to run the club is about 7000-8000 per week. IF we only take in €10,000 at a home match, we're then struggling from the start. That 10,000 then has to last for 2 weeks until the next home match.
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to run the club is about 7000-8000 per week. IF we only take in €10,000 at a home match, we're then struggling from the start. That 10,000 then has to last for 2 weeks until the next home match.
Just wondering if it could be sorted officially here, would anyone be interested in a copy of "blue white and dynamite" posted free 10e something back in return, for any concerned EL supporters wishing to help Waterford united.Quote:
Originally Posted by joey4ireland
What is Blue White and Dynamite?Quote:
Originally Posted by gotaroundbetter
A collection of stories from waterford suporters, the details of which were posted up by someone else a while back.Quote:
Originally Posted by A face
leading to a little warning from mod's.
Hopefully it can go in the market place section. thats what I mean by something back in return for the members here who kindly expressed an interest in helping . Further details once an ok is given.
a bit like mcanthony with us as well.. all pr stunts im afraid...Quote:
Originally Posted by Blue-Army
Operating a wage cap may well have prevented such a dire situation. Terrible news for the whole league.
After beating the Mons 5-0, a club operating within its means, does it not put the result into perspective. Its similar in a lot of ways to a side like Bray playing against Shelbourne 2+ years ago.
Not a chance, there is no way you can compare both of them.Quote:
Originally Posted by sniffa
Not really. Mismanagement versus pointlessness.Quote:
Originally Posted by sniffa
It's not an issue of a wage cap, just that income is severely down on last year, much more so than was expected. The projections for the new season were made, and it was thought that a similar playing budget to last season could be supported (it was then one of the lowest in the league remember), and it's turned out over the opening home matches that this wasn't so.
The club are not financially f**ked, or up to their eyes in hock, or anything like that, it's just that this season there's more going out each week than coming in, and rightly nobody at the club is willing to get the club into serious debt to counteract that, as might have happened in previous years.
From what I can gather a moderate enough rise in the attendance figures would go a long way to ease the problems, paying crowds of the order of the Wexford game would be enough for the fundraising to cover the remaining shortfall.
Sniffa, I honestly don't know what kind of perspective you're thinking of there. 5-0 against Mons was a bit of a freak result - we were great on the same night they were shash. They beat Shels 1-0, who then played us off the park in Tolka. What does that do to the perspective?
Anthony McMullen!. McAnthony is the lad involved in Peterborough I think. But your point stands. Dunphy was probably bananas when he agreed that. 10k is a lot of money to pay to a club you don't really care about.Quote:
Originally Posted by Martinho II
Not for me -- I'm loaded :cool:Quote:
Originally Posted by Longfordian
We'll await the 'Rocky77' second stand in Flancare so!
If ever their was two words that best summed up dublin city then you have found themQuote:
Originally Posted by Sheridan
I was thinking more in the line of a statue of myself on the car park!
Not to belittle your plight but sounds like Waterfords budget was done on the back of a beer mat. The FAI said recently no club had exceeded the 65% wage cap/percentage so what accounts are Waterford submitting?
Unless there is a large debt no reason to go out of existence. If you can't pay weekly bill then cut costs. If this means going amateur then at least your club continues,
You didn't seriously believe them, did you?Quote:
Originally Posted by pete
Depends on how you interperet the capQuote:
Originally Posted by pineapple stu
65% should really include all players, coaches, phisios etc, etc.
i reckon certain clubs are only including 1st team players and at that not including the whole squad of players
Surely it would include all players registered to play?Quote:
Originally Posted by Greenforever
All player contracts are registered with the league so they'd have to include the whole squad. The 65% is applicable to all of your registered players' wages but doesn't include squad expenses.
The more I hear about this so called 'crisis' the more annoyed I get. Waterford seem to be crying wolf in the hope that someone puts their hand into their pocket and pays for their €7,000 a week team!
It makes the league sound like a joke when you read yet again that a club could go out of business!! There's no need for Waterford to come out with this nonsense. All clubs struggle to meet the weekly costs of running a club. When the money goes the costs are slashed and you get on with running the club. You don't come out with bad news stories that make the league look like a joke.
The facts here seem to be that Waterfords running costs are 10k a week with wages making up about 7k of this, is that correct ?
They don't have any existing debt.
Transfer window is only a month or two away.
Worst case would be you run up debts of 30 or 40k before you cut most of that 7k wage bill. With home gates and assuming you have some cash there already it may not be that much of a debt.
Why the song and dance ?
