am i the only one that thinks that galway united are the club that should not be in the league as by what everyone else is saying salthill and mervue have much better set ups?
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am i the only one that thinks that galway united are the club that should not be in the league as by what everyone else is saying salthill and mervue have much better set ups?
United got more of a crowd in their last home match than Mervue got in their last 15 combined.
These junior clubs have little or no popular support. They will be doing well to pull 150 punters between them per match.
the fact the galway utd dont own anything of their own is the problem for me and from what i'm reading also dont particularly have a youth setup? the crowds are the only ace they seem to hold?Quote:
Originally Posted by Patrick Dunne
United are not alone in not owning their own ground - Shamrock Rovers, Cork City Limerick, Derry City, Sporting Fingal, to name just 5, are in the same boat. The grounds of Mervue and Devon are not up to LOI standard. You got a problem with all them as well?
Crowds are the kernel of the issue. A LOI club with no popular support is doomed in the long-term.
See Kildare County, Kilkenny City, St Francis, Dublin City, etc.
United have a U20 team, it has been poor this season but has previously been reasonable enough. We had a proper underage system in the past, but it was abandoned after pressure from other local clubs.
Edit : Neither Salthill or Mervue have any seats, or any cover, at the grounds. Anyone can walk up and watch a match at Mervue, there is no boundary wall around the pitch.
I'm not having a go at these clubs, just presenting the reality of the situation.
The reason United dont own anything is that they hve been players for over 30 years and without the input of many good men from GUFC Terryland would still be a kip. Galway United draws support from both Galway city and County while Mervue and salthill hardly draw support from their own areas OR CLUB FOR THAT MATTER.
What is on the cards in Galway is lunacy and both salthill & mervue could put ego before common sense and destroy the fantastic under age and junior set up they both have.There is only just over 70,000 people living in galway city and to have 3 loi teams is pure folly:mad:
i'm not picking a fight or suggesting i have a problem with any club i was just making an observation. if galway united didnt exist chances are one of the other two clubs would do as well if not better than united has done, but thats just one mans opinion
If United ceased to exist, one of the two other clubs might pick up 20-30 United supporters. As gufct says, no-one from outside these areas (or for that matter in these areas) will support them.
This has been proven in the 2009 season.
proven how? it cant be proved unless galway united didnt exist (which for the record i would not like to see happen)Quote:
Originally Posted by Patrick Dunne
Mervue have had games this season when under 40 people paid in hardly enough to pay the refs what more proof do you want. Galway United is associated with Galway City & County while Mervue and salthill are 2 areas of the city.
i tatally understand what your saying but i think there is obviously scope for groth in their attendances and as i said if gufc were not there they would stand a much greater chance of success they have the propper infrastructures and in time will have better stadia facilities which they will own and have the youth set up to produce a steady stream of players?Quote:
Originally Posted by gufct
Do Meruve pay players?
A similar argument could be made for, lets say Mayfield United, Cherry Orchard, or any other team.Quote:
Originally Posted by Acornvilla
If Longford Town ceased to exist, Ballymahon could in time build a stadium and become the leading club in Longford.
There should be a team from Ballymahon in the First Division, and one from Granard as well. Three teams in Longford.
Apparently not. Like Wexford, its a deep love of club.Quote:
Originally Posted by 1882
And rightly so, Unless a club can get a average crowd of above 500 they prob don't have the finance to pay more than ground rent/maintenance, Ref fee's and travel expenses.Quote:
Originally Posted by Patrick Dunne
although Wexford seem to get good crowds, they could give something to the first team as they prob miss work sometimes due to games
GUFCT - you quote as rationale - lack of support from "fans" as reason why Mervue or Salthill should stay away from the LOI. Surely the lunacy that needs to be examined is how the "leading light" that is Galway United, could end up so heavily in debt? Galway Utd have no assets, no training facilities, no under age structure, and have struggled all season to pay their bills and ended up in an ugly "scandal" around how they paid their '08 tax bill.
Surely the lunacy of the LOI has been the amounts of money paid to players - at the exclusion of development (both football and facilities).
The Galway squad this season includes 6 players who came through the ranks at Salthill - Faherty, Russell, Cooke, McBrien and Hanley. Molloy and Conneely are products of Mervue's underage structure. That's the majority of the home grown talent in Fosters squad.
The decision of either of the two clubs under scrutiny to either stay in (in Mervues case) or enter (in Salthills case) must be about providing an outlet for the undoubted stream of talent both clubs are producing.
Having watched Galway Utd stumble from crisis to crisis, maybe they think they can make a better fist of it themselves?
