Worst Irish international you have seen play

I respect Kilbane for the caps he's amassed and the effort he's consistently shown... But I do regret the fact that Damien Duff was always shoved out of position to accomodate him - and that his many appearances in central midfield kept Steven Reid from settling in that position. Reid is our best central midfielder (when fit) and it's a travesty that, at 26, he's never played a competitive game in the position.

The only game Kilbane hasn't started for us in the last few years was the 3-0 win over Sweden, when Duff and Reid both played brilliantly in their proper positions. Kilbane doesn't deserve derision or contempt, but I think his continued presence in midfield is holding back the team. He can't pass the ball or read the game. He should be dropped. Enough is enough.

I agree with a lot of what you say there about Kilbane but it appears Duff's great days are well behind him and Steven Reid is crocked so you cant really blame him for that.

I would still have Duff ahead of him on the left (when fit) but its the same old story-who is better in center mid than him at the moment? Andy Reid is constantly injured and gets pushed off the ball very easily. Kavangh is gone, Holland is gone, Carlsely hasnt done much since he came back-remember how negative he was against san marino away?

In this campaign Kilbane has scored against the czechs, vital away goal against SM when we never looked like scoring, and also put in 2 pin point crosses for 2 goals against SM at home. Cant comment on Germany or Cyprus, didnt see them at all as i was on d'other side of the world.

So who should be CM for our next qualifiyer?

Since he died from cancer at the age of only 28, I am loathe to mention Austin Hayes (the one cap wonder).

The worst other performance I saw was by another member of the wild geese whose name eludes me. Played in a friendly as a forward last year I think and made no effort whatsoever. His only cap. Is it Jonathon Macken?

I think Carsley and Steven Reid would be okay. They're not exactly Gattuso and Pirlo, but they would give energy and aggression, and I think they would use the ball and control the game a lot better than Kilbane.

Long term? If Glenn Whelan and Darren Potter can improve and start playing at a higher level, they could be solid options a lá Holland/Kinsella a few years back. I have very high hopes for Darron Gibson and Owen Garvan.

A half a cap in a friendly shouldn't count towards this crowded hall of fame. otherwise the hall would be overflowing with credible one cap nominations. Those caps were given more in a miraculous hope than merit.

Ashley Grimes came close to consideration, but a stout hearted indiv. performance from him in a draw away to France saves his bacon.

Our Goalkeeper's have for the most part been good but what about Paddy Roche? remembered fondly by Man U's rivals even after 30 years.
First cap was in the worst ever perf by an Irish team losing 1-6 to Austria. He missed everything and saved nothing.
Can't remember any bad mistakes after that.

talking of goalkeepers....Wayne Henderson/Nick Colgan???

Not fair on Henderson. Ron Healy springs to mind though.

He doesn't spring to my mind, blanked out old bad memory syndrome maybe?

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Originally Posted by geysir

He doesn't spring to my mind, blanked out old bad memory syndrome maybe?

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Was he a keeper?. The ability to spring is a definite plus for a keeper......

Wasn't he the bloke who Kevin Keegan chipped in the early 80s? We lost 2-0 at Wembley.

I think it was a real case of having absolutely no back up at all so they called up Cardiff's keeper to sit on the bench and then Kearns, McDonagh or Bonner or whoever was playing went off injured [Edit: actually it was Gerry Peyton]. God, my memory is going now too but thank God for patmac.

http://www.soccerscene.ie/sssenior/m...ils.php?id=179

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Originally Posted by Stuttgart88

Wasn't he the bloke who Kevin Keegan chipped in the early 80s? We lost 2-0 at Wembley.]

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That goal is immortalised on BBC's 101 Great Goals :(

I was at that game, it was well worth supressing.
I'll need some of that psychiatric help now.

I was at that game as well. Fran O'Brien was drafted in by Giles. He had a nightmare game.

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Originally Posted by as_i_say

Don't watch many Ireland games do you? Kilbane rarely lets the team down and has made telling contributions in many of those 70 caps including some vital performances in this campaign already.

