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the only laughable thing is the lerprechaun army - baying for blood at the end of teh last campaign - not realising just how poor the current crop and how over hyped they are - than fantasising over dreams of Martin O Neill or Guus hIDDINK SAVING THE DAY - TWO CLEVER MEN who wouldnt touch a sinking ship in a million years - no matter what money you offered them
so we end up with stan and the shambles that we witnessed tonight
With Kerr we were in it untill the last match, now we appear to be out after the second.Quote:
Originally Posted by Fivesilver
Kerr's defence was always exceptional.
Cyprus would be delighted to be able to have players in the first team at Man United, Liverpool, Spurs, Newcastle, Celtic etc.Quote:
Originally Posted by Billsthoughts
We may not have a Giles, Brady, McGrath or Keane at the moment, but the idea that our problems are due to our resources is utterly laughable. Plenty of teams have done far better with less talented individuals.
Most of them seem to be on here. :DQuote:
Originally Posted by Dodge
yeah they would be. but seeing as they havent qualified for NOTHING EVER we shouldnt really be taking that much comfort from it.
I have to say I kind of liked Kerr as manager and certainly didnt want him sacked. One problem with him was he didnt include enough Eircom League players, probably afraid to, but he was a million times better than Stan.
Delaney wanted someone who would send the team out with a bit of heart was it :eek: Was that what he was talking about tonight? That was easily worse than anything Kerr did.
Kerr made mistakes and by the end he probably should have held his hands up and not blamed the media but no manager is going to do everything correct, thats football.
I'd have Kerr back in a flash...
Kerr back as manager? No thanks.
Kerr back as President of the FAI, with government & private investment and carte blanche to fundamentally reconstruct all aspects of Irish football? Yes please (sorry JB, not disregarding your personal experience).
I agree with the school of thought that says Kerr never developed a second string of cover that could perform credibly for us when needed, and some of those chickens came home to roost today.
el punter i strongly disagree (as player development is a function of the clubs those players play with, NOT a function of an international manager)Quote:
Originally Posted by el punter
the idea that international teams develop players is fanciful
no i didnt see the game (nowhere to see it where i am), have only read reports so you'll have to forgive me for that. we had a depleted team tonight but it was still a team consisting of 10 premiership players but i just dont understand what this bring back kerr stuff is about. he had a campaign and a half, and while at the moment we do look utterly shambolic, we werent much better under kerr.
we never looked like beating ANY top team ever and i believe his conservatism contributed to our downfall in the last group. our 2 displays against the swiss were the most heartless i had ever seen, it just wasnt working for him a thte end- he had lost the confidence of the players- sure we were incredibly lucky to get a 1-0 in cyprus, we could easily have lost that game-what would the kerr backers have said then?
i believe it was right to let him go at the end of the last campaign but the FAI idiots made the colossal mistake of appointing a man who surely must have failed junior cert english as his replacement.
players need to be motivated-staunton is not capabale of this but the players need to take a good look at themselves now as well.
I'm Willing To Throw My Hat Into The Ring. I'm 17 & Know How To Pick An Irish Squad Unlike Stan. I'm A Well Sought After Manager On Champ Manager My Achievements Include:-scottish 3rd & 2nd Division Champion/ Runner-up Scottish Challenge Cup With Gretna.
-fa Cup Winner With Sheff United
-scottish League Cup Winner(x2)/league Winners(x2)/scottish Cup Winners(x2) With Celtic.
I've Also Won A Couple Of Premierships & Champions Leagues On Fifa With Man Utd.
Well I've Stated My Case If That Doesn't Make Me A Shoe In Pick Alan Curbishley.
I think bringing back Kerr would be stomping over old ground. Let's have someone with pedigree at managing over paid, under achieving senior internationals
International teams are not responsible for developing players, but players develop as international footballers by getting experience representing their country. They play a different type of football against different types of opposition than they do with their club and so need exposure to it to be able to perform competently when needed. Exclusively fielding the best XI in friendly internationals leaves us short of a plan B when one is needed.Quote:
Originally Posted by wws
A little unfair as plenty of players got their debuts under Kerr but frindlies mean so little these days that they'd learn more playing for their clubs than friendlies no one else cares aboutQuote:
Originally Posted by el punter
I think Kerr had the right idea about not blooding too many players in friendlies he just took it too far. I think he used the logic of not trying players who unproven at club level yet which has a certain logic to it.Quote:
Originally Posted by el punter
Staunton on the other hand will bring 16 year kids into the squad & give international debuts to players before they evem make club debuts.