I thought you pulled your under-20 team out of the league?Quote:
Originally Posted by Patrick Dunne
Pulling out is one thing, but they were kicked out. Plus I think their 'A' side finished bottom of the section, winning only one game - that was when they took a near full strength side to a game in Tullamore. Galway seemed to have focused on just their first team last year, with little or no interest taken in their other sides.Quote:
Originally Posted by Schumi
thats pretty muh the point i was making good manQuote:
Originally Posted by number16
A lot of nonsense been spouted about without any back up.
fact is Mervue or salthill will never do as well as GUFC as long as they play under names of housing estates. I live in mervue and i wouldn't walk across the road to watch them. I would say up to 98% of gufc supporters are from outside these 2 estates and if gufc ever went under, none of them would ever support LOI football again unless the name of "galway" was used.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Patrick Dunne
I'm glad to see someone else has the good sense to see the importance of attracting spectators. I stand steadfastly over my comments regarding Monaghan United and the other clubs previously listed.
How can sponsors and publicity be attracted to a league if teams are getting a home support of no more than 50 spectators and little in the way of evidence to suggest genuine strides are being made towards improving the situation?
If nothing else this season has proved that there is only room for 1 club in Galway. Mervues crowds have been worse than even anyone could have ever predicted. I come from that area so while supportive of their efforts and whilst i acknowledge their contribution to football it has now been proven without doubt that their is no appetite from supporters for their participation in the league of ireland. Now before utd fans get on the high moral ground its also worth noticing that utds policy of the last 5 years of a "player centred club" has to be changed and this season has also proved without supporters, clubs are nothing. Supporters have to be number 1 when it comes to clubs strategy, policies etc. Players no 2 in my opinion
Quote:
Originally Posted by number16
Not surprising when it's someone from Salthill Devon(a quick look through his posts showed this)Quote:
Originally Posted by Terry
It's funny how someone from Devon can claim about producing players(not that Mervue are any better, i suppose Seamus Connelly was born and raised in the fields of Mervue :rolleyes:) when the lads are either poached from other clubs or travel in to play with the big guns(normally after a few years with their local clubs) :rolleyes:, which when they go to Galway United is the same way they ended up at Devon.
Devon and Mervue can claim set ups over GUFC all the want, fact is they will never break a few 100 at a game being clubs that aren't representative of the city and county,and will never draw sufficient support whether GUFC ever fold or not.
Stick to producing players for the big club in the county, it's easier for all parties because LOI football won't get ye anywhere
Could you provide evidence to back this up?Quote:
Originally Posted by Big Chief
For my evidence I will rely on the observations conducted by the two things either side of my nose! As stated previously in this thread I was in attendance at the game in question and indeed I have attended previously at Kingspan Century Park in Monaghan for the purposes of following Finn Harps and never observed a substantial home support.Quote:
Originally Posted by osarusan
None of the clubs I have referred to in my earlier posts on this topic are well supported nor indeed do they appear to be making any progress in terms of swelling their miniscule fan bases and it is for this reason they should be removed.
Much and all as many League of Ireland clubs like to bury their heads in the sand and ignore financial reality, it does not make sense to have as many senior clubs in the League as is currently the case and the public have shown they have no appetite for more clubs being introduced.
I have every sympathy for Galway United being forced to deal with this outbreak of senior clubs within their catchment area. Does anyone genuinely believe that Mervue, Salthill Devon or any of the clubs I have listed above will be playing to crowds of several thousand in 10 or 20 years? That should be the aim for all clubs as the only way the League can improve is through increased attendances and the knock on benefits that flow from that in terms of sponsorship and merchandising revenue.
Finally, at the risk of being accused of personalising this matter, I do note that you are a Limerick fan and I must say I was disappointed by the size of the crowd at Jackman Park during my recent visit. For a club who have an entire city to draw support from it was clear to me that a lot more effort needs to be put in to promote the club and draw more fans to matches. Limerick FC, like all clubs, need to get off their backsides and do so much more to get fans through the turnstiles!
And Harps get massive crowds and are financially sound are they, I recall a few seasons ago ye having to put the entire squad for sale. You may add yourselves to that list. Sure you know what lets just scrap the first division let Shels take Derrys place and be done with it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Big Chief
And just for the record Fingal get a larger crowd than Harps do too
[
Finally, at the risk of being accused of personalising this matter, I do note that you are a Limerick fan and I must say I was disappointed by the size of the crowd at Jackman Park during my recent visit. For a club who have an entire city to draw support from it was clear to me that a lot more effort needs to be put in to promote the club and draw more fans to matches. Limerick FC, like all clubs, need to get off their backsides and do so much more to get fans through the turnstiles![/QUOTE]
Considering it was a nothing last game of the season for us, i think your being somewhat harsh.Our city supports 2 codes of GAA plus its the home of Munster rugby and dozens of top quality junior clubs,which impacts heavily on our attendances.
