For the last couple of years I haven't gone anywhere but to other parts of Ireland for my summer holidays and have always managed to get a few games in that I would never have got to otherwise. Anyway the way things are going no one will be going anywhere too far away for the next few years so it won't be an issue.
Sounds like a "summer" game in Monaghan to me. ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by passerrby
I'm not sure which way they should go on this one. I think it is important that all leagues, LoI, Intermediate and Junior are run on the same season. June isn't the month for football with the clash with the major competitions. The first Irish team in action in Europe is likely to be the beginning of July. If they were going back to Winter football, they might want to start mid-July with a round or two of the Setanta Cup already being played.
The one issue that doesn't seem to be coming up is the potential for more meaningless games. While the number of clubs in the hunt for Europe won't change the proportion will, as too will those looking to avoid relegation. This leads to more clubs in the middle which down the back-end of the season could lead to an attendance drop-off. One way to combat this is through the Setanta Cup, by allocating places down to a certain point in the table, essentially giving clubs in 8th to 12th (possibly 7th to 13th) something to care about for the last month or two of the season.
everytime we play ye in gortakeegan it must feel like a storm eh horseyQuote:
Originally Posted by White Horse
What a farce!
I cant believe that anyone pines for winter football and getting frozen and soaked out of it in the dark again.
Being able to go to a game in shorts and shades a nice summers evening and bring the kids is the best thing that ever happened to this league. I wouldnt bring my young kids out to stand in the cold for 90 minutes during the depth of the winters at a game.
A lazy, selfish, head in the sand decision if there ever was one!
The flip side is that by getting away from the state where half the clubs are looking over their shoulder at relegation, there should be more room for medium-term thinking and club and squad development, as opposed to "win at all costs".Quote:
Originally Posted by Aberdonian Stu
Not debating the actual merits here, but from a personal point of view I do prefer a balmy, dusky summer evening in the Brandywell rather than the freeze-fests I was accustomed to for years.
I'm not sure either actually make a difference to attendance though - in winter, people will say they don't want to go in the rain. But in summer, they'll say it's a waste of a pleasant evening to spend it down the Brandy. There's always an excuse. Regardless of when we play football, clubs have to make it attractive and meaningful to people. It'll take more than a summer's evening/better football to make that happen.
For the record, prefer the idea of a 16 team league as well. More travelling for fans, less repetition of games, hopefully a more open, competitive league with lots of fresh blood to invigorate the Premier (not to mention a better structured lower division). Again though, it isn't a magic bullet. I hope clubs realise more is required than drawing up a new calender and pulling numbers out of hat.
Quinn's report echoes what I heard.
Some of the reasons for winter football were hilarious.
Grand, sure just disenfranchise the supporters who bother themselves going to games, again. Well done clubs.
IMO
Pros
- More floodlight football, better atmosphere
- 2 games a season delivers less predictable games between teams
- season in sync with all levels of football in the country, better FAI Cup for Inter/Junior teams
- likely return of bigger clubs like Shels, Waterford, Cork, Limerick to the top flight
- no clashing with World Cups/Euros and summer holiday seasons
Cons
- Excellerated decline from the already declining standards this season with the addition of 6 poor FD teams, crap pitches and crap weather conditions
- Loss of mid-season advantage for European competitions will affect European performances
- 50% less big away attendances from the likes of Bohs, Rovers etc.
- Increased isolation for already struggling First Division clubs
- a silly filler season for H1 2012
- 6 less league fixtures, 3 less home equates to a 17% decrease in matchday income over season for clubs
- the failure of the 16 team Irish League premier division
This proposal is the implementation of 2 nuclear options, Winter football and the 16 team league. I think implementing one of these proposals is risky enough for the league but implementing both is borderline suicidal, the cons weigh far too much than the pros.
I agree.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jicked
Any chance of a bit more on that Kev?Quote:
Originally Posted by MariborKev
i'd just like to point out that we have lost to latvians during the summer seasons
Like someone has said, it can be a good thing as well for clubs to get into a position where they are not looking over their shoulders. It offers a chance/platform for stability before they can plan and look how they move forward. Any club in that position who wouldn't move forward would be likely to fall backwards and then face relegation.Quote:
Originally Posted by Aberdonian Stu
A 4 team play-off could be introduced as well for the final Europa League spot. With Cup winners likely to be among leading clubs, this would mean finishing in the top 7 being something to aim for and something within reach of about 8 or 9 clubs up until the end of the season.
