In hindsight, was not renewing Kerr's contract a mistake?

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Originally Posted by barney

Brian Kerr was a poor international manager.

He was the first manager not to get us a top two place in any qualifying group in 8 campaigns (since Eoin Hand). He did it twice. The second time we finished fourth in the group. And don't tell me that he took over when the first campaign was dead and buried. We would have qualified for the Euros if we beat Russia at home and drew with the Swiss away. In two spineless performances, particularly in Berne, we took one point from six.

He failed to beat any top 70 ranked team in competitive action in 8 attempts. We are talking France, Russia, Switzerland and Israel here not exactly world class opposition. He took 6 points from 24 in those games.

He didn't really blood anyone of any note, save for Andy Reid. At least Staunton has.

Kerr inherited a good team with World Cup experience. He had virtually the same side as McCarthy and still didn't do as well as McCarthy. That Stan was a dreadful appointment doesn't make Kerr's poor record any better.

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Ditto. Managers are judged on their results and Brian unfortunately failed.

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Originally Posted by Qwerty

Ditto. Managers are judged on their results and Brian unfortunately failed.

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According to reports the 'special one' is available, having been judged on his results

Is sh*t better than spit?

Two poor managers who no doubt gave their all and came up short. Not their fault - they did the best the could.

The FAI, on the other hand...

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Originally Posted by NeilMcD

Do you think maybe Delaney was the architect of his downfall.

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No I don't think Delaney tried to engineer Kerr's exit. Delaney may not have the best PR but he is doing a good job IMO. However I have an issue with his choice of manager.

I think Kerr just felt the pressure too much of not being the CEO's choice. Hence his decisions in Israel and subsequent mistakes in the home game that piled on the pressure.

Had we won in Israel we most likely would have qualified for Germany and things would be very different now.

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Originally Posted by gspain

Had we won in Israel we most likely would have qualified for Germany and things would be very different now.

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massively massively different. it's vital we get a new manager to lead us into the world cup campaign.

You can't have all the"ifs" but you might be able to negotiate an "if" tradeoff with one of the following
If we were not so very lucky against Cyprus, if we were not so very very lucky against Albania

But unfortunatly there is no if about seeing the Doc come on against the Swiss.

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Originally Posted by gspain

No I don't think Delaney tried to engineer Kerr's exit. Delaney may not have the best PR but he is doing a good job IMO. However I have an issue with his choice of manager.

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Very blinkered view there. Delaney was spinning against Kerr from day one of his appointment, arguably straight after the recruitment process (it was always common knowledge that he was out voted on that panel).

The only valid reason to sack Kerr was to get someone better, someone "World Class" as Delaney himself put it. We didn't, so yes it was a mistake. However, Delaney should carry the can, as no point sacking Staunton if the same person is going to have a chance to repeat the same mistakes in appointing the new guy.

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Originally Posted by brine3

The problem lies with the players. They don't take international football seriously enough. Kerr bored them to death with things like tactics and preparation. Pinger let's them get the pints in and have a bit of fun, but that doesn't cut in international football anymore. Charlton could get away with that because he had top players, but now we have a weaker squad and we need to get the most out of it. You can bet your bottom dollar that Otto Rehhagel's Greece had a professional approach to every match in 2004.

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thats it in a nutshell.

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Originally Posted by Macy

Very blinkered view there. Delaney was spinning against Kerr from day one of his appointment, arguably straight after the recruitment process (it was always common knowledge that he was out voted on that panel).

The only valid reason to sack Kerr was to get someone better, someone "World Class" as Delaney himself put it. We didn't, so yes it was a mistake. However, Delaney should carry the can, as no point sacking Staunton if the same person is going to have a chance to repeat the same mistakes in appointing the new guy.

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maybe thats the problem. keep delaney but remove his responsibility to appoint a manager. he has no quailification or background to suggest he is able to appoint a good manager. Hes basically the worst kind of fan.

