I think thats what been suggested. ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by Macy
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I think thats what been suggested. ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by Macy
Read a book on this - "Truth and Fiction in the Da Vinci Code", which looked at the Bible and what it did and didn't say. There's more Gospels than were included in the Bible, including one - the Coptic Gospel of Thomas - which features Jesus as a kid "withering" everyone who annoys him. Would be a great power! :) But on the Four Gospels we do have, they were all written 100 years or so after Jesus' death, so the stories probably have changed a bit. But back then, when people were largely illiterate, I'd say oral stories would have been well retained, which would mean that a fair bit of what's related did actually happen. (Whether the important bits happened is another story!).Quote:
Originally Posted by pete
Jesus was referred to in some - though not many - Roman writings of the day. There was a census in and around the time he was born (I think it was in 4BC, which is why that's the commonly given year of birth for him). It's reckoned unlikely that the family moved to Bethlehem for the census as it would have been a bit awkward to move the entire country to their fore-fore-fore-father's place of birth just to count people, but then again, the remnants of a similar system exist still in Switzerland.
Also, Jesus is mentioned in the Koran as a prophet who was crucified. I think he then turns into a bird and flies up to Heaven, which is probably a metaphor for his soul rising to Heaven. I mention this to suggest that the different religions mightn't be as different and irreconcilable as you'd think.
(Not pretending I'm an expert here - correct me if needs be)
I think most scientists will agree that we still know nothing about we came into being. They know the mechanics of it - the Big Bang, the birds and the bees and all that - but have no idea about the mechanics of the mechanics. Stephen Hawking - who has done a fair bit of research into the Big Bang - notes that science is usually interested in the immediate aftermath of the Big Bang; the first 0.0000001 seconds or so. He is happy to believe that anything before that is the work of God, which isn't science's business.Quote:
Originally Posted by finlma
That's true. And what's worse is that each side - let's call them George Bush v the extremists - believes they're in the right when they're both quite clearly in the wrong. It's at times like this you hope there is a hell so Bush can spend a while there realising he was wrong. Or do I now go to hell for saying that...?Quote:
Originally Posted by Pete
Religion would say that to ask that question is to look into the mind of God, which we must never do. In other words, who are we to wonder why there's an afterlife? If there is a God, and he has decided to make an afterlife, why question it?Quote:
Originally Posted by Peadar
And that's definitely true. Be nice to each other, concentrate on the now and you'll be grand*.Quote:
Originally Posted by Peadar
* - don't hold it against me if that turns out to be wrong! :p
Well they wouldnt have been cannonised by the Church (i think that what it is called) we have no proof they made it to heaven but because of wat i believe i believe they did, when it comes down to it its just faith in your own religion.Quote:
Originally Posted by Macy
I believe West Ham are better than any other club, now if thats not faith wat is ;)
Thomas' Gospel -which I believe was written in aramaic -is the one referred to in the movie Stigmata where Patricia Arquette (mmm mmm absolutley I would) gets cuts and grazes and starts babbling in tongues.
As a historical document it's said to be at least as credible and probable as a couple of the recognised gospels -but contains some instructions purportedly from Jesus that kind of fcuks up your gameplan if you're setting your stall out as a brokeridge house between man and God -which is pretty much what the Catholic Church -and plenty others to be fair -do.
As all movies do -the play around with the facts considerably -more here
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Originally Posted by Green Army Girl
LOL- totally agree with you there GAG. Hammers/Irons fan myself:D
There are two Gospels of Thomas, just to clarify. One is in aramaic (think you're right on that), the other is in Coptic.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lionel Ritchie
Wouldn't say you'd be on your own there,you'd be in good company with a good few foot.ies :eek: :D (me included:o )Quote:
Originally Posted by sirhamish
We're all doomed, doomed, I say.:DQuote:
Originally Posted by the 12 th man
Ah, I'd settle for a spell in Purgatory since the Pope abolished Limbo last week. At least, with Purgatory, Heaven's the next stop.:D
There's a smoking ban in purgatory though. :DQuote:
Originally Posted by sirhamish
welllll there's this great book (DMT: the spirit molecule) by a u.s. doctor that describes the amazing properties of this naturally occurring molecule which is created in our pineal gland. the mysterious pineal is often referred to as 'the third eye' and was called the 'seat of the soul' by the french philosopher descartes. it's situated right between the left and right halves of the brain and is protected from the brain by a very sophisticated tissue system. melatonin (sleep molecule) is manufactured there. so is di-methyltryptamine
anyway, the first squirt of DMT is released from the pineal gland at roughly 47 days of life, the same time your sex is determined in your mother's womb. the theory proposed by dr. strassman is that this 'seeds' your consciousness, your soul entering your body. the 2nd 'natural' time DMT is released is when you die (these are measurable, known facts). in-between life and death, people might experience near-death situations, night-terror dreams, and other scenarios that may be caused by a leaky pineal: ultra-real situations with profound, often disturbing effects. strassman postulates that schizophrenia might be (in part at least) caused by DMT.
he tested subjects intravenously injected with the molecule and found/recorded amazing results. people experienced shamanistic, out of body, experiences, where they often communicated with 'higher beings' and traveled to different planes of existence, often exhilarating, often terrifying. great book, gives credence to many beliefs, and most convincingly to the hope that the soul has a biological basis.
