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Originally Posted by
paul_oshea
Well if to you, I am not actually saying anything there's not much point in me trying to explain anything now is there :)
And for a man who very rarely goes to games, but offers 101 excuses that's highly insulting :D
I think I have gone through with the replies to John, it covers an acceptance that at the moment we are bare in that middle age group the 30 caps or so players who have international experience and the lads who are pushing on getting past it, or just haven't delivered v the very young who have a handful of caps between them. We are in a bit of a difficult situation in that regard.
Well to be fair to you, it's not quite spoofery, but you're not giving us tangibles to work with - nothing to pin you down on so-to-speak. after all, if one of us goes out on a limb with a prediction, with an idea or perspective on why a selection or tactic should be preferred, and it doesn't work, there's no problem nailing posters over that.
Anyway, lets say, you were going to expand on what you've put previously on these pages, would it be a stretch to suggest that you'd pick the team below, if you were going to go with a 442, say:
--------------Travers
Coleman Duffy Clark/OShea Stevens
Hendrick Cullen Brady McClean
---------Long ---- Collins
two things don't happen: the ball doesn't go through the phases, but you'd argue it didn't go through the phases anyway. Fine, the ball gets played through the channels, or it goes long. Serbia always have the extra body at the back, so likely mop up breaking ball, and they always have two off Vlahovic meaning that one of our defenders comes out, one of them comes in, or Cullen drops deeper.
In the last decade, what we've struggled the most has been ball retention. We have to break the cycle of conceding possession, defending heroically for 80mins, and pressing frantically in vain for an equaliser or a consolation. It is not a practical refuge going forward.
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Originally Posted by Richard Dunne
https://www.sundayworld.com/sport/so...-40241715.html
- March 26 2021 07:29 AM
What we saw from Ireland against Serbia on Wednesday was alright. But “alright” is not good enough in a World Cup qualifier and no matter how good the performance was, it was another defeat and we can’t take any more moral victories. You can’t keep taking positives out of defeats, it’s all about getting results and the team didn’t manage that.
WC 2018 - 5/12 wins (Georgia, Moldova, Austria, Serbia!, Wales - no major nations there).
WC 2014 - 4/10 wins (Germany, Sweden, Austria, Kazakhstan, Georgia, Faroes)
WC 2010 - 5/12 wins (italy, Montenegro, Bulgaria, Cyprus, Georgia)
WC 2006 - 4/12 wins (France, Switzerland, Israel, Cyprus, Faroes)
You might want to have a look back through your recent history there Richard.
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Individual performances give us hope and we understand that we have good players, but I’m still concerned about whether we have the players to play the way this manager wants, to build up slowly and play through midfield
Woah there horsey. But if the previous two managers - English professionals - played the other way, with better players, and it didn't qualify us, should we continue on that track with inferior players, who have never played that style of football with underage teams ?
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It’s not all doom and gloom with Ireland, the team weren’t wiped off the park by Serbia in Belgrade, they had good possession. But they just didn’t have the creativity to cause them trouble - I feared once Ireland took the lead that it would just wake Serbia up and that’s how it turned out. I also think we are in danger of talking Serbia up too much, as if they are one of the major nations. They’re not, they’ve struggled any time they went to a major finals in the last 20 years - Scotland beat them last year and we wouldn’t fear Scotland.
Last I checked - 2018 - with your preferred style Richard, we couldn't beat them in Belgrade, and didn't lay a glove on them in Dublin. Likewise, with Scotland - we mightn't fear them, but we cannae bate em either - again, with your preferred style of football, and a professional manager.
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If you are hoping to qualify for a World Cup you can’t lose to a team who are your rivals for second place and then chalk it up as a moral victory. Losing so early puts added pressure on the rest of the group games.
First I've heard anyone refer to the game as amoral victory.
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I also try to look at what went before, and while the two defenders were exposed for that third goal, there was no pressure from midfield to pick up Dusan Tadic before he floated in that ball.
Cullen broke up play, we went on the counter - his ball into Long was intercepted and they broke quickly.
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I’d see Serbia and Ireland as even enough in terms of talent but in Tadic they have that extra bit of quality, someone who can open teams up, which Ireland lack. If Ireland under Stephen Kenny are going to play this passing game, they need someone with the creativity, the invention, to open up the opposition and create chances.
That's laughable. Regardless of that difference of opinion, isn't it mad how there's always a 'but'?
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Apart from Wes Hoolahan, we’ve not had a player like that with Ireland. Our system doesn’t create that player, who gets the freedom to try things. In a structured team, which we have, teams will work us out, they’ll know what our midfielders will do. You need someone who is a maverick, who works off the cuff, who thinks things up, who has the confidence to try and beat someone in a one-on-one, even if that means losing the ball occasionally.
Aiden McGeady.
It’s hard to create when you lack a player like that, and that’s not Stephen Kenny’s fault, but it’s still an issue that’s there and has to be dealt with.
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If he doesn’t have a Wes-type player available, then he has to come up with the tactics to win games, play in a different style.
Oh Richard, you big loveable fool. The last two managers haven't been able to win games doing what you're suggesting.....this is the different style.
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Irish teams over the years - often the teams I played in - were criticised for going from back to front too quickly, and there’s always space for us to play better football as a nation, so Kenny is right in trying to bring in more build-up to the play.
Your teams were criticised for giving the football away constantly, and not getting results.
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But we need to get the ball forward quickly, press teams, like what happened with Ireland’s second goal. A ball down the channel, a pass into the box and a mistake from their defender led to James Collins’ goal. That’s where Ireland are good, that’s where our energy and belief as a team comes from.
Ah, that's the gameplan. press them into making mistakes. Not engineering chances ourselves. And what happens when the opposition doesn't make mistakes?
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But when we try to only build play slowly, that’s not what Ireland do and if teams get back into a good defensive shape, we’ll find it very hard to break them down.
Erm, our first goal?
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We need to mix it up a bit and I felt James McClean showed a bit of energy when he came on. He tried to get crosses in and that’s where we are more likely to cause teams problems, by getting it wide and getting crosses in, instead of playing through the middle all the time. In Robinson and Connolly we have good strikers, but we need to hit them early.
Are you ****ting me Richard? That's like saying the dog chasing the car showed a bit of vigour. Futile, but full of vigour.
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We have players who are learning about international football and it’s hard, as Dara O’Shea is finding out. For me, there was a three-year gap between my first time in the Irish squad and my competitive debut. It was a different era, we had better players then. I had experienced players around me in the squad who I could learn from, defenders like Steve Staunton, so I had a good idea of the demands of international football before Mick put me in at the start of the qualifiers for 2002. These players don’t have that, they don’t have those players to look up to. Dara made a mistake for the first goal, his positioning was wrong, and he’ll learn from that.
Dara had Seamus Coleman playing on one side of him - a candidate for Irish player of the 00s, and a possible all-time right back, and Ciaran Clark, who has played in what is considered a successful Euro 2016.
You learned under Gary Breen and Kenny Cunningham - rather than Staunton.
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But we need to beat Luxembourg tomorrow, they’re not the minnows they were 20 years ago and they’ll be well-organised. The most important thing is not the performance but to win the game. If we don’t win, then there really is a serious problem. There are no excuses for not winning
So we cannot talk up Serbia, and we cannot talk down Luxembourg, even though they are bottom seeds? Which is it.
It's the media, through articles - bad ones- like that, that are stirring the pot unfairly, but aren't being called on it.
