Heard this morning there's an article about this in today's Times, anyone got it to post here?
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Heard this morning there's an article about this in today's Times, anyone got it to post here?
Right click on the link and click "save target as...". Use Windows Picture Viewer (or any other program) to zoom and read the text.
http://homepage.eircom.net/~gearoidw01/houghton.jpg
Yellow card for soccer hero Houghton after ITV own-goal
Former Irish soccer star Ray Houghton was last night given a vote of confidence by RTÉ despite his controversial appearance on ITV's Fantasy Football show on Sunday night.
The former Liverpool and Aston Villa star's involvement in the satirical sketch has been criticised by Irish interest groups in the UK and by fans for stereotyping Irish people as leprechauns and terrorists.
Houghton is a regular panellist and commentator for RTÉ Sport and is currently working for the national broadcaster during Euro 2004 in Portugal.
The ITV show, which is presented by comic duo Frank Skinner and David Baddiel, re-created Houghton's famous goal against England during the 1988 European Championships in Stuttgart.
When Houghton, who was born in Scotland, was asked if he considered himself to be "really Irish", he was shown dressed up as a leprechaun, a potato and as a Jean Butler lookalike.
However, most complaints arose when Houghton was seen standing beside what appeared to be a paramilitary gunman dressed in a khaki army jacket and a balaclava.
The Irish soccer hero, best remembered for his goals against England and against Italy in the 1994 World Cup, was also shown standing beside Baddiel when the comic impersonated Shane McGowan clutching a bottle of whiskey.
An RTÉ spokesman told The Irish Times: "There is no question over Ray's position in relation to his appearance on the ITV show. I'm not sure how many here saw the sketch, but Ray will be fulfilling his Euro 2004 duties as planned."
The British television watchdog, Ofcom, confirmed yesterday that numerous complaints had been made to it about the sketch and that it was investigating the matter.
However, as of last night ITV said it had not been contacted by Ofcom in relation to the sketch, and would act only if and when such contact was made.
Ms Eithne Rynne, of the London-based Federation of Irish Societies, said: "Sketches such as these set the Irish community in Britain back. It is disgraceful the way Irish people are lumped in stereotypes like leprechauns, Riverdance and a gunman. It is disappointing, particularly in this day and age, that Irish people still experience such portrayal."
Houghton, who made 73 appearances for the Republic of Ireland, last night refused to comment about the controversial sketch, which was broadcast last Sunday night.
Sorry I've got to take a stand on this! My brother has just completed his History A Level which includes a modual on Northern Ireland. He was taught how Tyrone is "the accursed county", the Irish never negotiate and always use violence and how the Republicans disagree with the good-friday agreemant. He was all about IRA terrorism and hardly any about UDA/UDF/UDV, they never even mentioned Bobby Sands......a load of rubbishQuote:
Originally Posted by Macy
never see the film "Darby o Kill "n the little peeple?Quote:
Originally Posted by tricky_colour
Kudos to the British Educational System for remaining as impartial and objective as a Rupert Murdoch produced news show. :(Quote:
Originally Posted by liam88
PP was having a look on my favourite comedy website OUR WEE C**T TREE when in with all the kissing of army groupie's ass, i seen them talking about this very subject and yer name turned up. Old mad dog, aka dog breath was talking jazz with all the other lovely old lady's about it and chucked in that he had read yer post's. He also said it was a shame that their new hated enemy Dermot O'Leary was not on that show.Quote:
Originally Posted by Plastic Paddy
Never seen the show because i was over in Ireland, chilling out in a bar in Fermanagh that night,but If B&S are going to do a send up of classic Irish goal's that make all the lovely old lady's on OWM laugh so much why stop there, why not also do a send up of the only time we got to a major championship with the deciding game being in Ireland when Alan Mac scored @ parc an Windsor. I'm all for it. :rolleyes:
I'd not been across before to see OWC as I couldn't be arsed, tbh, but had to go and take a look to see my name in print (oh, the vanity...) Calling us "Brits" though? That's a great one. I bet he wrote that all by himself. Arsehole.Quote:
Originally Posted by sylvo
We obviously get right under their skins. Good to see the "siege mentality" is still alive and well in Olde Alsturr.