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Originally Posted by Billsthoughts

maybe thats the problem. keep delaney but remove his responsibility to appoint a manager. he has no quailification or background to suggest he is able to appoint a good manager. Hes basically the worst kind of fan.

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guess we'll need to get a "world class appointer of managers" then.

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Originally Posted by Billsthoughts

maybe thats the problem. keep delaney but remove his responsibility to appoint a manager. he has no quailification or background to suggest he is able to appoint a good manager. Hes basically the worst kind of fan.

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Might work, if brutal managerial appointments was the only failing on the "Things Delaney's done since his appointment that you hate" list.

Lets be honest here, how many "world class" managers showed an interest in the job or would even show an interest now, very very few if any.....

There's a big gap between Stan and 'world class', I'd accept somewhere in the middle right now.

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Originally Posted by elroy

Lets be honest here, how many "world class" managers showed an interest in the job or would even show an interest now, very very few if any.....

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We'd need someone with the savvy and willingness to make approaches on the quiet to the likes of Jewell, Newell, etc etc to suss out if they would be interested.

Sacking Stan and then starting the tortuous trawl for a Manager would result in more farce.

Do what most other countries tend to do - identify who we want (within reason) and do our damdest to get them.

Was not extending Kerr's appointment the right decision?

Yes, the sheer inevitability of the 0-0 with Switzerland at home, espicially so since it was so blantantly obvious that they weren't even a side to be particularly worried about. We were going nowhere under Kerr.

That said, in hindsight, he was clearly a better manager than Stan, under whom we have clearly gone backwards. As somebody on here said about the Cyprus debacle, we wouldn't have lost 5-2 to Brazil under Kerr.

But the mistake was made in appointing Staunton, not in getting rid. Options seemed to be available (Alridge at least)- we just didn't go for them.

I did'nt agree with Kerr's appointment from the off. And we did'nt qualify. So he had to go. What worries me about Delaney is that he will swing in the complete opposite direction from a Kerr/Stan type to the wrong type of foreign manager ie someone with a high profile but not suited to managing our team. A bluffer type. Someone he likes.

Kerrs appointment was a feel good story for particularly the Dublin media.
Kerr a Dub ,league of ireland manager ,successful for Ireland at under age level got an easy ride for a long time.

moving the team hotel from an airport hotel to portmarnock,good preparation, organised better flights etc,all contrast to before ,but the bottom line media liked him cos he was a Dub and were slow to turn

Not saying that the media have a pop at stan for his flat Louth accent,
they have a go cos he hasn't a clue about management and international
football is not like a fas course!

So what are top international football managers earning?
Sunday, October 23, 2005 - By Ken Early
Sven-Goran Eriksson is by far the highest-paid coach in international football, peering down at his rivals from the top of a cash Everest reported to be €6 million a year.

At the other end of the scale is Oleg Blokhin of Ukraine, who coaches the national team for free because as a member of the Ukrainian parliament he is not allowed to hold another paid job.

There is a considerable spread in between, though most salaries are closer to Blokhin's than to Eriksson's.

Research shows that Germany's Jurgen Klinsmann is the next best-paid European coach after Eriksson.

He is reported to earn €2 million a year, plus all the free flights he can use courtesy of a sponsorship deal with Lufthansa.

Portugal's Brazilian manager Luiz Felipe Scolari is also well-rewarded; his agents leveraged his cachet as a World Cup winner to maximum effect when negotiating a deal worth €1.8 million a year, much of which is paid by the team's sponsors, which include Sagres beer.

Italy coach Marcello Lippi has so far succeeded in keeping a secret of his salary, but it is known that his predecessor in the job, Giovanni Trapattoni, earned €1.5 million a year.

Holland boss Marco van Basten is also reported to earn €1.5 million. A little further down the line, Otto Rehhagel, who steered Greece to a shock Euro 2004 victory, is thought to have an annual salary of more than €1 million.

Perhaps surprisingly, France and Spain both pay their coaches relatively modest wages.

Spain's Luis Aragones earns an estimated €550,000, while French manager Raymond Domenech earns even less: his salary is believed to be close to €400,000 per annum.

