team.

I can only speak for myself, not my "buddies". But any "antipathy" I feel towards the ROI is based on two things, neither of them political.

The first is all part of the normal rivalry and banter which goes on between football fans i.e. after years of having to endure jokes and digs when we were s hite and you were flying high, it's nice now that the pendulum has swung the other way and we can return the favour. I intend to make the most of it, before it swings back again (as it no doubt will). As such, if you think I give your lot a hard time, you should hear the fun I've been having with my England pals (and fellow Brits!) over that night, nearly two years ago!

The second is a degree of resentment at the FAI having unilaterally decided to break the decades old "Gentlemens' Agreement" and start selecting NI-born players. Worse still, I mistrust them when they say that they never approach players, only respond when approached, since at least two players (Baird & McKenna) have given the lie to that.

Anyhow, that resentment is not politically-motivated, since I would say the exact same if we were similarly treated by any other Association anywhere else in the world. If you want a clearer exposition for my motivation in this respect, see Post #350 on this thread.
31/08/2007, 1:17 PM
Paddy Garcia

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wolfie

Ireland or nobody" comment was probably made in exasperation and in an attempt to categorically reaffirm his desire to take up his birth right and play for Ireland.

Agree - can you imagine "my first choice is Ireland, however despite the assurances from FIFA, and my own certainty regarding eligibility, I'd quite like to keep the door open to play for the North in the event of successful lobbying by zealous unionists".
31/08/2007, 1:29 PM
Paddy Garcia

Quote:

Originally Posted by EalingGreen

I can only speak for myself, not my "buddies". But any "antipathy" I feel towards the ROI is based on two things, neither of them political.

The first is all part of the normal rivalry and banter which goes on between football fans i.e. after years of having to endure jokes and digs when we were s hite and you were flying high, it's nice now that the pendulum has swung the other way and we can return the favour. I intend to make the most of it, before it swings back again (as it no doubt will). As such, if you think I give your lot a hard time, you should hear the fun I've been having with my England pals (and fellow Brits!) over that night, nearly two years ago!

The second is a degree of resentment at the FAI having unilaterally decided to break the decades old "Gentlemens' Agreement" and start selecting NI-born players. Worse still, I mistrust them when they say that they never approach players, only respond when approached, since at least two players (Baird & McKenna) have given the lie to that.

Anyhow, that resentment is not politically-motivated, since I would say the exact same if we were similarly treated by any other Association anywhere else in the world. If you want a clearer exposition for my motivation in this respect, see Post #350 on this thread.

Well on point 2 the political world has changed and now NI born players, can rightly, play for their country: Ireland. So objectively that "Gentlemens' Agreement" is well & truly defunct, not least cos it is decades old - & reflected an era when nationalists were the underdogs!

Though I'd be inclined to be more open and encourage them to approach likely recruits, & be open about it.
31/08/2007, 1:29 PM
EalingGreen

Quote:

Originally Posted by geysir

Ealing G in your answer you neglected to read and comprehend the conditional "Putting interpretations of FIFA rules aside."

I would say the likely interpretation is that the "Ireland or Nobody" is a reaction to the IFA and team Manager public bleating about Darron and his choice.
It has affected him and his family.

Except that he originally stated his "ROI or nothing" stance before the recent pronouncements by Wells and Worthy.

And as for it "affecting his family", I can see how it might be irritating for them. However, can you not see where Wells and Worthy are coming from?

As Wolfie has alluded to, Wells's and the IFA's concern is that if this is not challenged, then it could lead to NI losing significant numbers of other players from what is already a small enough pool. Any Association is going to do exactly the same, should it consider that Regulations may be being broken. And Wells has said several times that it is nothing personal against DG.

As for Worthington, rather than conducting a "witchhunt" against DG, as some posters on here would have it, he is merely saying to DG that should he prove ineligible for the ROI (as the IFA thinks he may be), we will not exclude him from an international career entirely (subject to the player's agreement, of course).

As such, Worthy is only doing what most new managers do when they take over (Stan, for example) in seeking to select from the widest possible choice of players. If he or the IFA were the politically or sectarian-motivated bigots that some here would have us believe, surely their response to DG would be: "Don't think we'll have you back if you lose your case with FIFA"? :eek:
31/08/2007, 1:32 PM
fhtb

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paddy Garcia

Agree - can you imagine "my first choice is Ireland, however despite the assurances from FIFA, and my own certainty regarding eligibility, I'd quite like to keep the door open to play for the North in the event of successful lobbying by those not wishing to see the Football For All message in NI undermined".

Wipe the political mud from your eyesight.
31/08/2007, 1:37 PM
Not Brazil

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wolfie

Yeah - there's an obvious fear amongst the North's support that Gibson could be the thin end of the wedge re dual eligibility.

No "fear" whatsoever.

All that matters is that Northern Ireland only field players who are totally committed to doing their very best for Northern Ireland.

If there are those in our ranks who don't give 100% for the shirt, get rid of them I say.

Those players eligible to play for Northern Ireland who don't wish to, for whatever reason, are no loss at all.