**** them. :)
Ahh, lovely Fermanagh, the county of the lakes. Shame they didn't extend to cover such lovely "wee" towns as Ballinamallard or Maguiresbridge though. Satsuma, anyone? ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by sylvo
You bring back great memories there Sylv. I was watching the game in the Dubliner pub on Digbeth in Birmingham and had sloped off for a p*ss when I heard the pub go up. I near lost half me lad in the hurry to zip up so I could get out and see what had happened! :D All of Wunzurr in silence and the Greens off to the US of A. Oh happy days...
:D PP
Quote:
Originally Posted by Plastic Paddy
PP Was driving through Ballinamallard the other day funny enough, noticed there was no people to be seen on the street's @ all, it was like something out of 28 day's later,they must have been on OWM kissing army groupie's ass, don't no how the local's round that way cope with wanting to go down to the corner for a pint of the devil's buttermilk cause i noticed not one shebeen, maybe old dog breath could clear that mystery up for us. Not saying the Hilda's and Dorothy's on our wee mind's are paranoid, but they do have a thread so people can report back if anyone's dissing them :D , i guess old dog breath could clear that one up for us as well .
PP i'm all for doing a fantasy football recreation of those four goal's we scored against them @ parc an windsor along with John Aldridge's salute to the main stand.
The only thing this shows is that Ray Houghton has no self respect and must be seriosuly short on cash - it's a pity to he a once half-great Liverpool and Ireland player prostituting himself like that, couldn't he do the decent thing and just become an alcoholic or pen a tawdry autobiography.Quote:
Originally Posted by NeilMcD
Though the potato costume is hilarious, I think I will go out an buy one.
BTW for you lovers of everything leprechaun related, here is a web cam link - it keeps the kids quiet :D
http://www.irelandseye.com/leprechaun/webcam.htm
thats because we, like the Germans vis-a-vis the war, are "European" and so are fair game for English jingoistic jokes. Also lots of groups like the "British Association of Moslems" made official complaints, generally us Irish (as groups) tend ignore such things as we can see it is most often morons who make the jokes. At the end of the day I live in England, most English people dont take the p*ss, the ones that do have a collective IQ that barley reaches double figures. Personally I think that if I make a huge song and dance about it, I might just come across as a complaining so and so (not that im saying people who complain are).Quote:
Originally Posted by finlma
I dont find it a big issue, I cant remember seeing something like it on TV for a while so I dont think its widespread in the media. Ive rarely kopped any flack for wearing my Ireland shirt, the worst I got was when a gang of Pakistani's spat at me near Neasden, but I can hardly blame all the English people or media for that anyway.
Anyway I think B&S's idea is flawed, I havent studied the troubles much (we did it a tiny bit at school but it was mainly pre-20s (and actually pretty balanced from what I remember) and squeezed in between History of Medicine and Elizabeth I; and in my degree modules I picked the Soviet - Afghan War and the Portuguese in Africa instead of things like "the Troubles" and Vietnam). From what little I know, the most famous Southerner associated with the IRA is Sean O'Callaghan, who was an informer on them anyway. My view, and the impression I get from other Southerners my age is a lot of people in the South arent really that excited about the North or the IRA.