Is it that bad for some people that Kerr actually looks like he did well?
He was better than Staunton, by just simply reverting to hoofball and keeping everyone back - I'll never forget that performance in Israel.
He looks better than Staunton because he has managed at some level. Staunton hasn't. The call for kerr to be sacked was on the basis that we could get a manager that (a) has managed (Stan fails) and (b) try something new with the side (where Kerr failed)
Go back and watch that Switzerland home game to see the future under Kerr and the painful inevitability of the 0-0 draw.
Kerr wanted a club-type professionalism with the national side. He wanted everyone to be drilled on organisation, tactics and all that's expected of them.Quote:
Originally Posted by pete
Our players want regular mini holidays away from their clubs - Stan's giving them that.
Bray in Belfield Friday night, that sh1te tonight- how much misery can one man take??? And the great news is the idiot who gave the job to Staunton, after promising a 'world class manager' now has his hands on the eircom league. Where's me rope? :eek:
Quote:
Originally Posted by d f x-
I'd bite your hand off for a 0-0 in Cyprus if you offered it to me before this game. We were always gonna struggle against these - but the extent of the shambles was the shock
im a total kerr fan - knows what hes about (knows damn well what we have on our hands squad wise - i personally dont rate many of them I have to be honest and just say that as I ve consistently said on this forum that some of them are completely overhyped )
As Stuttgart88 has said somewhere, getting a 'crappy waxy' result tonight would be only fooling ourselves. Bringing Kerr back would be doing likewise. A crappy lucky 0-0 draw or even 0-1 win is of no use 'going forward'.Quote:
Originally Posted by wws
They're something like the tenth worst team in Europe - 0-0 or 0-1 is not good enough.
i would admit that its pretty unlikely a kerr team of the same players would have lost 5-2 to cyprus -we probably would have gotten a 0-0
hey
we lost 5 - 2
THATS THE LEVEL OF OUR CURRENT PLAYERS MINUS THE GREAT MAN SHAY GIVEN TO SAVE THEIR ALL TOo PLAIN TO SEE INEPTITUDE
wake up to the reality of the players we have and what they are really about at this level
Don't you get it?! We're one of the worst teams in europe. What Kerr did was get the players to OVER achieve those 0-0 results. The players have found their rightful level. Look at the spine of the Swiss team and our spine and tell me that man for man they are not 10 times better (Senderos, Vogel, Frei, Yakin) than ours...
yeah but this is cyprus we're talking about here. it was still nearly an all premiership outfit-man for man we're not up to the swiss but bloody hell we should be still able to beat cyprus or at least not leak 5 goals!
Agree, and Kerr did beat them (BTW some of their players play regular champions league)Quote:
Originally Posted by as_i_say
I would tread very carefully around a team that could boast a current CL standard goal scorer - they demand a certain level of respect - its clear the ireland set up and players didnt appreciate just what they were dealing withQuote:
Originally Posted by as_i_say
cyprus for the record also gave a bloody good account of themselves v the aforementioned swiss and french IN cyprus - where they are a totally different proposition to away from home
we needed to be prepared and have done our homework - we clearly went in with the arrogance of "sure its only fcking cyprus"
the gas part was Kerr was co commentator on TV3 - and even from this limited evidence appeared to know more about Cyprus and their players than I guess poor ol stan and laurel did from the evidence of the defending on display
as I say thats the point. we wouldnt have leaked 5 goals if the team was well organised. it wasnt and we did. worse to come on wed. the day you start dismissing 4 nil home defeats as irrelevant cause its a friendly is the day you sow the seeds for shipping 5 goals away to cyprus. Fact is there are a lot of players who play in the premiership. Our ones are drawn from the lower end of the food chain...
yes they are an improved side-i'd compare them with the likes of albania and they definitely deserved respect after what they nearly did to us the last time but i think the manner of the defeat is so shocking. had we lost 1-0 or something i'm not sure it would have been a shock, just a natural progression of the last few results. in general our players are of a higher standard so the whole thing is still quite appaling.
The FAI would look like even bigger gobshítes if they offered the job back to Kerr. He wouldn't take the job anyway after the way he was fúcked about with.