Maybe if Shels had gone public early on and cut their cloth they wouldn't have dragged the name of the LoI through the mud with their terrible financial practices.Quote:
Originally Posted by higgins
have to agree with higgens if this is a stunt to try and gather financial support then it is not the way to do things
A lesser man might make a quip along the lines of 'now you know how we felt' here, but not me. :)Quote:
Originally Posted by higgins
First off, though, before you get any more annoyed, be sure that you are not mistaking a thread started by a fan, no matter how well intentioned, for what the club are really trying to say. That was made quite clear in a local radio interview with two members of the MC yesterday.
The song and dance, as far as I can gather, and I don't know all the details remember, is that the story was put out in such a way as to bring it home to the local populace (not national, BTW, the appeals were only put about in the local papers, not in the club's control what happened to them after that) that it takes more than a vague goodwill and fondness towards a club to keep it going, that you have to get out and contribute.
This seems to be a Waterford trait. I run into scores of people each week who stop me and ask how the Blues are doing, how it's good to see them near the top of a division again, how they've always supported them since childhood, and it's a genuine interest and goodwill, and yet most of them haven't set foot once in the RSC in all the 14 years or whatever it is they've been there. These people, and those who have given up going out there over recent years, are who the appeals are aimed at.
The problem as it's presented is that given crowds had already dwindled in an alarming fashion, if the club are forced to trim players and effectively give up on the title race and become a permanent denizen of iniquity* then the crowds will fall away to such a level that they may as well throw their hat at it.
On the wage cap, I don't know the details, but I'd guess that you make a budget (or your accountants do at least) with all the usual bona fides at the start of the year where wages are expected to be 65% or less, and then at the end of the season your total wages paid out all season must be no more than 65% of your total income, but that they don't monitor it on a week-by-week basis, that there is fluctuation allowed, is that not so? Wouldn't anything else be impossible to police? If that's so then there is plenty of time to make sure it averages out over the season, even if it does mean slashing wage bills in the heel of the hunt.
I mean, we had three home games in the last four weeks, and now we have one in the next six. All talk of crises aside, that means our quotable income is going to be way down on last month's. Does that mean we'll have to let a load of players go for the month and re-sign them in a month's time? And again at the same point in Series 4? Course not.
* no offence ;)
David is actually a Chelsea supporter and goes to maybe 2 or 3 games a year - I should know - i worked with DFL for seven years and know for a fact that he contributes in no small manner to a local club (Villa) and afaik he still contributes when called upon to WUFCQuote:
Originally Posted by The Man Himself
He was heavily involved a few years ago but like many became dissillusioned with he set up out there
You have to remember as well that the building boom is over and while you may say that he made his money during this you have to remember that he has well over 100 staff to look after every week
I think in the current economic climate that it's going to be difficult to find anyone willing to pump money into the club
You would think so, but this is the FAI we are talking about.Quote:
Originally Posted by A face
Also if a club has say 20 professionals, it probably will have a manager, coach, physio and maybe 1 or 2 other people on the payroll which in my opinion should be part of the wage cap as they are essential to the running of the team.
Maybe the league should assume a cost per match say €x being travel costs hotel costs etc which they should be able to prove they can sustain for the season allowing for players wages etc. 35% of turnover probably wont cover this if turnover is €5k per home game.
Apologies for this post. It was total WUMming brought on by dissertation deadline stress. Driving me up the bloody wall.Quote:
Originally Posted by pól-dcfc
I thought it was relevant to be honest. Its not like we cant talk about it. If it makes Prime Time then its got to be bad. If anything it should be shown to all clubs as a text book case of how not to do it, and nearly all Shels fans would agree with that too. The good times was great but they are now suffering the price.Quote:
Originally Posted by pól-dcfc
Quote:
Originally Posted by 5ForKeeps
The answer to nWaterford - or iondeed any club in finnacial troube's - plight is not to become dependent upon the good-will of a single 'rich' investor.
Has the plight of the likes of Gretna taught football fans nothign...?!? :confused:
Waterford have to make their finances work : i.e. pay out less each week/year than they bring in. That is how you secure the future of a foobtall team - not begging from some sugar dady to write blank cheques, and thereby just delaying and escalating the pain for the day that he inevitably stops writing them (a la Shelbourne..).