Maybe an Irish satirist will do Baddiel dressed up as a skullcapped greedy shyster with a sweatshop, or a hook nosed porn producer exploiting 'Aryan' women or an Israeli soldier shooting an unarmed baby. As for the English and terrorism? They practically invented the art. :rolleyes:Quote:
Originally Posted by wws
Personally the most offensive thing about this show was that it was commisioned in the first place. It's unadulterated sh*te. I last watched it after the Tans - France game and even without their smugness the two muppets were atrocious. How anyone can find it remotely funny is in itself laughable. Bo Selecta's take on them a couple of weeks ago was spot on, with Baddiel (dressed up as an Orthodox Jew) begging the butt-faced Skinner to call him a Jew to make people laugh. Skinner obliges and the audience - equally as pathetic - laugh hysterically, as Baddiel declares in a mock Yiddisher accent: 'We are very funny mens (sic.)'
Or calling all C0ckneys, w@nkers, even though probably the only ones you've met have been either on a dust-up at Euston station or in the Rovers Return. Are you a script writer for Coronation street? If I was a c0ckney I'd be pretty miffed at the stereotyping going on that pile of cr*p at the moment.Quote:
Originally Posted by Macy
Tranquilo PP. It's because they think we won the lottery of life and threw away the ticket. Or just jealous that we have what they long for: Being born in Britain. :DQuote:
Originally Posted by Plastic Paddy
You forgot the other tag: 'The humour by-pass brigade.' I mean these people are far more thick skinned than us aren't they? It takes a lot to get them offended, like spelling the title of Britain's highest paid scrounger with a lowercase 'q' (one pathetic discredited inbred (copyright Davros) whined to a 'beggar' who did the unthinkable: Do you hate us that much?) or that we call our country 'Ireland'. In fact they are so hard to offend, they even have a section devoted to being offended on their website dedicated to FIFA's lowest rated regional team. I like the tw*t, proving what a load of pea-brained bigots they are, bringing up Skinner's religion into the equation (Note the refusal to accept from GAA apologists the similar argument that a past Protestant president means the broken glass spreaders are non-sectarian). Congratulations PP you've joined their moan list. Just upset no one asked for me. :(
Unsurprisingly, my old chum Dog Breath started the thread. Despite his protests that he's not interested in us he spends an alarming amount of time looking at this site. Hey Dog Sh*te, why don't you come on in? What: worried after the Army Groupie's poor showing that you'd end up going home with your sphincter in a articulated lorry? Ahh well, I did try! No doubt you'll be sending on Research Girl to do your fighting. I saw Pulp Fiction the other week for the first time and I can't say the gimp reminded me much of Davros but guess who Marsellus Wallace (the black bloke at the end of the red neck's penis) reminded me of. You've got it! Your good mate JohnB when he was on in January, until his own Butch Coolidge - played by Duncan Gardner instead of Bruce Willis - came along and ended his torture by getting the thread shut down. Happy days!!! :D
Quote:
Originally Posted by davros
I don't qustion that, by the look's of some of the flag's in the stadio del la luz when the scum were playing, that's were they've gone off to :rolleyes: . I like to hear your conversation's with the Linfield fan's you met, i'd say that would be interesting, can't say i've got a problem about Linfield, after all they're an Irish team :D, as for the double finger salute to the railway end do they have people in that stand, i thought thought nobody was in that stand, but still it's been a long time since i've seen a puppet state match on telly, i tend to only take an interest in team's inside the top 100 in the fifa world ranking's. :p
Better stop that goose stepping around Wembley park station and pointing yer right finger tip's out of yer front window to all the thousand's in Nurumberg Hempsted there herr Lopez, cause Conor's got yer sussed, and shave that fcuking tash will yer.Quote:
Originally Posted by Conor74
Well spotted. You win the cuddly bear, Conor.Quote:
Originally Posted by Conor74
How many 'terrorists' - people who have used weopans/explosives against unarmed civilians - has Ireland produced. As a guess a lot less than the 3,000 tans that were banned from going to Portugal. Stereotyping is stereotyping. The shock statement above - which I'm glad offended - that you picked up on was intended to highlight where steroetyping has eventually lead. Skinner wouldn't have known this the eejit, but Baddiel has no excuse.
