Nothing to correct.Quote:
Originally Posted by Donal81
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Nothing to correct.Quote:
Originally Posted by Donal81
They need to repeat tonights performance game in game out. There is no excuse.
The real lesson of the Cyprus game is that Ireland cannot play open fluid football and expect to beat anyone. If we had a midfield in Cyprus ( we played 3 wingers and player who prefers to play in the hole ) we would not have lost, our defenders were constantly exposed because there was no protection whatsoever.
It was unfortunately a very embarrasing and costly lesson for Stan to learn, and I hope he has learnt it.
McShane, Douglas and Kelly showed the kind of grit you expect from an Irish player. I expect nothing less.
I thought JOS was stuck on halfway line after the (good) foul. No fault McShane though.
you get the feeling given would have saved it and held on to it... but that's the difference between league 1 and one of the best keepers in the world for you
I am proud to put my hand up and say ' that was fooking good irish performance. I didnt even wash my jersey after saturday. I wore it again, and insisted i;m exorcising the ghosts of nicosia past. thankfully, i not only banished those ghosts, i think paul mcshane may even have stuck his boot up one their ar$es on their way out. we battle on. good oul ireland. I knew she would'nt let me down.
Good display against one of Europes top teams's. McShane was great, so was Kilbane and Carlsey. Kelly & Douglas also very good.
Still a lot of work to be done but if the squad put in same kinda effort that was given vs The Czechs tonight and we don't suffer any more severe injury problems, this time next year we will be up there fighting for a place in Euro 2008.
Still not overly convinced about Staunton, hopefully he will prove me wrong.
I think at lot of lessons were learned tonight.
Mine were
a) Passion and sheer balls can compensate for other inadequacies
b) The players respect the manager and responded accordingly
c) There is something rotten in the squad
d) That something is the journeymen of the likes of Clinton Morrison, who frankly doesn't care and never has.
e) The manager and the squad are on a learning curve...but they will only improve
Much, much better than last Saturday. I'm delghted to be E50 down.
McShane was immense. For a lad on his debut playing First Division football making Jan Koller - a superb player - he was immense. Fair dues.
Kelly was superb, I thought. One passage I remember when he won the tackle, then prevented it going out of touch, and then won the throw. Much, much improved on the Chile performance.
Duff was much nearer his best. He's now gotten the assist on all three goals this campaign.
Thought Henderson could have done better for the goal - thought he was too near his near post - but did well overall.
Superb finish from Kilbane.
Overall - happy, I suppose. (Still want Delaney out thought...)
I think McShane shows the benefits of leaving a big club, going to a smaller one, but playing week in week out in a proper position. Just wish the likes of O;shea and Miller had done what he did
I'm delighted that Robbie Keane thought it fitting to give the crowd a good ol' fist pump after our slightest ambitions for 2008 had been extinguished following his open goal miss with 2 mins to go. Nice to see Mick Byrne cheering after we drew at home to a Czech team which is nowhere near as good as their predecesors.
Happy with most of the performance, not happy with the result. O' Shea - I never want to see again. Stephen Kely did well but he's extemely limited. What has happened to Steve Finnan?
Andy Reid looked ****ed after the warm ups. What a pile of ****
Ah well, there's always 2010 :rolleyes:
andy o'brien....
if your reading this...
I, and every other true Irish fan is 100% behind you. You are living out our dream by playing for our country. Everyone makes mistakes, yours is a job like any other, you can't get everything perfect. I've watched you over the years since you were a centre-back at Bradford. you have masses of ability that i believe this country will thrive on for the next 7 years. Those who doubt you now, ignore them, because one good performance later and you will be the best centre back in the world. Just keep your chin up, keep training hard, and the good form will come again, and I for one, am looking forward to seeing you turn it on for Ireland, and watch these doubter's come crawling one by one.