Personally I would hate to see this happen. It defeats the purpose of having a league.Quote:
Originally Posted by legendz
Clubs vote for return to winter season coming off the back of the coldest winter in living memory where the entire month of January would have been a write off if we had been playing a winter season this year. You couldn't make it up.
With Setanta Cup qualification down to 6th, 2 teams relegated and 2 more in a play-off would leave few enough teams with nothing to play for near the end.
The league will still have a league champion who will go on to the Champions League. As long as the champion gets the reward, I think there is a place for a Europa League play-off and the two cups having a place each. It'd be more competitive as well as the only guaranteed way to Europe would be winning the league or the cups and if not, wind up being in an end of season play-off for the final Europa League place. As long as clubs know the rules beforehand it's fair and a good test for sides involved.Quote:
Originally Posted by osarusan
It's like Division One this year, the champion gets the title and promotion, the 2nd and 3rd placed sides are involved in the play-offs. Everyone know the rules beforehand and it is fair.
Prefer the Summer myself. The weather is a big reason. While i love watching games under lights i much prefer when the chances are a little better of it not to be ****ing rain. Helps the pitches too. Also in the summer there is less clashes with other sports. GAA would be the only major regular one and at that the championship is broken up a bit over the summer. In the Winter there would be The English Premier League, Champions League (to a lesser extent as its mid-week football), Heineken Cup, Six Nations, Magners League and AIL.
Really like the idea of a bigger premier though. Games would be a bigger draw if you where to only play certain teams at home once a season and have to travel to certain away games once a season. Would seem like a bigger away day playing the likes of Shamrock Rovers away once. Would be great to have a nice spread across the country too.
What I meant was they'll be a serious loss in quality, not that there is much to begin with. Imagine Derry playing Tralee Dynamos or something? Hypothetically speaking of course.Quote:
Originally Posted by Dodge
We're not talking about 3/4 years ago. We're talking about now. Its a loss of 6 games.
New clubs have to come from somewhere. At most 4 clubs could be invited to Division One but they could invite only 2 bringing the number to 8 and a 28 game season.Quote:
Originally Posted by L.T.F.C.
The advantage of any alignment of the LoI and Intermediate/Junior league seasons is that they could work towards building some sort of pyramid structure, starting between the district and Intermediate leagues first before they look at a link from intermediate to the LoI somehow.
Most of the games lost would be midweek so wouldn't be that big a hit. The major issue for me with a 16-team premier division is that the extra teams won't be very good.
16 team league - I don't mind - never too keen on the 10 team set-up anyway.
But, please no not Winter football again - I don't miss the freezing cold, & I don't want to go back to all our teams being tossed out of Europe in the first preliminary rounds because they aren't match fit in July :mad:
Very harsh! Division One has been good this season and looking at the Division One table, I think Derry, Monaghan, Waterford, Shel's, Limerick and Cork would all be great additions to the current Premier Division.Quote:
Originally Posted by Schumi
Examples of leagues already run on a 16 club basis:
http://www.soccerbot.com/greece/tables/greece2011.htm
http://www.soccerbot.com/portugal/tables/port2011.htm
http://www.soccerbot.com/serbia/tables/serbia2011.htm
As previously posted, has summer football been the sole reason for good results in Europe? Perhaps it was full-time football. This year, our performances were down in Europe. Northern Irish clubs did ok in Europe this year. Linfield drew 0-0 with Rosenborg in Windsor Park, and Portadown and Cliftonville did decent. These are largely part-time players, and were out of season at the time.
Dont see the point of going back to winter football. The winters have been getting worse over the last couple of years and I can just see it leading to a lot of matches being postponed.
The league is a mess alright but thats not down to what time of year matches are being played.
A joke that decision was made without any consultation with us, the leagues customers.
This decision seems to be based on superstition and nostalgia rather than reality.
Mario
With a 30 game season they can fit in a winter break there somewhere, especially around the beginning of January. In terms of the league improving, a return to winter football is not something I think is needed but if the majority want it, especially they clubs, they should do it.
Had to check the date there.Was thinking it was April 1st for a second!
Return to winter football....................are they mad?
Straw poll, have your say by clicking like to one of these pages on facebook, everyone feel free to spread the word on facebook for whichever option you favour
Stick With summer Football : http://www.facebook.com/pages/The-Ai...11974025532885
Go back to winter Football : http://www.facebook.com/pages/The-Ai...12178285511808
personally speaking from experience I much prefer winter football .Theres something romantic about watching a game in the fog,ice ,snow. theres a better vocal atmosphere at them too! I really miss the old xmas loi matches they were always the best craic!!