Quite understand the pointlessness of looking at the Occupied Without Consent site as it has rapidly become the internets version of a particularly bad edition of Saint and Greavies, you know all matey jocularity without the humour, followed by a short ill informed serious debate, fairly dull now days.Quote:
Originally Posted by Plastic Paddy
However, PP, I must admit that I did have a quick look at the site to see your name in print (any chance of an autograph?) and what a suprise they all think that crass streotyping of Irish people is hilarious. Still what else did anyone expect of supporters of an artifically constructed geographic area that needed discrimination against Irish people to make the 'state' work, sadly it would seem that its their mentality.
BTW your right Fermanagh is Ireland's county of lakes not Cavan as they are currently claiming, eh Sylvo? (and when we perfect the rules of underwater Gaelic Football you watch the Ulster titles and All Ireland's role in. :) )
I always refer to the party as the 'blueshirts' but I think it's a bit cruel with irony. Just wondered why they didn't change the name as it was printed above the Fitzgerald saltire on O'Duffy's shirt in photos for prosperity. My old man remembers them as a boy in Kildare. He thought they were some sort of circus come to town. :DQuote:
Originally Posted by Conor74
Hey show some respectos to Cavan, cause i'm sure old dog breath and army groupie will also get p***ed off by you dissing one of Ulster's county's.Quote:
Originally Posted by Pat O' Banton
What's wrong with our wee website or whatever it's called i think it's great, they all get on nicely with one another by the look's of thing's when Marty talk's they all jump up and agree in unision, great stuff, only down side for them is the obbsession with with these bloke's they call begger's, who go around stealing their player's, their fan's. What i want to know is who are these bloke's and where are they taking them after they steal them. Anyway i think it's a great laugh, the boycotting Carlsberg cause of the Cas ad, and giving out about mastercard was great stuff. :D :D
Check out the Bubble Cypriot Homie from Palmers Green that's walked onto the site (could this be Davros yet again?). He mentions the Northern b*stard state except he's talking about the Captain Kirks on his island not ourweecountry (sic.). :DQuote:
Originally Posted by sylvo
No doubt Turkish flags appearing in the Sandy Row as we speak :DQuote:
Originally Posted by lopez
Its all in good fun. Sending letters to the paper is a right waste of time. Very funny it was. They do the same kinda stereotyping for every country, especially the germans.Big deal.
The point is that Irish people have suffered from negative streotyping in Britain for hundreds of years as exemplified by Punch catoons, the likes of Jim Davidson or extreme articles in a cross section of newspapers. For years irish people kept their heads down and almost hoped that it would blow over, well the sad thing is that it hasn't, its not just this piece, but also articles like Julie Burchill's infamous one in the Guardian last year that labeled the Irish Nazi sympathising, child abusers. It is the right of Irish people to live in this country (or any other country for that matter) without having to put up with this nonsense.Quote:
Originally Posted by mickrev
Ultimately I doubt if anyone would go on TV (or print for that matter) with such rubbish about black people or Asians because through the years they have stood up for themselves, fair play to them, its about time Irish people did the same.
With respect Mick, it is a big deal to us Irish who live in Britain. As a minority community living in another country, we have suffered to assert ourselves and our rights for generations as Pat so rightly points out. The sort of crap that B&S came out with only serves to undermine our cause.Quote:
Originally Posted by mickrev
FWIW, I totally disagree that it's a waste of time writing to the papers. To ignore such jibes makes us complicit in their performance. If we don't speak, we give the likes of B&S carte blanche to repeat such slurs on our names. To do nothing is not an option.