I'll stand by my criticism of Keane. One chance in a game which came in injury time is not good enough for a professional striker. He ran a hell of a lot but that's just not good enough.Quote:
Originally Posted by geysir
eh thought we played as well as we have in last few years.good game. mcshane played well. some of the tackles were great. begs the question why not all the time? but still only complaint was equaliser. fair play to understrength team. delaney and your poxy stewards **** off and die.:mad:
McShane,without doubt the best performance by a debutant since Liam Brady. Might have been the occasion, but he sure took his chance. A definite starter along with the honey monster. Douglas also took his chance and deserves to hold onto his place. Henderson could have done better on the goal, but at least he was very cool under pressure and IMO looked confident in himself. Kelly did ok , still needs to mature and gain confidence in himself. Playing first team football at Birmingham will do him the world of good. Cannot understand the critism of Andy Reid on this site. I understand the perception of him being overweight, but in reality he is not. Gazza was IMO heavier when he was regarded as the player of his generation and Rooney is at least the same weight (and younger) is regarded as world class. Martin Jol said he was one of the most talented players he has worked with,but, according to my Spurs friends Jol had no choice to sell him cause he is injury prone.I thought whenever Reid got the ball something would happen for us, similar to whenever Liam Brady got the ball. Reid just needs a consistent season without injury. Keano huffed and puffed badly needs a goal to get his confidence back. Duff was excellent badly needs a finisher along side him to really make him world class. Overall a good performance, but how I hate the term morale victory, as was bandied about tonight. Shoulda,coulda, and woulda is no longer good enough. When at home beat we must win, don't care who they are...
right this will probably be a long one! Lots to think about after the game. Bare in mind I've only seen the game in the flesh no replays or any of that.
First thing has to be we're out of the running? No qualification for us this time. We had to win tonight for that to happen. Without trying to upset anyone here, with 15 mins to go, does it matter whether we draw or lose? By drawing we've gained nothing on the top two. I was dissapointed that Alan O'Brien came on for Kilbane. I really am. I've seen nothing from him that merits being in the team. I'd have liked to have seen the second forward on, be it Morrison or Lee. I feel the Czechs had settled for the draw and were happy to allow us hoof ball after ball towards Keane and Alan Quinn. Duff got the ball three times in the second half and three times got the ball into the danger area, leading to one goal, one astonishing miss and another good effort.
The crowd upped the ante tonight. Excellent everybody. Not that Staunton or Delaney should take the crowds exuberance as a measure of the collective feeling for them, rather an outpouring of support for OUR team. I was on the East Bucket level with the 18yd line at the North end. All of the fans around me stood from start to finish and sung whenever prompted, oldies and cripples included. Fair play nobody sitting down or hindered by height disadvantages complained. Stewards initially started to tell people to stand down, but one look at the mass of bouncing Czechs in the North Terrace told them where to go.
Many positives and still a few negatives from the game. The positives.
Our tempo was impressive throughout, bar a 15 minute spell midway through the first half.
I thought we might adopt a 'kick-them-off-the-park' approach and it wasn't far off. Douglas, Carsley, Kilbane, McShane and to a lesser extent Kelly all were robust on several occasions. Which is what has been missing. It is kinda ridiculous when certain tackles last in your mind (i.e. showing up that we haven't consistently got into teams over the last few years), Kav on Gilberto against Brazil was a stand out one. Tonight there were several. Kilbane absolutely creamed Ufjalusi and Polak in quick succession just before his goal while Carsley caught Koller with a peach mid air.
We got about them and the crowd responded, which the players responded too in kind. To resort to a old tactic, we put em under pressure. There did seem to be a team ethic. If someone made a mistake there was nothing but pats on the back or re-assuring words by the looks of things.
In other words the passion was back. Our set-pieces were good. Which is crazy cinsidering we were up against giants. McShane will be an excellent foil for Killer and Dunne offensively.
As for the bad things. When I heard the team I will admit I was disappointed to hear Stephen Kelly name on Tuesday. I thought he was dire. Has no sense of being able to read the game. Caught out many times. Is a hard tackler but seemed to stand off his man quite often and allow his pace get him out of trouble. I wouldn't be troubled if he doesn't get near the team again. I still believe Killer can be a great full back for us.
Our use of the ball. Terrible. Terrible. Once Reid went off everything went airborn. When Killer went off it still stayed in the air. Once again no through balls for the CF to feed off. Our finishing. We could easily have had 3 goals before our actual goal. Douglas should have scored. As should Duff (when we could have been awarded a penalty).
