You post on a football board that it was McGuinness' idea. But the truth is you only assume it was his idea. Have you forgotten that they have a solicitor ?Quote:
Originally Posted by SkStu
Dont be posting things you cant prove to be true.
Whats with the "You again"?
Whoever came up with the idea doesn't really matter, the fact that the PFAI/McGuinness pulled the strings to allow it be hosted in Abbotstown shows that he was more than happy to agree with it.Quote:
Originally Posted by The Lep
The whole idea of a union having their offices with the FAI is a whole other thing which needs looked at.
A deal agreed by then Union chief Fran Gavin, who's now...
Quote:
Originally Posted by MariborKev
I've been saying that since we first got the tour at the first fans forum out there in Abbottstown.
Gilhooley is the PFAI solicitor. McGuinness is the Union rep. Unions like to go legal. Between the two of them they figured this out. My main point was it was not the players. Its really not that difficult.Quote:
Originally Posted by The Lep
The "you again" reference is also pretty straightforward.
I imagine that the most likely scenario is that the tactic of the court action was suggested by the PFAI (Gilhooley / McGuinness) but was obviously agreed to by the players involved. In that sense it is really irrelevant who actually suggested it.
While it would certainly be preferable not to take an action with such potentially drastic consequences, the reality of it is that the action required to ensure an avoidence of a winding up order is in the hands of the Bohs board.
I certainly would not like to see Bohs wound up, but I have a grudging admiration for the tatic employed by the players/PFAI, which I believe significantly increases their prospects of getting paid sooner rather then later.
What a club. Meanwhile over on GypoWeb they're not bothered by this fact but just giving out about Pete Mahon whinging. Incredible
Also according to that same messageboard, Bohs are training in Carton House, with established pros like Heary, Oman, O'Connor, Barry Murphy and Madden being led by Pat Fenlon and Liam O'Brien.Quote:
Dispute to rumble on into next week
Irish Times
The dispute between Bohemians and their remaining senior players will rumble on into next week after a day of talks yesterday, overseen by FAI chief executive John Delaney and League director Fran Gavin, failed to produce a settlement between the two sides.
Despite a lack of face-to-face meetings between the two sides, club officials described the process as having been “positive” and suggested progress had been made.
They said they were available to re-enter talks whenever required, but in a brief statement issued last night, the PFAI said they did not expect any further announcements to be made before Monday.
The dispute, over the terms in which nine players can agree to forfeit the remainder of their contracts with the club, has been going since the end of last season and a number of the players affected have been angered by the terms that have been on the table – equivalent to 13 weeks’ net pay – as well as the club’s inability to pay what they were offering until the past week or so.
Two players, Steven Gray and Brian Shelley, have initiated legal action aimed at having the club wound up in an attempt to secure some of their back pay, but the club have insisted any such payment must count towards the final severance settlement.
The ongoing problems have prevented Pat Fenlon from assembling a squad for the coming season and the Bohemians boss has been working for the past few weeks with a squad comprised mainly of last year’s under-21 squad along with a handful of senior players, who, it seems, will most likely not be around come the start of the season.
At Richmond Park, however, Pete Mahon says he has been angered by reports Bohemians have been approaching players about joining for the coming campaign before the current situation is resolved.
“I’m going by what I’m reading in the papers here,” he said. “But if it’s true it seems wrong to me that they can be looking to sign players before they have sorted out the lads who are already at the club.
“Having said that I hope that Pat does manage to put a good squad together in the end because the league needs a strong Bohemians.”
Mahon confirmed the signing of midfielder Paul Crowley yesterday along with the re-signing of Dave Mulcahy.
The deals bring to 17 the number of senior players at the club for the new season, with Daryl Kavanagh, Brian Shorthall and the McMillan brothers, David and Evan, the other new recruits.
The Dubliners are now looking at signing two players from England, although two of the three possible targets are currently on trials with other clubs.
“We feel that we’ve done fairly well in the close season and these lads would probably be the end of it if we got them. If we did, we’d have a strong squad and while Shamrock Rovers and Sligo Rovers (who have been linked with a move for Bohemians winger Killian Brennan) are most people’s favourites for the league, we’d certainly like to feel we can improve on the fifth we managed last year.”
I guess their logic is that if they just get in to the Europa League group stages this year all their problems are over. How could anyone, even Bohs fans, possibly think badly of Shelley and Grey after this.
http://www.rte.ie/sport/soccer/2011/0122/bohemians.html
Are we talking about prize money for last place (which has happened before) or something more than that?Quote:
FAI could lend Bohemians money
The FAI could lend Bohemians money to pay their players and help the Dalymount Park club secure a future in the League of Ireland.