:) PP
Are you a graduate Mick? Well if the Irish just sat around twiddling our thumbs in the seventies and eighties your degree would get you a job as a roaddigger in Britain on your inevitable march to emigration back then. It's not that using terrorists/freedom fighters in a comedy sketch isn't funny - look at Kielty and the hole in the wall gang - it's the context. I'd give them the benefit of the doubt if they were otherwise hilarious. They're not. I take it it's a no about the degree because only the double digit IQ holders find these two c*nts amusing on any given subject.Quote:
Originally Posted by mickrev
who bloody cares. I hate agreeing with anything written in the rag, but there was an excellent comment on it in todays sun:
"f'goodness sake folks. That was no different to what hundreds of Irish fans did in 2002.There were leprachauns.....everywhere Ireland played at the World Cup finals in Japan and Korea. Nobody said they were a disgrace. Au contraire, they were described as great craic."
gets it spot on IMO. I don't remember the same fuss when another irish player dressed up for a crisps ad
well, it would be a hell of a disguise :DQuote:
Originally Posted by tricky_colour
Wonder what The Scum (let alone ourweeminds) would have said if they saw a number of Irish fans in Japan dressed up as Seamus O'Semtex with balaclavas and army surplas, which if you've been reading the thread is the main gripe. Couldn't give a f*ck about leprechauns, Irish dancers, spuds or even Viagra pills ffs.Quote:
Originally Posted by Éanna
If you're going to reply at least read the thread. No-one is complaining about the leprechaun jibe, it's the dressing up as a terrorist that people are p*ssed off about. If you're Irish living in England I think you'd understand what we're talking about.Quote:
Originally Posted by Éanna
Yous play this card far too oftenQuote:
Originally Posted by finlma
Meaning?Quote:
Originally Posted by Beavis
What I have noticed from this thread is that it is those who are living in Britain who are far more likely to take offence at negative Irish streotyping then those who live in Ireland.
I feel that this is probably because Irish people living in Britain are for more likely to see anti-Irish rascism or be directly affected by it, so when those who live on the other side of the Irish sea feel that things like this are inconsequential many of us feel the need to challange this assumption. (this is not a slight against anyone)
On a positive note (already noted on this website in other areas) anti Irish discrimation in England and Wales seems to be on the wane, however this is no reason to protest if we see discrimination, negative streotyping, or offensive comments being made about the people from our nation.
i dont think that this is a card that anyone would want to ''play'' :mad:Quote:
Originally Posted by Beavis
finlma is just saying what he see's eveyday... wouldnt be much diffrent to what either myself or others living here have experanced recently
"Play this card"? :confused:Quote:
Originally Posted by Beavis
That's because being Irish in another land, specifically England, is an inescapable factor in all of this. Try it. I give you three months before you see why we make such an issue of it.
:ball: PP
Welcome back to the board Pat. Once again, a thoughtful, incisive and eloquent view that I wholeheartedly agree with. :)Quote:
Originally Posted by Pat O' Banton
:D PP
Ever been called a thick Irish b*stard by one of your teachers, Beavis? Was your father ever been threatened with the sack after an IRA bombing because some mischievous colleague put it about that he was a chucky? No?! Well don't f*cking lecture me about playing 'cards'!Quote:
Originally Posted by Beavis
Anti Irish racism by the media is nowhere at all near the level's of the 70's and 80's, even our dealing's as a community with mr pole eeece man is a lot better these day's. Their a lot more interested in causing problem's for the asian community with their friendly stop and search tatic's then standing outside Irish pub's and club's with twenty odd pole eeece van's ready to give yer a taxi and b&b for the night which is what it used to be like.
But scratch the surface and it has'nt fully gone away just like it will not be forgotten by us you had to stand up to people that tried to make life tough in workplace's etc by c**ts who took their dislike for all thing's Irish from sh**e rag's like the s*n and thick Paddy joke's from w**k comedien's, i can't even remember the last time i heard an anti Irish in my workplace it's been so many year's which is total contrast to when i first started in my job in the late 80's. But the Julie Burchill article in the gaurdian prove's it has'nt fully gone away, proberly cause there are new arrival's in brit tan that they have taken a dislike to taking their attention away from us.