John O'Shea. Shown up by his junior partner and one wonders if John O'Shea wasn't such a puff and put it up to Fergie a year ago like McShane did last season, would the waterford man actually have a tangible career to talk about in a few years. He doesn;t seem to have an aggressive bone in his body and I'm afraid if he doesn;t have one then I'm not sure what he can offer to this team. I felt that deoending on tonight one of himself and Killer would be dropped. It won't be Killer I'd hope.
Henderson - 6. Poor positioning I felt for the goal. Had nothing to do apart from one fumbled effort in first half.
Finnan - 6. Not composed last night. Needs to have a regular slot in team and have a regular partner in front. A player who needs the arm round the shoulder, I wonder what has Carr's recall done for his confidence.
Kelly - 5.5. Poor imo. Cannot pass, doesn't offer anything offensively. Hasn;t and doesn't look like an international player.
O'Shea -5. At fault for the goal, as gave away free which led to goal and then lost concentration for the goal itself. Should be dropped against San Marino.
McShane - 9. Man of the match. How a player of 5'11" continually beat Liberty Hall in the air amazed me. Did everything right from actions to talking, passing was top notch also. Here to stay.
Duff - 8. Played well, albeit didn't see much of the ball. Control is second to none and crossing with both feet excellent.
Douglas- 6. Lots of bite, won great header which started the motions for the goal. Needs a few games but has potential. Should have scored.
Carsley- 7. Did everything that was expected. If he'd been in the squad last week, I think we'd be 5 points better off. Composed the middle 4.
Killer- 8. The occasional pass stray pass aside, back to playing the way for which he won so many caps consecutively. No player, not one, matches his commitment, effort and industry. If you put a scanger Dub accent on him he wouldn't get half the abuse.
Reid. - 7. Needs to work on the finishing as the goal opened up 5/6 times for him. Technically the best player in the squad, unfortunately he seems never to get fit enough. Is there room for a player who we can get 50 mins out of in the first XI? Fraid not.
Keane. - 6. Poorly marked purely because he didn't get much ball. Ran the boll*x out of himself and rightly so as he's captain. One clear cut chance, and should have scored. Some people think he's world class, I dont. If he's world class he'd take the chance.
Subs. Neither did anything when they came on.
I think you lads are being harsh on young Kelly. Personally I thought he was excellent, good in the tackle and covered a lot of ground.
From our friends on youtube
Kilbanes goal
Tribute to Kilbane
He came on in the last ten minutes and only got the ball once I think ... what were you expecting?Quote:
Originally Posted by Soper
Overall, it was a good battling performance ... a lot more than I was expecting to be honest. The key question is will we be able to sustain that sort of effort against all of the teams especially the 'lesser' sides. Keane's miss at the end was a shocker but he worked very hard all night closing down. Duff seemed to be given more licence to move around the pitch and was a lot more effective because of it.
So we put in a strong pasionate performance... regretfully the motivation for it seems to of being caused by the "hurt" Stan and the players felt after Saturday. For me that is so typical and sums up why Staunton should be fired... a half decent manager who knew what he was about wouldn't of let Saturday happen in the first place.Indeed we'd of won on Saturday if we had a professional at the helm , instead of our sulking schoolboy of a manager banished in the stand due to his own childisness. Also a decent manager would have the team tuned properly so that (yet again Stan) we wouldn't concede within momnets of scoring.
So today we should be looking 6 points on the board not "une pointe" and a genuine chance of competing down to the wire for second spot and qualification.
So Yes it was good to see some pride restored... but I'm in the Roy Keane camp on this one...last night we failed to take the 3 points that were on offer so nothing to celebrate there !!
Finally, is it me, but I'd also like to see Mick Byrne gone... having to enjure the sight of him coming on the pitch at the end of the game and kissing the badge on his track suit and generally acting as if he had just played/scored made me want to vomit.... what that's all about .... oh yes I forgot , he's another of Stan's so called brilliant cunning tactics and his job is to act as some sort of overpaid "cheerleader" for the "boys".... genius Stan.