So we explain a mystery by means of a mystery? I'd rather just stop at the mystery I can see. If something was always around, why not the universe--in which I would include whatever it was that went bang--rather than god?Quote:
Originally Posted by pineapple stu
The one true religion:
http://www.venganza.org
Read up on St. Patrick. He was very real. He left two documents his "Confessions" and his "Letter to Coroticus". There's enugh known about him to paint a decent picture of his life. He was not a Catholic in the conventional sense, it is true.Quote:
Originally Posted by Green Army Girl
As for Christ being mentioned by Romans. Christ is mentioned by only one Roman historian, Tacitus and very briefly. He is also mentioned by the Jewish historian Josephus who was exiled to Rome after the Great Jewish Revolt in 66 AD. There is not one extant directly comtemporary source of Christ. An argument often given to argue against his existence. However there's not one extant contemporary Roman historian who would have recorded him. There is a laughable long list of Romans who never mentioned him however it neglects to mention that many of them contained on the list were poets, playwrights, satirists and biographers of the emperors.
LOL - yep Purgatory for sure then.:DQuote:
Originally Posted by Peadar
Happy Christmas Peadar.;)
nothing.
When you are buried, the maggots and worms eats into you and you become a skeleton. Simple answer. When you are a skeleton, it doesn't matter if you were rich or poor; beautiful or ugly.
All relatives that we know and those we don't all have an excuse for a biiig party and meanwhile, we all rot away in a wooden box (or burn away) and sin é.:)
Maggots, skeletons, Purgatory, no God...............
Jaysus, lads/lassies.......you're depressing the fcuk out of me.
It's Christmas, cheer up will youse.:(
.......Cremation, embalming, funeral directors, wakes, memorial services, ashes, rigor mortis, death, no heaven, no God....:(Quote:
Originally Posted by sirhamish
but happy Christmas anyway Hamish...;) :D
Jaysus, I think some of ye are reading too much into kicking this so called "bucket". Surely this "bucket" can't do that much damage if kicked?:confused::p.
What an awful depressing list:eek:Quote:
Originally Posted by d f x-
And a Happy Christmas to you, amigo.:D
That's just what you believe - I believe they were just good blokes, so I have the right to celebrate their days by getting hammered in the pub. It's what they would've wanted, or so I believe anyway.Quote:
Originally Posted by Green Army Girl
To any non-believer though how can St Patrick be a good bloke? I don’t think he went round healing the sick or feeding the poor. He went round converting people to Christianity. To a non-believer that would be bad wouldn’t it? Unless you’re approaching his contribution from having a snake-phobia?Quote:
Originally Posted by Macy
St. Patrick invented Guinness, Shamrock and leprechauns.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hither green
He's a champion of the Irish tourist industry.
Great bloke, if you ask me!
No, but Irish Tour 434 was a great album.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hither green
Steady on there "Fraser";) ,The Lord said the first shall be last and vice versa...................:cool:Quote:
Originally Posted by sirhamish
We are made out of inanimate atoms, none of which is living or alive,
thus they do not contain you soul, it is elsewhere, so therefore you can never die. What happens to you body is immaterial it is still the same pile of atoms and was never alive in the first place.
Merry Xmas :)
And some of us get a day off every March 17th cos of him. Top man!:).Quote:
Originally Posted by Peadar
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Originally Posted by Peadar
Could have done a better job on that club he founded in Inchicore though.:D
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Originally Posted by the 12 th man
I'm up for that.:D
What happened to the 72 virgins? :D
Sorry Partizan, first come first served.:DQuote:
Originally Posted by Partizan
[QUOTE=tricky_colour]We are made out of inanimate atoms, none of which is living or alive,
thus they do not contain you soul, it is elsewhere,
QUOTE]
Where is this 'elsewhere' of which you speak?
I'll be looking for "an assist" at least on that gag;) s h,btw is it not "first served first come" regarding the virgins:DQuote:
Originally Posted by sirhamish
Not sure if it has been said already but I read at the start about how can you explain the universe? Its far easier to state something and believe than say its not true. I can't prove that there isn't a planet of walking chocolate bars but its highly improbable. Likewise when you die, I personally would be surprised if a heaven in the way we talk of existed. I am open to surprise but its as cocky to suggest the universe was made for us as is it for someone to say a forest was made for the ants.
Your into the issue of do we have a soul. If you have an entire body transplant, one bit at a time and the only remaining original part was your brain, would you still be the same personality etc? Probably yes bar the emotional trauma of having a body transplant :)
I've always believed in An afterlife butwhat I could never work out was if its supposed to be a utopian paradise how can you have everthing you ever wanted if the people you leave behind are not there i for one know that I could not enjoy "Heaven" without my mother and my Daughter
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Originally Posted by Macy
Dont Beleive in saints and such like
I Think Paddy's day should be renamed Ireland Day like they Have Austrailia Day coz at the end of the day its a celebration of our Irishness and not really a religious celebration ie do you go to mass on paddy's day
Great let's all become cultureless drones like the Australians and Americans.Quote:
Originally Posted by Block G Raptor
Personally I don't go to mass on St Pats, but I know lots of people who celebrate it by taking a break from their Lenten abstinence.
..or could we just settle for tarring a huge amount of people with a very very big brush..Quote:
Originally Posted by Hither green
It's a bit harsh but... oh go on then... only if we can feather them too.Quote:
Originally Posted by ken foree