Robbie Horgan on the brink

Seems it is all the teams fault as it goes.
Robbies thoughts on Cockhill Celtic game from a Drogs press release.

“The major problem with the team at the moment is the concession of soft goals. We set ourselves up on Monday with a 4-1-4-1 formation to give ourselves protection but we knew that we would create opportunities. Everyone knew the jobs that they had to do and when you concede a goal after five minutes it certainly doesn’t help the situation. We did say that if Pat’s score early that nothing will change and we will keep our shape and discipline but that bit didn’t happen. We have had two rescheduled games put in as midweek fixtures which hasn’t helped us in any way but it is the manner of how we are getting beat rather than being beaten that is the most concerning aspect of all. Everyone needs to step up the plate now and be counted'.
Now please tell me WHERE in that are any thoughts on Cockhill Celtic.

Everybody had to step up to the plate and be counted about ten games ago.

Fair enough points there. Manager's often reflect on their previous game in the preview of the next one. And if players aren't putting the effort in they should be called on it.

Our manager is very rarely happy with our players and there's not a word about it :)

Also maybe he couldn't say Cockhill without sniggering.

On an only very slightly related topic, I played for Cockhill against Muff while at school.

And I'm glad to say we humped them.

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Originally Posted by KeepersBall

Seems it is all the teams fault as it goes.
Now please tell me WHERE in that are any thoughts on Cockhill Celtic.

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He's hardly throwing the team under the bus. I think he should be way more direct about how dire they have been.

And that's some ridiculous selective quoting from you. Here are his thoughts on the forthcoming game (the very next paragraph on from the one you quoted!) -

“I am relived that we can put the league to one side for the week but that doesn’t mean that we will be showing anything less than absolute respect for the FAI Cup. We are not in a position to underestimate any side at the moment and we know how good Cockhill Celtic can be. We will have to work hard for the win, as it will be like a Cup final for them. I know the manager and the goalkeeper have played for Finn Harps, and that they have a good record in the Ulster Senior League. We have our work cut out for ourselves but a positive result is a must.
“In a Cup competition, you are always looking for a home draw and we’ve got that. Certainly Cockhill Celtic could prove to be a banana skin for us but it is a knockout competition and anything can happen. It isn’t ideal to be playing a side that you aren’t entirely familiar with, I know what style of play they use but not enough as I would like on their personnel. Once we are professional and disciplined, we should have enough to progress.”
- See more at: http://droghedaunited.ie/fixtures/ev....rWYekFvt.dpuf

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Originally Posted by Mr A

Also maybe he couldn't say Cockhill without sniggering.

On an only very slightly related topic, I played for Cockhill against Muff while at school.

And I'm glad to say we humped them.

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Nonsense. I was at that game and Muff was on top for the whole 90 minutes.

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Originally Posted by Acer

“We will have to work hard for the win, as it will be like a Cup final for them."

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I really hate it when managers come out with such condescending rubbish.

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Originally Posted by White Horse

I really hate it when managers come out with such condescending rubbish.

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Yes, it's a really bad stock quote rolled out by managers in games like this. It's particularly bad in this case when it's like a cup final for us such is the importance of winning the game.

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Originally Posted by Straightstory

Whatever about the circumstances of his leaving the club and the Athlone slump, Cooke did incredibly well at Drogheda. To finish second in the league and reach several cup finals is pretty impressive considering the club's meagre resources. Mick leaving the cub has proved both disastrous for the team and him personally.
Since Horgan has obviously lost the dressing room and the board want him to resign, it's pretty 'bullish' of him to want to stay on. Must be an extremely uncomfortable situation for everybody.

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Personally speaking when I am at a party and not welcome I would wait until I was asked to leave. I would also get my contract paid in full to.

Why haven't clubs learned to put in performance criteria and minimum expectations in to contacts in they need to terminate

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Originally Posted by jinxy lilywhite

Personally speaking when I am at a party and not welcome I would wait until I was asked to leave. I would also get my contract paid in full to.

