No - When you tell people they "have no tangibe connection to the ROI" when, from birth, they have been a citizen of the ROI that is precisely what you are doing.Quote:
Originally Posted by Absinthe
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No - When you tell people they "have no tangibe connection to the ROI" when, from birth, they have been a citizen of the ROI that is precisely what you are doing.Quote:
Originally Posted by Absinthe
The FAI need to offer FIFA an out on this. I'd suggest that they say this is different to e.g. Qatar in that we offer a passport to anyone born in a certain area. I'm fairly sure Qatar won't offer a passport to all Brazilians.
So what about someone like Eduardo da Silva? No ties at all to Croatia yet he plays for them. I know he played for Croatia underage teams before these new rules but would a player in his situation be able to play for them now?
What are national sides if not political baggage?Quote:
Originally Posted by Absinthe
If he's lived there long enough then yes.Quote:
Originally Posted by Metrostars
I meant in a footballing sense. I apologise for the ambiguity.Quote:
Originally Posted by liaml
But that is the very thing they are trying to prevent. A country can offer a passport to anyone they like (even a whole country if they wanted to):-Quote:
Originally Posted by cavan_fan
e.g. Emauele Olisadebe was a Nigerian who became a polish International solely because they gave him a passport.
This is the key thing they are trying to stop.
Another example the other way is Switzerland, where you have to be approved for Citizenship by the local council (or equivilant). There are families that have been living in Switzerland for 3 generations, that are still not Swiss nationals. Should they be barred from playing football for Switzerland? Who should they play for?
My point is, the worlds a big place, and lots of people have 'political baggage', I dont see why you think Northern Irish Nationalists should have their own rule different from everyone else.
Im trying not to get into a whole political debate, and appear to be failing miserably.Quote:
Originally Posted by Dodge
Point taken, my Slovakian history wouldnt be the best.Quote:
Originally Posted by Drumcondra 69er
Because it's a fairly unique situation. If we really want to start spliting hairs then why should England, Scotland, Wales and the 6 counties be allowed have their own individual teams? Surely one United Kingdom team should cover all? It's only for historical reasons and the fact that they were 4 of the original associations that it's tolerated hence why the UK doesn't compete in Olympics football.Quote:
Originally Posted by Absinthe
personally i think if the result of this is that people from the 6c can no longer play for us then the government should take up the baton and not just the Fai. after all it is, no matter what anyone tells you, an issue with massive political implications.
seriously i nearly fell off the seat laughing after reading this!!!Quote:
Originally Posted by Absinthe
how long can people in the 6c claim to be brits. i mean how many generations have passed since they were planted in the 1600's!!!!!:p
3 generations since they were born in Ireland indeed.:rolleyes:
You are a serious WUM
But my point was that Poland would not want to make all Nigerians elgible for a Polish passport to get one player.Quote:
Originally Posted by Absinthe
Yes, he moved to Croatia, became a citizen and plays for the Nation team.Quote:
Originally Posted by Metrostars
If he had played underage for Brazil before he went there, he would have had to declare for Croatia before he reached the age of 21.
Any word on Freddy Adu, is it agreed that his friendly cap against Canada ties him down to the USA?
FIFA will not respond to goverment pressure. Recently, the Greek goverment (i think!) put pressure on FIFA over an issue, and FIFA threatened to throw the Greek team out of its tournaments.Quote:
Originally Posted by galwayhoop
FIFA will only act on the recomendations of the CAS.
True, but for example in europe where borders are more fluid, Holland could easily offer passports to all Belgians to get players, safe in the knowledge that they wouldnt get an influx of 'foriegn' nationals.Quote:
But my point was that Poland would not want to make all Nigerians elgible for a Polish passport to get one player.
Its a difficult situation.
What FIFA are trying to do, in general, is admirable (stopping people "choosing" what country to represent).
However, like many people born in Northern Ireland I consider myself Irish (with a capital I) and hold only an Irish passport. I have no interest in supporting the North (nor would I have represented them if I had been good enough).
Clearly this impacts not just Ireland but also other nations with contested borders and "enclaves" with loyalties to other neighbouring countries.
I can't see the FAI winning this one unfortunately.
Is your place of birth on your passport taken directly from your birth certificate?
I don't see how the FAI can lose on this one. FIFA are subserviant to the law like anyone else.
a similar situation might exist in Bosnia, with Bosnian-Croats or Bosnian-Serbs playing for Croatia or Serbia respectively. Anyone know if this is the case?
I have to say, I respect that...it's very honest.Quote:
Originally Posted by OneRedArmy
It's the mealy mouthed "if only they did this, that and the other, I'd support them" brigade that get on my tits.
That makes them plastic ROI fans really.
That is why I'm upset at this latest ruling. Guys like OneRedArmy (if a fantastic pro footballer) would not be allowed to play for the Republic no longer.
I don't want to see the FAI hoovering up talent from the north, but if a kid/young lad wants to play for us and has an Irish passport then he should be allowed to pursue his dream.