.....
The Irish Independent claims the FAI could now pay the players the money they are owed and the footballing body would then deduct any future prize money Bohemians win to claim back the cash.
its on their forum that they are training at Carton House, nice.
Everyone deserves a bit of luxury now and again.
If is just a general loan then the whole thing has stooped even lower imo, no way should the FAI bail out bohs.It would be a huge two fingers from the FAI to every club who did their business right last season and open a can of worms.
Fixed that for you. You have no proof to say 100% that it was the idea of Mcguinness. You now say that your point was that it wasnt the idea of the players yet you have been out about them in taking the action they did. Make your mind up stu.Quote:
Originally Posted by SkStu
I know enough about unions from my own work to understand how they work.
.
If it was good enough for real madrid it must be good for Bohs. :)Quote:
Originally Posted by srfc1928
I have to say when I heard Bohs were in huge financial difficulties I had a wee chuckle to myself. I remember all them years ago when the deal was mentioned about Dalymount been purchased and Bohs matching Man City in the bank satements! They played us in Flancare that weekend and all their supporters were in the stand waving euro notes and singing Abba's 'money, money, money'. Instead of claiming they had lots of it I think now they were actually looking for some money!
Played the Bohs fans team today in the UCL, I reckon it was good prep for their step up to the A League :)
re Carton House, we are not paying for it. Jicked why dont you get your insider (whats his name - ah yes, the Whistleblower) to log in to the members forum and get the full facts for himself and share them here instead of half the story?
I work with 5 different Unions on a daily basis myself. I also have a pretty good insight into what they are like and what motivates them. I'll ask you again, who's idea do you think it was? Not that it really matters i suppose.Quote:
Originally Posted by The Lep
You might think my statement was petty but i find you following me around this forum like a homeless mutt pretty annoying so forgive me if i call you out on it.
How can Bohs get a place like Carton for free!? :eek:Quote:
Originally Posted by SkStu
again - the player he is talking about is Stuey Byrne and looking to sign him on amateur/part-time terms. Not everything is a screw up. We have to have players to put on the pitch next year and if we can get Byrne for cheap then wheres the problem?Quote:
Originally Posted by Jicked
After everything that has gone on at Bohs, when people hear from that they "have to put out eleven players of some description, so why not Heary, Stuey Byrne, Barry Murphy, Ken Oman, Paddy Madden and coached by Pat Fenlon and Liam O'Brien" it gives the impression that the mentality at Bohs hasn't really changed at all. Replace that lot with available underage, A Championship or First Division players and spare everyone another Johnny Logan fundraising gig.Quote:
Originally Posted by SkStu
again, your twisting things and omitting facts to give yourself and others that impression whilst ignoring the other aspects of the story. It suits your agenda so, fair play, i do the same myself with Rovers. Hopefully it is as transparent to most as i think it is.
In what way am I doing this?
Bohs are financially in dire straights, yet seem to be intending to put together a squad of established LoI players that would look like being part of a contending or top-half team (Heary, Oman, Murphy, possibly Byrne et al) and are employing one of the leading managers.
Everyone understands that these players and staff will be on reduced terms from last year (although was Fenlon's deal ever re-negotiated?) but paying anything for such players instead of whatever can be cobbled together for almost nothing gives the impression that Bohs aren't in an incredibly prevarious financial position.
I don't think that's twisting facts or trying to spin a story in a particular way.
I thought Stewie Byrne had retired ,its his own perogative if he is going to bohs as player coach. I dont understand where is Pete Mahon is coming from as he is no longer a pats player!
Just to be clear, Pete never mentioned Stuey Byrne, Bohs fans just THINK thats who he is talking aboutQuote:
Originally Posted by Martinho II
because - you should wait and see what these players are costing us and what the new wage structure the club has implemented is like. It is, with a couple of exceptions, part-time/amateur wages. As Rovers should know it is actually a clubs market at the moment. In other words, the wages that players have been paid across the league have reduced dramatically. The economic implosion has lead to a scenario where these wages have dropped even more. It is possible to sign players like Stu Byrne, Owen Heary and some of the others you listed on what are otherwise considered first div wages. They are no longer premier players and they realise that too.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jicked
Where you do possibly have a point is re Fenlon and i have been calling for him to be let go purely from a financial view point. However, he is under contract. It is a large contract. If we break it it is another settlement that has to be made. If we do retain PD status then who better than Fenlon to keep us up with our ragtag assortment of young fellas, a couple of decent players and experienced has beens. He also has sell-on/compensation value and cross-channel clubs have him on their radar. So there is a justification that can be made there too.