Why haven't clubs learned to put in performance criteria and minimum expectations in to contacts in they need to terminate

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The more conditions you put in the more you have to raise the terms to balance it. You might get lucky and be able to cancel a contract early, but equally you might end up paying more than you needed to.

I see Eric Foley has left Drogheda United.

http://www.droghedaunited.ie/news/po...ed-by-drogheda

Is this a blow? (i.e is he any good?)

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Originally Posted by Mr A

Is this a blow? (i.e is he any good?)

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From what I've seen of him he has some quality and is good at free kicks. Drogheda fans I've spoken to say that he wasn't putting it in. A lot will depend on who Horgan will bring in.

Super striker of the ball on his day. Awful attitude! Carrys a fantastic chip.

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Originally Posted by White Horse

. Drogheda fans I've spoken to say that he wasn't putting it in.

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He is not alone.

Foley could strike a decent free kick but lacked the physical presence to impose himself on a game and often went missing. He's also a bad character to have in the dressing room by all accounts so not disappointed to see him go. We'll need to replace him though because the squad is already low on numbers.

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Originally Posted by White Horse

he has some quality and is good at free kicks. Drogheda fans I've spoken to say that he wasn't putting it in.

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That sums it up.

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Originally Posted by Ezeikial

He is not alone.

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That sums it up.

Was chatting to an old work colleague from Drogheda this morning and he is a very worried chap! He is a life long Drog supporter whose Dad was on the Board during the 90's and he is of the opinion that it will be a task to get the club to the end of the season with the collapse in attendences and more significantly goodwill toward the club(contributing club members starting to hold on to their regular donations) and with wafer thin margins in the budget as it stands. He thinks at this stage the club could probably fulfill the remainder of the seasons commitments but at a loss that means having to go to an amateur set-up in the near future. Maybe at this stage the cost of change could be cheaper in the long run? If Athlone pick up a few more points and automatic relegation starts to become real for Drogheda things could really unravel. Never thought i'd say this but a Collin's rallying 'lifes a battle' type speech may be what Drogheda need now, rather than Horgan hanging in there for the payday which fans obviously dont want to pay in to!

This chap detests Dundalk so for him to admit the above to a Dundalk fan who he dished out plenty of abuse to '06/'07ish shows his sense of despair at the whole situation

But there's not really anything too new there. It's been touch and go for the club since 2009, I don't think too many were not 'admitting' that, it has been obvious. After relegation in 2010, the plan for 2011 was for a 'non-competitive' 1st division budget at best, the question was asked to keep going at all. Sporting Fingal's last minute exit meant a quick change of direction and Mike Cook was drafted in on short notice for a Premier division fire fight.

The league run in 2012 followed by Cup Finals & a Euro game in 2013 kept things moving but there is nothing too sudden about the overall situation, the current position just highlights how critical things are when relying on the bare minimum (and the fact that that is probably not enough).

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Originally Posted by Nesta99

who he dished out plenty of abuse to '06/'07ish shows his sense of despair at the whole situation

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06/'07ish? Part-timer, why wasn't he dishing out abuse from 02 - 08? (and a few times since)?

06/'07ish? Part-timer, why wasn't he dishing out abuse from 02 - 08? (and a few times since)?

Oh he did, he just became very vocal when the League was on the board. Went to the Start match with him which gave me a reprieve for a while (i did feel just a tiny bit sorry for Graham Gartland, just a tiny bit then I laughed, at least he made some amends against Kiev though even he it just teased the Drog faithful). Anyhow, I knew things were tight but just because SF's demise gave a stay of execution and the subsequent r-up and cup finals shouldnt have caused a splash the cash attitude, in relative terms - stating the obvious I know. Even with a small budget I cant imagine Horgan is on so much that an affordable agreement to part ways cant be managed even leaving him with the pro licence course. He cant be on that much can he? Cooke left by some accounts 'cause the club didnt match his ambition and wouldnt let him spend, but then they still gambled with the club by appointing a rookie manager without a performance related 'get out' agreement. Do Athlone have more money than Drogheda considering their start to the league or did Cooke do the honourable thing and walk whereas Horgan is pure mercenery and sqeezing money the club dont have for as long as he can and possibly pushing them out of existance. Where is Mr Drogheda United Hoey to the rescue?