Give me a limited player with a burning desire to succeed with Northern Ireland over a gifted player whose heart isn't in it every time.

Fighting over players who don't want to play for you is, frankly, rather stupid in my opinion.

Concentrate on those players who are totally committed, and develop accordingly, is how I want to see things going forward.

Onwards and Upwards, as the saying goes.
31/08/2007, 1:38 PM
Paddy Garcia

Quote:

Originally Posted by EalingGreen

As such, Worthy is only doing what most new managers do when they take over (Stan, for example) in seeking to select from the widest possible choice of players. If he or the IFA were the politically or sectarian-motivated bigots that some here would have us believe, surely their response to DG would be: "Don't think we'll have you back if you lose your case with FIFA"? :eek:

I can of course see where they are coming from - but there are some things bigger and more important than even football. He, Wells & Co should not be seeking to undo the right to self determination agreed for the people for the North.

I accept Worthys motivation is purely football (though I think ill advised), but it does stir up a lot of bad feelings, hatred (& potentially worse) which he would have been all to well aware of.
31/08/2007, 1:39 PM
EalingGreen

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paddy Garcia

Agree - can you imagine "my first choice is Ireland, however despite the assurances from FIFA, and my own certainty regarding eligibility, I'd quite like to keep the door open to play for the North in the event of successful lobbying by zealous unionists".

Nonsense. All it takes is an anoydyne statement from DG along the lines of "ROI is my preferred choice and since I am informed by the FAI that I am eligible, that's all I'm concentrating on".

After all, it looks as if Tony Kane managed not to "burn his boats" in similar circumstances.
31/08/2007, 1:41 PM
Paddy Garcia

Quote:

Originally Posted by fhtb

Wipe the political mud from your eyesight.

So you would agree with the statement to which this was a retort - that Gibson was politically motivated by stating "Ireland or no one"

Wipe it from yours
31/08/2007, 1:44 PM
RogerMilla

Quote:

Originally Posted by Not Brazil

Give me a limited player with a burning desire to succeed with Northern Ireland over a gifted player whose heart isn't in it every time..

no chance , those are the fellas we're after!! :p;)
31/08/2007, 1:44 PM
fhtb

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paddy Garcia

He, Wells & Co should not be seeking to undo the right to self determination agreed for the people for the North

That's a new one. So I guess we've no need to pay taxes to Her Majesty's Government anymore? Why didn't anyone tell us this sooner
31/08/2007, 1:44 PM
Paddy Garcia

Quote:

Originally Posted by EalingGreen

Nonsense. All it takes is an anoydyne statement from DG along the lines of "ROI is my preferred choice and since I am informed by the FAI that I am eligible, that's all I'm concentrating on".

After all, it looks as if Tony Kane managed not to "burn his boats" in similar circumstances.

But I want all our players to want to play for us & no one else & to say it - it's exactly the spirit we need, & I don't think he has anything to apologise for.

I don't want us to be his "preferred choice" - I want to be his only choice. Which is what he said.
31/08/2007, 1:49 PM
RogerMilla

Quote:

Originally Posted by fhtb

That's a new one. So I guess we've no need to pay taxes to Her Majesty's Government anymore? Why didn't anyone tell us this sooner

eh , i think some people have been trying to !
31/08/2007, 1:51 PM
eelmonster

Quote:

Originally Posted by EalingGreen

The first is all part of the normal rivalry and banter which goes on between football fans i.e. after years of having to endure jokes and digs when we were s hite and you were flying high, it's nice now that the pendulum has swung the other way and we can return the favour.

:D You haven't qualified yet - and it's not that long ago since you went 2 years without scoring a goal! However, DH has changed all that, he's without doubt the Premiership signing of the summer.
31/08/2007, 1:53 PM
fhtb

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paddy Garcia

So you would agree with the statement to which this was a retort - that Gibson was politically motivated by stating "Ireland or no one"

Wipe it from yours

He may be politically motivated, he may not. Either way it doesn't mean objectors are 'zealous unionists'. Wise the bap like
31/08/2007, 1:56 PM
osarusan

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paddy Garcia

But I want all our players to want to play for us & no one else & to say it.
I don't want us to be his "preferred choice" - I want to be his only choice. Which is what he said.

How likely is that to happen given where he grew up and who he represented at underage level?
31/08/2007, 1:56 PM
fhtb

Quote:

Originally Posted by RogerMilla

eh , i think some people have been trying to !

Didn't let me in on it. I'm going to put my new-found right to self determination to good use, and set up my own Republic, zero tax rate. You can join if you want, but only if you declare an 'aspiration' to play for my football team

don't worry about passports, I can issue those to whoever I want, we can call it your birthright or something :rolleyes:
31/08/2007, 1:59 PM
RogerMilla

Quote:

Originally Posted by fhtb

Didn't let me in on it. I'm going to put my new-found right to self determination to good use, and set up my own Republic, zero tax rate. You can join if you want, but only if you declare an 'aspiration' to play for my football team

don't worry about passports, I can issue those to whoever I want, we can call it your birthright or something :rolleyes:

bet you'd give san marino a game!

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