Exactly, jesus imagine Bray on a winters night, or a January gale force wind up through the middle of Shams pitch................urgh feel cold just thinking about itQuote:
Originally Posted by CuanaD
And our Euro results would be affected. We have jumped something like 10 places in the co efficients table since summer soccer - or am I wrong?
Winter football (;)
http://cache.virtualtourist.com/4676...el-Ireland.jpg
report got it all wrong and was the cause of a lot of the league going backways. They didnt consult anyone outside Dublin id say. All them home games in Ollie Byrnes (god rest him) dublin and 1 or 2 culchie clubs league to save the travelling and more derbies and bigger gates for dub clubs only. It had to fail. Id much prefer a 16 team premier and give different regions a chance every ten years or so to put a league championship team together. aka limerick and waterford in the seventies, derry in the nineties, Galway in the mid eighties and of course Cork.
Stuck down in the 1st destroys any hope of the provincial clubs getting a fair crack of the whip. The league in the summer is hard to organise with fixtures a disaster because of world cups, euro cups etc. Games shoud be every second friday night and this is important in a recession as we need to get the punters in early at the weekend as they havent a red cent come monday or tuesday evenings
I personaly have enjoyed the switch to summer season, but the simple fact remains, I think Dodge mentioned it, too many people have too many other things on during the summer. Ireland is a very active place during the summer, there are festivals on every weekend, family/work/neighbours bbq`s/summer holidays, you name it. Attendances are down there is no doubt about that, with particular declines in our case for June, July & August. This summer our first euro home game in 19 years was almost dwarfed by the frenzy around the county with Louth making the Leinster Final. We couldnt even sell it out, close, but not quite the 3,000 we hoped for.
I have a season ticket and thought I only missed the odd few games, almost every game I go to, I find I`m searching for the right match token to pass over to get in. Loads of friends and family say the same thing.
I think the 16 team PD is the way forward, home and away twice, make it simple and also challenging, no more cosy games around Dublin, instead a proper away game v Limerick, Finn Harps & Cobh perhaps.
A solution if they were to change to Winter could be to have next season from mid Feb 2011 to end July 2011, then start the winter season from mid Sept 2011 to mid May 2012.
I`m not saying we should defintely change, but we should look at all the options, maybe a 16 team PD during the summer could be one ?
It seems to be the decision was made on euros and cents rather than internet postsQuote:
Originally Posted by Mario
There hasnt been any consultation done with fans on this.Quote:
Originally Posted by Dodge
What other industry would make a big strategic decision without doing some market research first?
The reaction here seems to suggests more fans than not dont want to go back to winter football. Will be interesting to see the poll findings.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mario
From what I've read on this on various forums today it seems the huge majority of fans favour a return to winter football. Seems to be just Shamrock Rovers fans against it mostly
I'm all for the return to Winter football.
Having 30 league games versus 33 is not really that much of a concern to me.
16 team prem is fantastic, but, if we're not in it it'll be crap and should have been made an 18 team league. This crack of playing each other 3 or 4 times minimum per season is just terrible.
Summer football = Good
Winter football = very good
7 months of no football? At present that's bloody fantastic. We can do our annual, "this season we are going to be class" talking for a full 7 months without being found out.
I'm against it. Have you ever seen our stadium?!!Quote:
Originally Posted by Hibs4Ever
You are right to mention the Genesis report. Some points it made were worth exploring, others weren't. Summer football was already in place before the report was published.Quote:
Originally Posted by geezer
The Genesis Report preferred option had the following features:
• A single National League of 10 teams
• Two Regional leagues below the National League with 10 teams in each
Regional League
• There would be promotion and relegation between the top league and the
Regional leagues via an end-of-season play-off system
• Both the National and Regional leagues would be played in the Summer
• There would be a promotion and relegation mechanism between the
Regional leagues and the Amateur leagues
• Minimum criteria would be set for participation in the National League
• The National League will be made up of full-time and part-time professional
clubs
• The Regional leagues will be made up of part-time professionals, amateur
and representative sides
• All amateur/schoolboy leagues and clubs will be associated with/attached
to a National or Regional league club/team.
• Dual registration of players will facilitate the success of U21, U18 and
amateur and representative sides.
For more on that Genesis report:
http://foot.ie/inc/pdf/genesis.pdf
For the FAI's LoI Implementation Committee's Proposals on the strategic direction of the National League 2007 - 2012:
http://www.irishtimes.com/sports/soc...-proposals.pdf