I don't have insider info, but as far as I know, breaking even was achieved in 2012. Losing the 3 Cup Finals was probably the difference between breaking even and a loss in 2013.

There hasn't been a splash the cash approach; in 2013 the budget was increased, but nothing major. It was reduced back down again this year I suspect.

There certainly has been a mentality not to go into debt in the last few years. The problem now would seem to be how early this season the gates have crashed, with no sign of any chance of them picking up again. It's hard to see how that's not going to leave a big hole in the accounts by the end of the year. There is an over reliance on away attendances coming into UP already without losing more from the home gate.
That's the point, it’s always been very tight, but the current circumstance is just highlighting that, and pushing it to the edge.

On appointing a rookie manager, I presume they thought there was something about Robbie been assistant manager the last few years that he could make the step up, maybe it was just to prevent the squad following Cooke to Athlone?

With the 2010-11 'six' managers in a calendar year & the Mick Cooke row, it’s fair to say that overall the manager's position is not something that has gone particularly well since examinership.

Again though, and the age old problem throughout the league, the budget was set on ifs and buts. A gamble on crowds staying at level x even though an untried manager was at the helm? Doesnt fit with the prudence of prior seasons. That aside so many of the basics on the team side of things are off, like fitness levels, motivation in a derby match, game 1 excluded. O'Brien would get much more from the squad.

Just a note on Vincent Hoey. Sadly he's not in the best of health right now.

The fans are voting with their feet,losing in Athlone would be accepted by many if it hastened Horgans exit

Why is Horgan considered a mercenary for getting what is in accordance with his contact.
Football management and the civil service must be the only occupation were people aren't judged on their overall performance.
Drogheda offered him the contract and the wage and the terms and conditions. If they realise that they made a bad appointment half way through the season with no terms and conditions to get out of the contract then fault lies entirely with the board.
If drogs go under its not horgans fault either it's purely the board

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Originally Posted by Nesta99

Again though, and the age old problem throughout the league, the budget was set on ifs and buts. A gamble on crowds staying at level x even though an untried manager was at the helm? Doesnt fit with the prudence of prior seasons. That aside so many of the basics on the team side of things are off, like fitness levels, motivation in a derby match, game 1 excluded. O'Brien would get much more from the squad.

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Are you suggesting Fabio would make a good gaffer?

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Originally Posted by Ezeikial

Are you suggesting Fabio would make a good gaffer?

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Well I dont know if he would or not, I am suggesting that he would do better than Horgan currently and is already on the payroll. I wouldnt be surprised if he is undermining management either, let him pick up the baton!

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Originally Posted by jinxy lilywhite

Why is Horgan considered a mercenary for getting what is in accordance with his contact.

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Who said he was a mercenary? He a had a run of something like 9 defeats in 10 league games, with numerous one-sided score lines & performances; the expectation among fans was he would resign on the back of that, he didn't. For the moment he is seeing out his contract until he or the board otherwise decide to take an action.

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Originally Posted by Nesta99

Again though, and the age old problem throughout the league, the budget was set on ifs and buts. A gamble on crowds staying at level x even though an untried manager was at the helm?

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True, but you have a pick base figure x to work from for a budget, all seasons have ifs & buts. Taking numbers from this site, in very simplistic terms a figure of 750 might seem reasonable, looking at the last 4 seasons:

Drogheda - 1,189 (817; 977; 811; 859; 1,106)

This year's average figure will drop quickly, it was boosted by the good opening few games. The Bohs & Limerick home attendances were well below 750, with half the season still to run and results getting worse.

Is it true that the fitness coach has been sacked? I heard there were a couple of backroom staff let go.

The lad who told me didn't know why. Could be a budgetary measure, although Drogheda do appear less fitter team than in recent seasons.