Worst Irish international? pull the other one.

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think you are the one not looking at the game, all kilbane does is run and run and run and then losese the ball

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Originally Posted by OwlsFan

The worst other performance I saw was by another member of the wild geese whose name eludes me. Played in a friendly as a forward last year I think and made no effort whatsoever. His only cap. Is it Jonathon Macken?

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Yeah, Jon Macken. Played in the 1-1 draw against Bulgaria. Don't recall a single contribution from him, to be honest.

Amazed (though I probably shouldn't be) the number of people who rate players with little flair but a huge engine among the worst players ever. Kilbane, McGoldrick, Morris? Give me a break...

Surprised no Bohs fan has been on to nominate Gareth Farrelly.

A new slant on this. Put together the worst players in a team:

Ron Healey

John O'Shea
Paul Butler
Pierce O'Leary (or Barry Murphy)
Fran O'Brien

Gary Howlett
Austin Hayes (RIP)
Billy Newman

Mickey Evans
Glen Crowe
Cathal Muckian

Alfie Hale on the subs bench along with O'Keefe. O'Keefe was completely unencumbered by talent. When I saw him play at Dalyer in a friendly against Mexico he was beyond bad. Someone in the crowd shouted out that Jimmy Saville had got him into the team.

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Originally Posted by Noelys Guitar

Alfie Hale on the subs bench along with O'Keefe. O'Keefe was completely unencumbered by talent. When I saw him play at Dalyer in a friendly against Mexico he was beyond bad. Someone in the crowd shouted out that Jimmy Saville had got him into the team.

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I think there have been far worse than those two, especially Alfie Hale. Alfie got 13 caps, albeit over a long period. Eamonn O'Keefe got 5 caps over a four year period. He was a real football journeyman and his list of clubs is interesting.

I would rate Hale a better player than say Liam Buckley or Alan Campbell. What about Jerome Clarke whose international career involved replacing Johnny Giles for 12 minutes.

In the 70's and early 80's there some very ordinary players were selected for Ireland. Many only got one shot and good luck to them.

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Originally Posted by Superhoops

I think there have been far worse than those two, especially Alfie Hale. Alfie got 13 caps, albeit over a long period. Eamonn O'Keefe got 5 caps over a four year period. He was a real football journeyman and his list of clubs is interesting.

I would rate Hale a better player than say Liam Buckley or Alan Campbell. What about Jerome Clarke whose international career involved replacing Johnny Giles for 12 minutes.

In the 70's and early 80's there some very ordinary players were selected for Ireland. Many only got one shot and good luck to them.

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Eamon O'Keefe was involved in a very long and drawn out appeal to establish his eligibilty which if i remember correctly, took years. When he started this he was a top flight player with Everton and when he finally won the case he was playing in the lower divisions and approaching veteren status. I always thought Eoin Hand felt some sense of obligation to give him a few caps after all that. I seem to remember he was also included as an overage player for an under 21 tour

To get onto the worst team a cap should have played a full game.
Preference should go to the worst who played a competitive game.

There's a list of LOI players capped in friendlies who have not been mentioned yet, Synan Braddish, Tommy McConville, Miah Dennehy,
even Mick Smith got a cap. It's a selection nightmare :)
There was some sort of a selection policy for friendlies that depended on whoose turn it was to be rewarded.

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Originally Posted by geysir

To get onto the worst team a cap should have played a full game.
Preference should go to the worst who played a competitive game.

There's a list of LOI players capped in friendlies who have not been mentioned yet, Synan Braddish (2 caps in the space of a week), Tommy McConville (6 caps), Miah Dennehy (11 caps and went to Notts Forest), even Mick Smith got a cap (against the perennial opponents, Poland). It's a selection nightmare :)
There was some sort of a selection policy for friendlies that depended on whoose turn it was to be rewarded.

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Apart from Mick Smyth there were several other 'one cappers'. There was a thread on this some time ago.