Henderson 7
Kelly 8
Finnan 7
O'Shea 7
McShane 9
Carsley 8
Duffer 8
Douglas 8
Kilbane 8
A Reid 7
Keano 7
We restored a bit of pride but the campaign is over now in my eyes. 1 point from 3 games is what it is despite the renewed optimism from last night. That's the downside along with the fact we have still to beat a top ranked team for the first time in years in a competitive game.
The up side was the performances of the young lads. I'll not mention anything as it's all been said but they've shown they have a future with us. I've never saw a lot in Kelly but he did well last night and McShane's performance belied his years.
Carsley added a bit of steel and presence to the midfield again without doing anything great. Still, I will admit he made a difference when I didn't think he would make that much.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Condex
Waiting to happen:confused:
John O'Shea. Shown up by his junior partner and one wonders if John O'Shea wasn't such a puff and put it up to Fergie a year ago like McShane did last season, would the waterford man actually have a tangible career to talk about in a few years. He doesn;t seem to have an aggressive bone in his body and I'm afraid if he doesn;t have one then I'm not sure what he can offer to this team.
He'll struggle to get in for the next game. McShane is certainly here to stay. O'Shea loves skirting around. It's nearly like he used to only play well when Roy Keane was around. I reckon if Keane was his manager he'd nail him. He's a luxury in my eyes. A lazy one at that!
It was great to see the way people got behind the team from the start. It was quite emotional, cause clearly it was born from hurt and pain.. The team kept us singing till the end too, which was impressive, cause i dont think it would have taken much for us to turn on them if they hadnt performed.
It was the first night since saipan that we were all one (united) again I felt.
I think its been a good week. The team have learnt whats required. They can never treat the green jersey with disrespect again. Friendlies matter. International football matters... Its good to see for the future, and we've a few good games coming up..
Never mind the qualification. There were bigger things being worked on.
Good performance by the team, but we should be expecting that enthusiasm and passion for EVERY game. Thought Henderson positioning was at fault for the goal, plus he looked nervy for most of the game, his kick outs from back passes weren't great.
McShane was excellent, hopefully he keeps it up.
Keane should have stuck that chance in at the end. He was only two yards out!!
Good performance last night, restored some of my faith in the team.
A typical battling performance , though we will probably be little more than a team of spoilers not allowing the better teams to play.
Impressed by McShane, Carsley and Kilbane. John O'Shea has to go he is just not intereseted.
Now the question that needs to be answered , what the **** was going on in Cyprus , last night will not and never should make up for that debacle and I stick by my view that Staunton should go.
Totally agree. As far as the bank balance goes we are far more in debt to Andy O'Brien than he is to us. The entire back 5 played poorly on Saturday, as did most of the rest of the team.Quote:
Originally Posted by livehead1
What amazes me is that in his interview last night Stan said the difference bwtween last night & Cyprus was that the defence played poorly on Saturday. Can he not see that this was, in the main, due to the absence of a midfield.
Watching the performance against the Czechs made last Saturday in Nicosia even moe inexcusable. Staunton (who claims he is jinxed with bad luck) is actually a very fortunate man to have stumbled across a situation where he had no other choice but to play those guys that played so heroically last night. Carsley, McShane, Kelly et al saved his bacon big time. The big question is: Can he learn from it? On the eveidence of the campaign so far, the answer is: No
Agree it was much better (though any better than our home draws in the last campaign????0
Unfortunately I don't believe that some of these players will play like that in every game. Maybe we shoudl arrange for Cyprus to play us before every game!
Seems to be some grudging praise of Carsley on here, i.e he's not a match winner. That's the point. I dont want to see him haring up into the box whenever we have the ball. I want him to be intelligent enough to sit and wait to break up attacks.
I'd love to hear Stan tell us what he's learned from this week. If he has learned that:
You need a defensive/holding midfielder
Your defenders need to be coached properly
We need to play more friendlies so we dont have to risk new players in competitive matched
then I'm happy. However I can see him not picking McShane and Carsley next time.