Wasn't the previous firness coach the son of the journo who had a go at the the Chairman?

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Originally Posted by White Horse

Is it true that the fitness coach has been sacked? I heard there were a couple of backroom staff let go.

The lad who told me didn't know why. Could be a budgetary measure, although Drogheda do appear less fitter team than in recent seasons.

Wasn't the previous firness coach the son of the journo who had a go at the the Chairman?

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2 members of staff let go as part of a backroom shakeup. I've heard there will be more changes too, with the aim of surrounding Horgan with more experience.

On the finances/crowds, there really is nothing new here. We're operating on a shoestring, have been for years and will continue to do so for years unless an approach is made for the club by a group with a solid financial & sporting plan. We can't afford to surrender ourselves to another consortium offering a fastfix only to go bust down the line. At the moment, we're a product of our past experiences and complete stringency will always be priority number one.

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Originally Posted by Acer

consortium offering a fastfix .

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fastfix? just like dundalk?Attachment 2113

None of this is new information. Budgets aren't going tits up either. We have been operating on and surviving by tight financial control for years now. The drop off in crowds happened every single year and every year this false debate is drummed up again and again. Any changes currently are because of poor on the field performances.

Unfortunately there will always be those who revel in drama of it all. A number of people get more pleasure from the soap opera than the sport. Thats another thing that will never change.

Im still not going to accept this shoestring line at face value. Either a club can afford payed management and staff, I presume Drogheda have a couple of off field employees - or they cant; shoestring budgets wouldnt be so shoestring if these are luxuries that are not affordable were not indulged. Everybodies basline should be on a rubbish season too. Sligo have feck all to play for for the remainder of the season if European qualification is considered poor return, if their budget projections are too high as a result its likely they have some wriggle room based on the number of years sustained success, as Drogheda are unlikely to have that buffer zone as it stands, shouldnt be planning on such tight margins. As for the fastfix poke - i was beaten to the I see what you did there, but absolutely there is probably a little but of every Dundalk fans thoughts on what if that input goes sour? I dont know the people from fastfix or what their financial contribution is to the club currently with significantly improved gates and other income streams. Match programmes are selling out its seems which now means its not subsidised by the club for example. So there is that room for financial movement if budgets need to be adjusted down for whatever reason. So far though fastfix are bring a level of sustainability about, right down to one of the fastfix guys challanging supporters letting off flares due to the few hundred Euro fine each time it happens, there was no whimsical 'sure whats a few hundred quid' attitude. Money is saved where it can to be spent where its needed, including the away section which is a higher priority to the board than it is to the average Dundalk fan tbh.

Match programmes were subsidised? WTF?

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Originally Posted by Mr A

Match programmes were subsidised? WTF?

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Guessing he means they're selling out, meaning the club aren't losing money on them.

If the Harps programme can turn a profit I'd be staggered if the Dundalk one was costing them money in recent years. Maybe there's an accounting thing there- none of the ads count towards programme revenue or something.

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Originally Posted by Mr A

If the Harps programme can turn a profit I'd be staggered if the Dundalk one was costing them money in recent years. Maybe there's an accounting thing there- none of the ads count towards programme revenue or something.

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Probably worked out pretty expensive in Dundalk after they paid the royalties to Queen for printing the lyrics.

Every club here is allowed one eccentric right?? Well Dell is ours for today k ;)

Subsidised, losses covered or whatever - the print quality, amount of content at €3 wouldt cover costs and not filled with advertisments, unless they were nearly all sold then printing costs wouldnt be covered by programme sales hence the shortfall had to be covered. Increased sales less or no loss...

Players doing their best for him again tonight I see. 3-0 down to Athlone.

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Originally Posted by Longfordian

Players doing their best for him again tonight I see. 3-0 down to Athlone.

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You forgot the tip and VAT.
Do's well known Drog agitator Windymill Warrior not come on this site anymore ?

Robbie Horgan is up there with Sean McCaffrey as the worst ever manager in the LOI.

It's amazing how he is still in a job.