Add Stephen Kenny to that list.Quote:
Originally Posted by backtowalsall
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fivesilver
Luck was not with us in that campaign. One more goal against Israel twice, Switzerland, France and we would have qualified. Fourth wasn't too bad considering the narrow margin between 1st and 4th.Quote:
Originally Posted by joema
So you think losing 5-2 to Cyprus is better than that. Results are the most important thing you worry about. Style of play is a minor detail.Quote:
Originally Posted by d f x-
hmm dunno about the luck thing at all. we were leading 1-0 in israel and went completely defensive-a goal was always on the cards. at 2-0 up at home he brought on kavanagh when keane got injured instead of going for the win. we WERE lucky to win in cyprus.
we could have played for 500 minutes and not scored a goal against the swiss at home when we needed a win. away against the swiss we were just bullied out of it after a good start and were lucky to get a draw.
same thing against france at home-we were never gonna concede that many but again never looked like scoring a goal against france. that for me was the poorest thing about kerr's teams-we never looked like truly beating those teams and had we taken more chances and been more positive we could have put israel away twice.
we mised the boat with bennhakker after the world cup( trinidad coach) - now with poland. top class coach. Klinsmann needs work, and the irish climate being so similiar to the californian one may make him an option.
seriously, would'nt mind seing curbishley - seems like a nice chap - and speaks sense. aldo would be my favorite, would love a houghton, or kevin moran either. i really thought it was a joke when the FAI announced staunton. did the drag through the character profiles of the last 20 years irish squads,and decide on the one with the least spark?
Stephen Kenny. Pride, passion, excellent management- prepararion, man management, tactical nous, GETS THE BEST OUT OF HIS PLAYERS.
How about Don Givens or Dave Bassett?
I've got the perfect canidiate, Delaney.
He's got us into this mess, he must be the one to lead us out of it. He has to know something about the game, right. I mean he is in charge of the Football Association of a country which has so a rich traditionion of football such as ours.
....just like Guus Hiddinks Russia managed at home tonight after going 1 up v Israel at home.Quote:
Originally Posted by as_i_say
#
question : do you think we'd beat Israel tomorrow?
I dont think so.
Hold on a second were all forgetting that Stan has a contract for four years which means the FAI have to pay him his wages in compensation if they sack him.Considering how much the redevelopment of Landsdowne will cost,they just dont have the money.
However i would love Curbishly to get it as he would be an English manager manging Ireland in Croke Park!The GAA would love it!
Givens is part of the problem,not part of the solution.He should be removed from his position as soon as possible.Quote:
Originally Posted by ifk101
Personally I wouldn't mind seeing Joe Kinnear given a go.Failing that it would be nice to appoint a manager with some experience as opposed to one whose previous experience was coaching at a League 1 club.Either that or give Kerr another chance,which I know definately won't happen.
Sven.....
Kerr's tactics with the limited team got us 0-0 draws. We were lucky to escape a defeat against Switzerland at home, Israel at home we went 451 and Israel away well 1-0 up in four minutes and the same for Cyprus....I'll say nothing. We actually played Cyprus off the pitch for 8 minutes under Kerr, looked a good team, got the lead and sat back and he didn't seem to do anything about it. It wasn't luck, it was just about as much as we could get in the group when we were playing so defensively. When the time came for Kerr to do something different at home to Switzerland, he couldn't. He failed. He was better getting results than Staunton, but then Kerr does have some semblance of management - it's an unfair advantage;) Kerr is not the solution - he did better than Staunton, but that wouldn't be hard.Quote:
Originally Posted by DmanDmythDledge
The 'advantage' of this 5-2 defeat is that brings some blinkered eyes to the problem in the country. Read Billy Lord's posts, Stuttgart88 as well - the problem lies much deeper than being able to scrap a 0-0 draw in Cyprus. Cyprus are the tenth worst team in Europe, Cork City beat their champions of the league which many of their players are sourced. There is something seriously seriously wrong if we can't beat them. Playing negatively and scraping a 0-0 draw is not solving the problem, it just looks better than 5-2.
Quote:
Originally Posted by d f x-
i guarantee you dfx that cyprus will pose a threat to one of the big three in our group (in cyprus)
they wont win 5-2 any time again but to dismeiss them as mugs in many ways shows up how ingrained the delusion about our current crop of players is
I'd have okkas and constandinho over ANY irish player of the last 4 years, and that is a fact!