Carsley will be lucky to make the squad, never mind the team.Quote:
Originally Posted by cavan_fan
Great performance last night, am amazed how a team such a shambles a few days ago could put together such an organised performance last night. I think its unfair to be overly critical of anyone last night, I thought all players deserved at least a 7. I thought Kelly did quite well at left back, douglas held his own and McShane was superb. Keane is not a lone striker but it was a terrible miss at the end. I also thought JOS showed last night his best position for us is CB, put in a decent performance although always prone to one or two errors.
However, I'm a bit concerned with people getting carried away. Last night was points dropped in my opinion, yet again we've failed to win a big game at home. This day last week we all would have been of the opinion that at least 4, but 6 points was necessary. We've got one!!
Optimist for the future perhaps, but still alot of work to do. Just got to take one game at a time for now and see where we end up at the end of the group.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Paddy Garcia
Really that shouldn't happen but now Stan has left himself open to one of his many contradictions now. He originally said he wanted to go with the young players and snubbed him twice.
I don't think he can win now with this one and it's his own fault. Include him at someone else's expense the next time and some will say "what happened to your original statement of sticking with who you have". Leave him out and they will say that he helped cover over a problem area for us.
Who to drop from last night's team, assuming we have a full squad ?
Henderson - Shay Given
Finnan - Steve Carr to right full (Finnan to left full ? or O'Shea ?)
Kelly - ok game, but Finnan or O'Shea would get in ahead of him
O'Shea - looked like a real defender for most of game, but went walkabout for Koller's goal. Not a definite starter anymore. Richard Dunne back at centre back, alongside McShane
R. Keane - Kevin Doyle (Keane could stay in a 4-4-2, but if its 4-5-1, it has to be Doyle)
Douglas - good performance, but still not fully up to the standard required. Will go if its 4-4-2; otherwise, Stephen Reid would be a contender.
Only definite starters for next game (all being fit):
Given
Carr
McShane
Dunne
Carsley
A.Reid
Duff
Kilbane
Doyle
Battling peformance, and had a gut feeling they'd do well. delighted for the youngsters McShane and Douglas, both homegrown and both will be regulars in the future. By the way, slightly off topic, hard to get some of the irish papers in my part of town, but Stan had a go at some of the media to leave his parents alone. which papers was he having a go at? i have my guesses...
and this is from the Guardian’s online minute by minute report...
’’GOAL! Republic of Ireland 1 - 1 Czech Republic (Koller 64)
All that good work is undone in an instant. My colleagues are in hysterics as O’Shea seemingly stops and waves to his mum in the crowd, while the Czechs play a quick free-kick to Rosicky. Rosicky turned and relayed the ball on to Koller, who held off the challenge of McShane and hit a clinical shot across Henderson and into the bottom corner. To quote Staunton on the touchline: "Oh, for feck’s sake!" ’’
cant be true. can it?
Faith restored a bit now after an all-time low on Saturday.
As was mentioned before, the worry now is whether the performance last night was a kind of "point to prove" one-off performance or can they consistently show that passion that is expected of them? I hope so, I just don't think I could face another lethargic performance from them against San Marino.
Mc Shane is the obvious positive to come out of this but the main thing is that hopefully Stan can see now what the team is capable of if he {shock, horror} plays a central midfielder in central midfield!!!
Yes a lot of positives but it comes down to the same old story again, we're throwing away games that we should be winning and it just smacks of a bit of inexperience and a little lack of self-belief...we have to stop getting moral victories...
I'm surprised at all the optimism after the Czech game. I'm very disappointed myself. Granted it was a far better performance than the Cyprus game (in fairness it couldn't have been any worse) but the game was 100% there for the taking and we threw it away due for the most part to that same tactical naivety that we showed against the Dutch, Germans and Cypriots. Giving the goal away a couple of minutes after we finally got the breakthrough in the manner we did is inexcusable. Would have we conceeded that goal if Charlton, Mc Carthy or even Kerr was in charge? I seriously doubt it.
O'Shea strolling back while the Czech's were taking the free kick like he was out for a walk in the park was a joke. That should be the final nail in the coffin of his Ireland career. Also fat Robbie Keane moaning all match due to the poor service he was receiving and then missing a guilt edged simple chance to win the game was another big negative. Too often again we were too quick to resort to the lumping it up the pitch to our midget forward which Staunton still hasn't realised never seems to get us anywhere.