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Originally Posted by RiffRaff

Eamon O'Keefe was involved in a very long and drawn out appeal to establish his eligibilty which if i remember correctly, took years. When he started this he was a top flight player with Everton and when he finally won the case he was playing in the lower divisions and approaching veteren status. I always thought Eoin Hand felt some sense of obligation to give him a few caps after all that. I seem to remember he was also included as an overage player for an under 21 tour

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His grandparent(s) were Irish but eligibility was in question because he had played for England's semi-professional team a couple of times.

He was 28 when he was capped at senior level. Between that and his second cap, he played 4 times for the U-21's and I reckon he must have been the oldest ever U-21 player, 30 years old, when he scored 4 goals against China U-21 in the Toulon tournament in 1983.

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Originally Posted by geysir

To get onto the worst team a cap should have played a full game.
Preference should go to the worst who played a competitive game.

There's a list of LOI players capped in friendlies who have not been mentioned yet, Synan Braddish, Tommy McConville, Miah Dennehy,
even Mick Smith got a cap. It's a selection nightmare :)
There was some sort of a selection policy for friendlies that depended on whoose turn it was to be rewarded.

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Was Synan Braddish not with Liverpool reserves when he was capped.And it is totally unfair to say these were token caps.These guys were the best available and deserved caps at the time of selection.Tommy Mc Conville was a clas defender as was Al Finnucane and a few other LOI players at the time.
By the way I remember the crowd calling Alfie Hales name to come on agaisnt Poland and as far as I can recall he scored and made the other Irish goal to force a 2 all draw in Dalyer???Was it Mick Meagan ( Huddersfield and Everton) who he replaced???Miah Dennehy beat Tomacheski ,the "clown" keeper in another Polish match the week they put England out of the world Cup.

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Originally Posted by shelbourne1904

Was Synan Braddish not with Liverpool reserves when he was capped.And it is totally unfair to say these were token caps.These guys were the best available and deserved caps at the time of selection.Tommy Mc Conville was a clas defender as was Al Finnucane and a few other LOI players at the time.
By the way I remember the crowd calling Alfie Hales name to come on agaisnt Poland and as far as I can recall he scored and made the other Irish goal to force a 2 all draw in Dalyer???Was it Mick Meagan ( Huddersfield and Everton) who he replaced???Miah Dennehy beat Tomacheski ,the "clown" keeper in another Polish match the week they put England out of the world Cup.

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Many of the better LOI goalies got a cap each in friendlies but you'd have to be dripping in acid not to consider Peter Thomas to be the outstanding class goalie of his time. I'd say there was something fishy about the way some of those caps were given. Mick Smith ffs, ahead of Thomas, insane.

Synan B. came on against Turkey in a friendly at Landsdowne, I think he got the ball once and flunked it. Too inexperienced and naive.
I'll definitly give you Tommy Mc and Al Finnucane, at a minimum they would give a good account of themselves at internat. level, same with Alfie Hale and Mick Leech.

Jon Macken, definitely, although he only got one shot at it.

Of the players that have played regularly for us over the past 20 years, I would have thought that John O'Shea has been the least effective. Every other player that springs to mind - Ian Harte, Kevin Kilbane, Gary Breen - have more than enough moments to remove them from the list. Harte's goals, the odd good challenge from Breen (and he and Cunningham formed a half-decent partnership), Kilbane's work rate as well as a few important goals. I've seen the bloke play for Ireland more times than is good for one's health and I've never seen him contribute to the team's performance, an awful indictment of a player.

Picking out one-hit wonders is easy enough but probably unfair on them. It's the ones who are picking up cap after cap without putting in the effort that deserve to be strung up!

Who would be the manager??? I would have to go with the old FAI selection crew.

What about Éamon Dunphy?

Has to be a bona fide manager, Mick Meagan stand out tall, no contest

Mick Smyth was a decent keeper. Miah Dennehy was a decent striker too - scored the winner v Poland a few days after the knocked England out of the 74 world Cup.

Guys like Tommy McConville, Synan Braddish, Jerome Clark were also top LoI players in their day. I don't recall any real surpise LoI selections in the 70's and 80's.