I would give you guys a cheer if you dropped gstq and the butchers handkerchief, but i could never support you. Picked my team i'm afraid, and you can't change.Quote:
It's the mealy mouthed "if only they did this, that and the other, I'd support them" brigade that get on my tits.
I am an ROI fan awaiting an all ireland side and all this nonsense being put to bed.
Is it not Butchers Apron.
Good for you.Quote:
Originally Posted by backtowalsall
Whilst you continue to demonise and vilify the National Flag of the majority population in Northern Ireland (presumably the very people you wish to "unite" with) you'll be waiting a very long time for a, so called, "all Ireland" side.
Not being funny - think about it!;)
Would you not be more proud of the Northeren Irish Flag. You do have a good point though but the same could be asked of you that surely if you want to remain united with the UK then surely there should be a football team called UK and not 4 sperate teams. If one is truely Unionist I would have thought that the four football countries is a contradiction of that.Quote:
Originally Posted by Not Brazil
Is that not what some refer to The Union Flag as?Quote:
Originally Posted by NeilMcD
Our friend must mean some other flag - considering the Irish Football Association do not use the Union Flag.
Yeah, next time I go into my local buthers I must look out for his dashing handkerchief.
I am very proud of the flag used by the Irish Football Association - the Northern Ireland flag (Ulster Banner).Quote:
Originally Posted by NeilMcD
I would be equally as proud if they used the St Patrick's Cross flag.
I would even be happy if they simply used a flag comprising of the magnificant Celtic Cross crest that adorns our famous emerald green shirt.
But, to be honest, flags are the least of my worries when I go to watch Northern Ireland play....flags don't play football, and I go to support footballers from my part of the world.
I have absolutely no desire to see an all UK team whatsoever.
I have no doubt that the good people of England, Wales and Scotland feel exactly the same.
Perfectly happy with things just staying the way they are - and whoever pulls on the shirt, and gives it 100%, will have my total support.
:DQuote:
Originally Posted by NeilMcD
Very good.
Until FIFA actually give their ruling next week it’s difficult to move the issue forward.Quote:
Originally Posted by galwayhoop
But the fact that the IFA are using a purely political argument to deny Irish players the right to represent their country internationally is going to make it a long and drawn out affair.
I have been in contact with a number of MLA's from the two main Nationalist parties today and the wheels are already in motion regarding clarification on the issue and ongoing contact with the Department of Foreign Affairs in Dublin etc.. Irish foreign affairs Minister Dermot Ahern will meet the FAI this week to discuss the issue and the full support of Nationalist ministers over the issue has been assured.
Its worth remembering that UEFA reversed a ruling over passports in the North last year after political intervention, so any initial ruling from FIFA is likely to be contested, whatever side it comes down on.
It's sad that it may end up as along drawn out political affair, but the IFA cannot deny Irish kids their right to represent their country.
Not so fast folks....
http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/foot...ls/7060057.stmQuote:
The Irish FA has said that reports that the issue of Northern Ireland-born players playing for the Republic has been ruled on by Fifa are premature.
IFA chief Howard Wells said he was "surprised" by Tuesday's media claims.
Reports said Fifa had told the Republic they that could keep the services of Northern Ireland-born Darron Gibson.
Tuesday's reports added that FAI could now only use players born in the Republic, or whose parents or grandparents are born in the Republic.
Wells added that Fifa has yet to rule on whether the Republic's Football Association of Ireland can quote the Good Friday Agreement as a reason for drafting up players born on the island of Ireland.
It was also claimed on Tuesday that the world governing body would not impose any sanction over Gibson's involvement for the Republic of Ireland in the Euro 2008 qualifiers.
However, Wells told the BBC:"Fifa has told us that they will make a judgement before the end of October and we have not yet heard anything from them".
The 19-year-old Gibson is currently on loan from Manchester United at Wolves.
The Derry teenager played for NI at underage level before switching to the Republic and he earned a full cap in last month's Euro 2008 qualifer in Slovakia.
Gibson earned his first Republic cap in the friendly win over Denmark in August.
The midfielder was a late call-up for that game after Northern Ireland boss Nigel Worthington had revealed that he was trying to persuade the player to switch allegiance from the Republic.
Gibson played for Northern Ireland U16s but then opted for the Republic.
Since then he has played for the Republic U17, U19, U21 sides before winning two full caps with the senior team.
That article had already been referred to earlier by CDG.
But it keeps getting ignored in the green mist
The bit in that article that does not connect is the reference to Darron Gibson. There is nothing more to be said about Darron except in regard to his future in the Ireland shirt.
The FIFA legal head said as much on Sept 9th.
Not Brazil
I was born in the Republic, My mother and two grandparents were born in the wee North. Had I been good enough at football to be picked by either part of the island of Ireland I would have accepted with good grace on a first come first served basis. I am also eligible to play for Chile (1 grandmother born there) and Egypt (1 grandfather born there) and would have been honoured to have been asked to play for them too. As I said earlier I didn't have the talent to be asked to play for the Shetland Islands so there you go. What a waste of eligibility :D
I am up for the North when they are playing anyone bar the Republic and I like to see Irish League clubs do well in Europe against anyone bar Eircom League clubs. I make no apologies for this as I have family living there.