Even the Scotland manager is thought to make more than that. While Walter Smith's precise contract details remain shrouded in secrecy, it's known that his predecessor Berti Vogts earned €500,000 before bonuses.

And spare a thought for Sweden's Lars Lagerback, who has to get by on a meagre €300,000 per annum.

Clearly then, Brian Kerr's reported salary of €440,000 was reasonable by international standards, and generous considering the small and impoverished state of our domestic game.

According to research carried out by the League Managers' Association and the London Independent, the salaries of Premiership managers range from €900,000 to €7.5 million, with the “typical'‘ salary being around €1.5 million plus bonuses. However, the average working week for a Premiership manager was 87.5 hours, so clearly the Ireland job is a good deal less stressful.

Annual salaries in the English Championship ranged from €140,000 to €580,000, with a typical mid-range salary of around €200,000, so any manager from that division down is well within the FAI's financial reach.

Hindsight is a great thing
Kerr had his chances, two campaigns in fact, and we were dead boring playing with no heart
but on the other hand he was very unlucky, and we were close enough in the end, and he had a very professional set up

i still fancy Leo Benhakker after the euro champs

think the fact that Kerr blooded so few young players has more to do with the fact that the conveyerbelt of talent seized up for them few years. Can you name me someone he should have blooded that he didnt? He can be 'credited' with blooding John O'Shea, Andy Reid and McGeady

Kerr's problem was that a large section of the squad resented his appointment from day one. He was on a loser from the start due to the lack of respect for him.

As far as I see it, Kerr's dismissal and Staunton's appointment are not seperate issues, they are completely interlinked. Kerr should only have been disposed of if the FAI knew they could attract someone of a higher standard. They should have put the research in before they pulled the trigger on Kerr.

Instead they jumped the gun and treated Kerr, a man who has done a great service to Irish football at all levels, in an utterly shameful fashion. And then they had the brawn to go and appoint Stan..... what a shower!


Totally agree with this post. On the up side I used to be devestated when we were eliminated from a campaign. This time I didn't give too much of a damn. The FAI disgust me as do some of the players. Staunton is just a sad loser. Get a new manager now.

Brian Kerr may not have been the best international manager we ever had but the question remains, how responsible can a manager/coach be if players chicken out once they cross the white line. Cause that is what happens in a spineless performance on the field. In the case of the two matches alluded to in an earlier post more than 3 players failed to perform. I mention more than 3 because only 3 substitutions are permitted at present in International football at present. So if there are more than 3 sh1t performers which of the 6 or so do you remove? Also I doubt Ireland would have lost by THREE goals against Cyprus under Kerr, they might well have lost , but not by THREE.

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Originally Posted by BobbySands

think the fact that Kerr blooded so few young players............. He can be 'credited' with blooding John O'Shea, Andy Reid and McGeady.......

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A sackable offence on its own! :eek:

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Originally Posted by Superhoops

A sackable offence on its own! :eek:

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:D:D you aint wrong

John Gregory is now available... :S

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Originally Posted by CollegeTillIDie

Brian Kerr may not have been the best international manager we ever had but the question remains, how responsible can a manager/coach be if players chicken out once they cross the white line. Cause that is what happens in a spineless performance on the field. In the case of the two matches alluded to in an earlier post more than 3 players failed to perform. I mention more than 3 because only 3 substitutions are permitted at present in International football at present. So if there are more than 3 sh1t performers which of the 6 or so do you remove? Also I doubt Ireland would have lost by THREE goals against Cyprus under Kerr, they might well have lost , but not by THREE.

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We wouldn't haven't lost to Cyprus managed by most people on this forum.

Kerr managed a shocking performance in Cyprus too. We won 1-0. It's all relative. Kerr's performances were totally different when Delaney took over (after Faroes home before Israel away).

The saddest thing about stan being in charge is that he has inherited a much more promising squad than kerr. look at all the strikers we have playing top flight and championship footie. kerr had to rely on morrisson and the nose mostly.

And er keane of course :)