There was certainly a period in the 40's and early 50's when some poor quality players were capped from the LoI. Some people with influence from at least one club would try and flog them across the water after ensuring they got selected for the national team eventhough better players were available.

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Originally Posted by gspain

Some people would try and flog them across the water after ensuring they got selected for the national team eventhough better players were available.

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Good to see we've taught Brazil something about football.

Gary Breen? I can;t think of a single time he let the team down. Absolutely shocking at times at club level (wolves play off cringe!)but a player punching way above his weight for us. had a great qualification campaign in 02 and played very well in the world cup itself. Just dont understand having him near this thread at all.

Kilbane-see my earlier post. Can be frustrating a lot of times but has made many important contributions and always gives 100%.

Neither deserve to be anywhere near muck like John O shea who really HAS consistently been awful for ireland in his multiple caps and as such would get my vote hands down if for nothing else missing that sitter against France.

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Originally Posted by as_i_say

missing that sitter against France.

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I hold many things against O'Shea (not in the David Norris conext) but not that missed chance. It came to him in an instant, he connected well and it flew wide of the post. It was more difficult than you think, especially for a defender.

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Originally Posted by Stuttgart88

I hold many things against O'Shea (not in the David Norris conext) but not that missed chance. It came to him in an instant, he connected well and it flew wide of the post. It was more difficult than you think, especially for a defender.

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Yeah but you just know well that if happened to hit anyones elses foot, it probably would have crept it. It was the like the backstard could just do no right.

:( :rolleyes:

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Originally Posted by as_i_say

Neither deserve to be anywhere near muck like John O shea who really HAS consistently been awful for ireland in his multiple caps and as such would get my vote hands down if for nothing else missing that sitter against France.

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Conceded that needless peno against Israel in Dublin too. :( :( :(

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Originally Posted by Torn-Ado

Yeah but you just know well that if happened to hit anyones elses foot, it probably would have crept it. It was the like the backstard could just do no right.

:( :rolleyes:

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have you never followed Ireland before?

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Originally Posted by Bluebeard

have you never followed Ireland before?

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Fair enough. You could add a few more players into that bracket. :(

Unfortunately.

Joe Lapira?

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Originally Posted by as_i_say

Gary Breen? I can;t think of a single time he let the team down. Absolutely shocking at times at club level (wolves play off cringe!)but a player punching way above his weight for us. had a great qualification campaign in 02 and played very well in the world cup itself. Just dont understand having him near this thread at all.

Kilbane-see my earlier post. Can be frustrating a lot of times but has made many important contributions and always gives 100%.

Neither deserve to be anywhere near muck like John O shea who really HAS consistently been awful for ireland in his multiple caps and as such would get my vote hands down if for nothing else missing that sitter against France.

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Although I can't give precise examples, the memory throws up a million visions of us conceding a goal, watching the replay on the tele and seeing Breen miles away from his man. He was never a completely reliable defender (even Mick McCarthy conceded that he wasn't "everyone's cup of tea") and was the target of much ridicule as a result (a lot of which was unfair, in retrospect). He had some shocking games for Ireland but, like you say, played great in the World Cup. Ultimately, he made himself part of a team in 2002 that could be excellent on its day, which was a hell of an achievement for a player of his average abilities.

Kilbane has had plenty of good games for Ireland and plenty of muck ones - rather like Gary Breen. I think we agree on O'Shea. :D

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Originally Posted by Wolfie

Conceded that needless peno against Israel in Dublin too. :( :( :(

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O'Shea might be a lot of things and has a long list of shortcomings but Benayoun's theatrics imo won that penalty.

If its who has been the worst player to amass an unbelievable amount of caps then its Kilbane by a long way. Put it another way if there anyone else so talentless who has even won 50 caps let alone nearly 100?

For one-off awfulness Paul Butler has rightly got a few mentions. The other one I remember is Alan Mahon who played 20-30 minutes of some friendly and was abysmal beyond belief.