Whilst some may have "spun" that it was changed after political intervention, it was not the case.Quote:
Originally Posted by co. down green
UEFA/FIFA both deeply resent political intervention, and it was the IFA who were instrumental in ensuring that our players holding an Irish Passport were not disadvantaged.
The other lie "spun" about that particular affair was that the IFA would not allow players to hold an Irish Passport.
Good man yourself - seems pretty natural to me.Quote:
Originally Posted by CollegeTillIDie
from mayo , want norn iron to lose every game they play!! i appreciate their stance on this though , it has to be gutting to lose players who have played for them at lower levels, lads from the north who want to play for us must be allowed to do so in my opinion but no chopping and changing , its a pure mockery then. it will be best when it's all finally cleared up. until then are there any good up and comers up there who we could get to defect ?? ;-)
The Northern Ireland underage squads consist of circa 50% of kids from a nationalist background.Quote:
Originally Posted by RogerMilla
In fact, there were five kids from Derry in the victorious Northern Ireland U16 squad which defeated the Republic of Ireland earlier this week.
Rumour has it they were distraught.:D
Whose law are they subserviant to?Quote:
Originally Posted by backtowalsall
They are a worldwide organisation. So which country's justice system to they report to?
If George Bush told them they had to allow Canadians to play for the USA, would they do it?
It is FIFA's tournaments, and their rules. No goverments or courts (except possibly the CAS), have any influence whatsoever.
Link to CAS - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Court_o...tion_for_Sport
Feel free to prove me wrong by finding a link to FIFA being involved in a court case, anywhere.
As I have said before, its their tournaments, you play by their rules, or you dont play. They have 208 member nations, they are not going to miss the Republic of Ireland.
=======================
At the present time the former Yugoslavia will be fine, as everybody who is good enough for international football will have been born within the former Yugoslavia, therefore making them eligible for any of the aforementioned countries.
This is only an issue now in an Irish context, because Gibson's Grandparents where born in Northern Ireland, thereby, in footballing terms, cutting his link to the Republic. i.e. His Dad would almost certainly eligible, under the grandparent rule.
I have had this debate in work, i believe that if you have an Irish passport (and not a british one also) then you should be able to play for ROI. I would rather scoop my eyes out with a wooden spoon than play under a British flag and a foriegn anthem, so you should have the right to choose.
LOL :DQuote:
Originally Posted by Not Brazil
Boys and Girls,
Im pulling my hair out over this.
This is unnacceptable if FIFA makes this ruling.
When will NI Supporters come to terms with the fact that the nationalist population of the North will not want to play/support the NI team. We are not British. GSTQ is not our Anthem. Our flag is the Tricolor and our capital is Dublin.
We are nationalists therefore we do not think Northern Ireland should exist.
Im not a bigot. I respect the Protestant Culture but appose the unnatural division of this island. To support the NI football team would be a contradiction of my beliefs....FACT.
Im hoping beyond hope, that the FAI are ready and willing to fight this. I also hope that the IFA have the decency to respect this. We should not have to fight for this right... its ludicrous.
I heard some Unionist politicians on the news last night complaining that they might have to use a passport to travel to the UK. They think that this is an infringement on their right to claim Britishness. They should put themsleves in our shoes. FIFAs ruling would be a kick in the teeth for me and i cant accept it.
We dont play under the British Flag, we play under the Ulster Banner. And a lot of Northern Ireland supporters have issues with GSTQ.Quote:
Originally Posted by antrimgreen
I would prefer we had our own anthem as well.
But it does, you live there and were born there. As things stand, the majority of people in Northern Ireland want Northern Ireland to exist. While that remains the case, there will always be a Northern Ireland.Quote:
We are nationalists therefore we do not think Northern Ireland should exist.
I have genuine sympathy for people who feel so strongly against Northern Ireland that they wouldnt play for them under any circumstances, but, I personally dont see a strong enough reason for FIFA to change their rules which affect virtually every country in world, to cater for a few thousand people.
Generally half our team has always been 'of a nationalist' background, our most Capped player for example, who for my money was the best player in his position in the world, for many years. I think some on here over-estimate the amount of people this would genuinely effect.
For example, how many of you think that if Gibson hadnt been approached the FAI, that he wouldnt be playing for Northern Ireland (at some level) now?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Absinthe
FIFA are challenged in the courts.
For example Sepp Blatter's proposal to limit the number of foreigners playing for clubs is likely to be challenged in the courts by the EU.
To quote Frederic Vincent, spokesman for the European Union sports commissioner Jan Figel. "This contravenes the EU treaty and internal-market rules on the free movement of workers,"
I would expect FIFA's ruling over player eligibility in the North to potentially face a similar court challenge, when they finally make a decision.