Another aspect is that the funds we have raised that are presently tied up are expected to finance the cost of resigning some of the 7 players who we are negotiating a settlement with (as well as the settlement itself) so they are, in essence, paid for and that is based on them re-signing on "drastically reduced terms" - the players words.
All im saying is it is not as black and white as you are painting it to be. Lets see what comes out of the wash over the next few week, thats all.
out of interest, have you heard anything different yourself PS?Quote:
Originally Posted by PartySaint
Pete was talking about Stuey Byrne at the Patron Saints meeting on Wednesday night, he said that Stuey told him he was retiring and he was surprised to see him go over to the thing in Norway, that was it. I reckon he is talking about more than one player tbhQuote:
Originally Posted by SkStu
I have no problem with what Fenlon is doing tho, yous will need players lined up for when all the messy stuff is over
& Stuey was interviewed by The Star AFTER Norway, he said that he is retiring , as at 34 he needs to concentrate on his (non-football) work & that playing part-time hinders that. It would need to be a good offer to keep him from his business for another season & he hasn't had any such offer (by the time of the interview).Quote:
Originally Posted by PartySaint
Dont flatter yourself stu, its a forum where you can reply to post made by others same like the way you keep replying to me especially on the Fingal thread.Quote:
Originally Posted by SkStu
As who's idea it was , i dont care who it was but it was a dam good idea.
Fingal has a forum? Trust me, ive never been on it.
Read it again :) .
This is the same FAI who would lend Cobh Rambers money not so long ago because of it being an unfair advantage over other teams. What a joke they are.Quote:
Originally Posted by osarusan
So the FAI are bailing out bohs.
You can take a loan of the "FAI's Model Club" tag for a month or so if youse like but we'll be needing it back once the season gets underway.
should we pre-empt things and start up a new thread entitled "deadly Zurich bank try to shut down our lovable rogue neighbours bohs" once 2012 comes around?
bohs are like eastenders!(dont watch fair city as its full o skobies)
will they/wont they...
as for pete mahon- shut your face you whingin ,begrudgin dubballin spanner.
Its not fair its just not fair those chaps are not playing by the rules..
Would they be the players seeking compensation for Bohs not honouring their contracts next year ? Yes. Would the players be attending training to avoid any claim they are not honouring contracts ?Yes (and probobly to maintain fitness in case they get another club). Are any of them currently receiving pay ? No (with possible exception of Madden)Quote:
Originally Posted by Jicked
Your ongoing fixation with Bohs message board is no doubt flattering to those running it (personally I would never read the always-ultra site) but if you want to quote then do so in context.
By the way Jicked people on this site - foot.ie - (including shams supporters) commented on Pete Mahon whinging, is that OK or "incredible" ? opposition manager comments on Bohs results in comments on Bohs message board - WOW, what a shocker
As has been pointed, out Carton House is not costing Bohs anything so, again, whats the problem ?
No remote connection between the above points and Shelley/Grey issue so hardly likely to influence how Bohs fans feel about them anyway - presumably your position on the two would be the exact same if they were trying to wind up shams via court action ?
Stop with the BS - you should know that is not their objective; they simply want to get paidQuote:
Originally Posted by marinobohs
I am perfectly aware of their aims just as we all are of their actions - what does seeking a winding up order mean to you if not seeking to wind up the club ? its pretty striaghtforward really.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ezeikial
facts are (1) Shelley/Grey Objective = to get paid.(2) Shelley/Grey method = seek winding up order against club. No BS no ambiguity.
A winding up order means they're trying to force the club's hand to pay them, having gotten sick of listening to promises of when they'll get paid. It's really not rocket science, mb.
there were other options (Industrial relations,payment of wages Act etc) open to the players concerned other than seeking a winding up order (that IS what they have done whatever the reason(s)). The club has consistently said end January was its target date for agreement with all players (what promises of when they will get paid ?????). The fact is that these two players are emigrating and uped the ante to maximise the payoff they get for next seasons contract - currently seeking 26 weeks gross pay - before their position was weakened by not being available to fulfill the contract they are so eager for Bohs to honour.Quote:
Originally Posted by pineapple stu
I'm aware it IS what they've done. The point is that the reason they've done it isn't to wind the company up; it's merely to get paid what they're owed.
Their objective was acknowledged by me 4/5 posts back so whats your point ? Still waiting for some proof of the "promises of when they will get paid" you referred to.Quote:
Originally Posted by pineapple stu
My point is that this -
- is nonsense.Quote:
Originally Posted by marinobohs
As to promises of when they'll get paid, I'll direct you to the concept of "pay day" for starters.