Another minus was Staunton's substitutions. He doesn't seem to have a clue how to go and win the game and I honestly believe he wanted to play for the draw rather than risking a loss and losing his job. Unfortunately any chance of qualification went out the window due to that negative approach. He took off Andy Reid who was by all accounts our most dangerous player and brought on Alan Quinn who's input was marginal at best. Also Alan O'Brien is not good enough. I don't know how many times I've said this but why Staunton persists with this Newcastle reserve team player I'll never know. All he does is run blindly with his head down.
The worst thing about the result was that it achieved nothing besides allowing that muppet Staunton to keep his job for another few matches. The Czechs and Germans are now 100% certain to qualify after only 3 matches. It's a joke. We'll be fighting for fourth and fifth spot with Wales.
At least McShane looked good and was faultless for the goal IMO.
Lee Carsleys effect on the team and the performance cannot be underestimated. He set the tempo from the off and gave the fans the first cheer of the night with his determined tackle. When the rest of the players witnessed this hunger and the response of the crowd to it, they followed suit. Killer and Douglas went in hard within 5 mins and got huge cheers. Us long suffering fans dont need to see fancy passing football (though it would be nice) to get behing our team. Just an honest effort will do. I fear with the players we have at our disposal we will have to revert to our old way of playing under Jack. This will give us a platform to build on once we start getting results. Its like the whole of Irish soccer has done a 360, and we are back where we started in mid 80s.
Just a note on Kelly. I thought he had a decent enough game, but he nearly got himself in trouble several times due to his unwillingness to use his left foot. He kept turning on to hi right, so clearly he is not happy there. He should have played Finnan on the left as he has experience there.
Robbie Keane, no thanks. A fit elliot and Doyle ANYDAY
My 2 penny's:-
Henderson 7 - Great save to get down to his left from very close range, maybe could have done better for the goal but played well throughout and was a presence.
Finnan 6 - Back to the steady defender he's come to be for us after shocking display in Cyprus. Could have done better going forward.
McShane 9 - The main man in what looked like a solid defense for 89 mins. Future star for Ireland definately.
O'Shea 6 - Was steady enough with McShane alongside him, unforntunately characteristic mistake cost us the equaliser. STAY AWAKE!!!
Kelly 8 - Thought he done very well getting in some well timed challenges in dangerous positions.
Duff 7 - Didn't do too bad, as our most creative player opposing teams makes sure he gets plenty of attention, but still at times showed his quality.
Carsley 8 - Why the hell wasn't this man in Cyprus??! Stan, always pick your best side available. We simply can not afford to be choosey.
Douglas 7 - Plenty of running and energy. Unlucky not to score in first half.
Kilbane 7 - Much better performance from Saturday, although that wouldn't be hard. Great finish for the goal.
Reid 6 - Looked a bit fat to be honest! Glimpses of quality though. Get the slimfast out, put down the pie.
Keane 6 - Plenty of running an effort, bottled it from the keeper in the last minute though on the chance which should have won us the game.
Subs:
Quinn 6 - Not bad, not great
O'Brien 6 - Ditto
Stan 7 - Thought he done well. Made some bold decisions and bought himself a bit more time in the hot seat.
Myself 9 - Eight pints in 2.5 hours.
O'Shea was NOT at fault for the Czech goal. McShane let HIS man turn and score. I am no fan of O'Shea's but I thought he had an excellent game in the middle of the defence. O'Shea's foul was on the touchline. The Czech's took the free kick 15 yards infield and passed directly to Kohler. Whether O'Shea was running back facing the ball or with his back to the ball he wouldn't have been able to do anoything about it. If they had been made take the free from the right place he would have been back in position. Blame where blame is due.
Pleased with McShane's performance but one swallow doesn't make a summer. Let's see how he progresses. Usual knee jerk reactions here. Greatest thing since sliced bread etc etc
Delighted for Kilbane. Devasted that we dropped 3 points that should have been ours. Was not happy going home. 2001 since we last beat a major team at Lansdowne in a competitive game. The 3 points and a kick start to the campaign were there for the taking. Czech's illegal free kick and Robbie's miss at the end - a dagger in my heart.