As for the middle class jewish ex public school boy who's trying to be a gezzer and his friend from a s**te brummie suburb with his s***e brummie accent and their Ray Houghton skit, these two are just reaching for the bottom of the comedy barrell due to them being as funny as death, their send up of their own country's manager and his girlfriend a minute after the tans v France game prove's that, i don't think any tv station in europe apart from ITV would let their country's manager be shown up in that way. I only seen two of those show's and one was because that enemy of our wee c**t tree website Dermot O'Leary was on it, and fair play he did'nt stand for any bulls***e of them.
Still if anything good is to come out of this (and it take's more then some Chelsea groupie and some ex wineo from west brom to put my nose out of joint) it's that it gave army groupie and his back slapper's something to smile about over on our wee c**t tree, which is a lot more then their pub team has given them, i'm sure their laughter were'nt as loud as mine the night we gubbed them 4-0. :D, look forward to speaking to yer soon dog breath. :p
According to today's Mirror, Ray admits he was "hought of order" :rolleyes:
Was up there last week, up there again with me dad in a couple of week's time. as for sunday v Derry, come on Cavan :DQuote:
Originally Posted by davros
and yet you still chose to continue living there. :rolleyes:Quote:
Originally Posted by lopez
I lived with english guys in germany and there was plenty of slagging, so what. get over it
Relax lads,I empathise with your side more than most and I fully understand the significance of national identity when living in a foreign land.I have no problem with your arguments and why yous would be offended by Houghtons actions.All I'm saying is that whenever theres an arguement between ex-pats/2nd gen and someone living at home it usually ends up with the statement 'If you're Irish living in England I think you'd understand what we're talking about.'Point being it is continually used to undermine the opinion of people living at home when it come to such issues when there are no further points to be made.Quote:
Originally Posted by PlasticPaddy
Fantasy Football was a bit weak even in its first series (Euro 96?). Now it's embarrassing. The masked gunman stunt was particularly unacceptable.
Lopez. Nice to see you back here as choleric as ever. Er, what does what having a university degree have to do with anything? :( Maybe you knocked out another in your fortnight off?
Plastic Paddy. Less of the contrived outrage, please. If you don't like yer user name, change it to something else! (That's not to downplay the real prejudice people of your generation, and certainly those older, have faced over here).
Sylvo. There aren't many pubs in places like Ballinamallard (which is but a village), because the economics of the trade have forced many to close- just like in rural areas of the Republic and Britain. Nothing to do with local attitudes to the devil's buttermilk- locals just have to go into Enniskillen for a session.
Liam 88. I've never read any book on Irish history published post-1981 which hasn't mentioned the hunger strike then, nor any claim that the IRA (either in the 1920s or more recently) refused to negotiate. Self-evidently in the first case, because obviously the treaty that set up the Free State was negotiated. And it's pretty widely known that Adams and McGuinness have been involved in ongoing talks with the British since 1972. Maybe less widely known, but easily checkable by anyone at A-Level/ Leaving Cert. standard, is that unionist paramilitaries have murdered more people since 1994, than nationalists. Again, I've never read any book on the subject that fails to mention the UDA/ UVF etc. Maybe you or your brother could provide a source?
Davros. You've been telling me (and some of the guys on here) since the 1980s how you were 'indoctrinated' at primary school in NI in the early 70s. Yet even when pressed you fail to offer any evidence whatever. Come on, let's hear it!
I know others who went to Omagh Academy and its feeder schools; I went to a similar school myself; my primary school was used by UDA men both future and current (literally- they drilled in our PE gym!). But for all that I don't know of any 'indoctrination' of the type you claim. It's true that in unionist schools you're more likely to learn about the Duke of Wellington than Sean Lemass- wrongly, in my opinion- but that's not the same thing, is it? In any case, they're hardly going to be mentioned in P3 or P4- you shipped off to yer beloved Tanland shortly afterward, eh? :)