1) I'm fairly certain WaterforD weren't mentioned in despatches over the IPL.Quote:
Originally Posted by EalingGreen
2) Why would the collapse of a club like Waterford bear any negative reflection on the Platinum proposal. Surely the only ones it would reflect badly on would be WUFC and the FAI. How can the FAI get off scot-free - even though they're the ones in charge of football there currently - whilst a third party with no involevemtn in football in Waterford get lined-up for the blame ? Oh - i forgot. It's more helpful to discredit the Platinum proposals to do it that way round...
3) Arguably the financial difficultiies of clubs like Waterford actually REINFORCE Platinum's arguements, by showing that Irish football is unfeasible in its current form.
But the plea was made to the public of Waterford, not to any single would be investor. I'd regard it as a rally call to fans of United to attend games in effort to help with any difficulties at present, difficulties that most clubs experience.Quote:
Originally Posted by dcfcsteve
Specious reasoning. By this logic, a plan to relocate all clubs to space because "Irish football is unfeasible in its current form" has now been made stronger by Waterford's troubles.Quote:
Originally Posted by dcfcsteve
LoL at higgins criticising Waterford. Do you know 100% of what's going on there? :rolleyes:
Ha ha, Stu, i can see what you did there and i know its somehow not right :pQuote:
Originally Posted by pineapple stu
Show me how, so.
You can't trump Platinum's cause based on events which have nothing to do with them. You have to look at their proposals and base views on them.
Did you read my post ?Quote:
Originally Posted by pineapple stu
Maybe go back and do so.
If you can't be bothered then just read this bit
The more I hear about this so called 'crisis' the more annoyed I get. Waterford seem to be crying wolf in the hope that someone puts their hand into their pocket and pays for their €7,000 a week team!
I don't know 100% of whats going on which is why I started off the way i did.
No need for the smart comments Stu
stann, clubs are monitored through the season to make sure they are sticking to the 65% rule.
Each month clubs send in their accounts and if you're running over the 65% you get punished. If you don't take steps to rectify the situation the punishments get worse.
Maybe Waterford are already in trouble with the FAI ???
Admittedly I am a little out of touch with LOI football as I have not lived in the country for a few years, however when I lived in Longford and went to every home game and most away trips I felt that a massive oppourtunity was being missed by all clubs. The games never felt like they were a good family night out, it always seemed to be a case of just get the game on and over with as quickly as possible so we can all get back to living our lives. Clubs will pay relatively decent money to players but how many of those clubs have a full time marketing / sales / financial staff. the facilities are fairly good at most grounds, even Flancare is a good ground given the fact the population of the town is small. These facilities are vastly under used and dreadfully undersold. Put on some entertainment before the game (fireworks, local bands, cheerleaders whatever) and turn one ticket sold to dad into 1 for dad 1 for mum and 2 kids tickets etc.. Living in Melbourne where Rugby League is not a huge sport this family orientated evening idea has turned Melbourne Storm into the most powerful club in the league, similar to their football team who won the A-League a year ago. I know there is a large population but these clubs compete against Aussie rules games in the MCG each Fri, Sat and Sunday. Stop running LOI clubs as part time business' and pay some of the fantastic volunteers to go full time at their clubs and these financial problems will soon disappear.
i recall going back a few years ago when flynn and his buddies chartered their own flight from waterford to manchester for a match and offered outsiders a seat on it with match ticket for 300 quid per head, now thats what you call a really funny chelsea supporter.Quote:
Originally Posted by greendeiseboy
or maby he took up following chelsea 4 years ago just like all the other new chelsea fans when the russians came to town :rolleyes:
He's a Chelsea supporter and absolutely hates Man U. And if he's travelling to the UK they do so on their private plane. Are you sure you're not mixing him up with someone else?Quote:
Originally Posted by The Man Himself
And btw i was up to a few years a staunch follower of the Blues as well right back as far as 1970 up to the mid nineties but between work and kids i fell away.
He's followed Chelsea since he was a youngfella - how do i know this? - We grew up on the same street - The Folly - and his best mate was none other than on of the best goalkeepers we ever had - David Flavin - He is also a nephew of the late great Jack Fitzgerald who lived two doors up from himQuote:
Originally Posted by The Man Himself
But you may be right that he has been to Man U games as one of his mates is a big Man U supporter but he is definitely not!
But anyway as i've stated he does help out in a lot ways. I was actually at the Niall Quinn night with him and I know for a fact that he still buys a table at other nights as well
The FAI also said if a club exceeds 55% they have to come in for a sit down & explain what steps they are taking to ensure don't cross the 65%. Whatever about the 65% I will be very surprised if no clubs break 55% before end of July - European Championship break will put a strain on many clubs.Quote:
Originally Posted by higgins