Dont think the northwest has much attractions or should that be distractions!:D
[QUOTE=Big Chief;1272040]For my evidence I will rely on the observations conducted by the two things either side of my nose! As stated previously in this thread I was in attendance at the game in question and indeed I have attended previously at Kingspan Century Park in Monaghan for the purposes of following Finn Harps and never observed a substantial home support.
was in ballybofey for our second win of the season v harps and did not see any big support base. so it looks like we are both the same the only difference seems to be we are a well run club
I don't dispute for one second that there are alternatives available to spectators in the Limerick area (as there are in all areas... even the North West) but I still refuse to believe that a couple of hundred is a satisfactory crowd from a city of its size. Limerick FC must do more to promote the club within the community. Indeed when I told some of the employees in the hotel where I stayed that I was going to Jackman Park (which was less than 10 minutes walk away) they confessed they had not even heard of it. I would be very disappointed if people in the North West hadn't at least heard of Finn Harps however I believe they too must do much more to increase attendances.Quote:
Originally Posted by LK37oldskool
Harps are not financially sound, however, given that I have not got control of the funds at the club I can't do much about that. Indeed I recall speaking to at least two directors last year, while they were in the Premier Division spending ridiculous sums of money, and pointing out that, rather than trying to compete with the likes of Cork City and Bohemians, they would be much better off keeping spending to a sensible level and waiting for the other clubs to implode as is duly happening.Quote:
Originally Posted by christo
I accept that Harps' crowds in the last few years, with the exception of the last 5 or 6 homes games en route to promotion and the first few home game in the Premier Division, have been very poor. Nevertheless history will bear witness to the fact that Harps have the potential to attract good crowds on a regular basis when they are doing well. I fear the same could not be said of a number of other clubs, including Sporting Fingal.
That being said, if we are having this discussion again in 10 years time and Harps are playing to paltry crowds then I would reluctantly agree that they should die by the sword I am now weilding.
To deal with your final point regarding the First Division, if my argument is progressed to its logical conclusion then I would have to agree that the First Division should be abolished and some, although not all of the teams currently participating in it, returned to junior football.
[QUOTE=passerrby;1272156]Without reiterating the comments in my previous post, I accept Finn Harps crowds have been terrible this year, but it is noteworthy that they are coming off the back of several years of disappointment. Monaghan on the other hand were coming off the back of one of their better seasons and their crowds still remained considerably smaller than those of Harps. I do however concede that Harps should be doing much more to increase attendances and improve their financial position. In time I believe they will be successful. Sadly I do not see the same potential in Monaghan United.Quote:
Originally Posted by Big Chief
In your original post, you said that in your view, teams like Monaghan and Fingal (among others) brought nothing to the league. What is it exactly that you want teams to bring to the league?Quote:
Originally Posted by Big Chief
Limerick, and to a lesser extent in my opinion, Harps, are potentially bigger clubs than Monaghan, but surely our finishing below them is cause for you to look inward at your club, rather than at a club that managed to be more successful than yours. It seems to me that all Harps and Limerick bring to the league that Monaghan don't is a potential for success, a potential that our clubs, to varying degrees, have been unable to exploit in any meaningful or consistent way.
If Monaghan were to leave the league, I'd rather it be because a club of their limited resources was simply unable to compete with clubs who were exploiting their potential to such an extent that Monaghan were relegated. No other reason.
Ah yes, the old foot.ie "You can talk, what about your club?" post.Quote:
Originally Posted by christo
Well done. Really adds to the debate.
Considering it was a nothing last game of the season for us, i think your being somewhat harsh.Our city supports 2 codes of GAA plus its the home of Munster rugby and dozens of top quality junior clubs,which impacts heavily on our attendances.
Dont think the northwest has much attractions or should that be distractions
your quite right we dont have many other sports but thats hardly the point . we (srfc) have a much better supported club than you while you have at least 8 times the pop. harps are a well supported club (still hate them ) with loyal fans and his point is they have potential (fans) fingal have none and will never have any .
As far as I'm concerned Salthill and Mervue have as much right to be in the LOI family as Galway Utd. They have earned the right to do so, with decent results and clubs that are ran well. So whats the problem?:confused:
Football isnt all about money - re all seater stadia and full time set ups.
Also delighted UCD made a quick return to the top - a club that is very well run and always entertain on the field.
This is just one part of a completely arseways theory that stood out for me.Quote:
Originally Posted by Big Chief
Since when is swelling the fan base a reason to be in a league? They're there to compete at the highest level that they can, simple as that.
Some clubs need a lot of fans to break even. Monaghan do not. Nor do UCD. Nor, at the moment at least, do Fingal.
They are all where they are this season purely on merit, on achievements on the field. And they all finished ahead of Harps by the way, and almost all ahead of us for that matter.
You seem to be suggesting that getting shot of these teams would in some way be good for the league, but how do you figure that? How would losing Monaghan boost attendances at Finn Park or the RSC? Do explain that one, please!
This adds to the debate what??Quote:
Originally Posted by dong
In fairness he was saying that Fingal brought nothing to the league except they are more financially sound, get bigger crowds and finish higher up the table so saying that Fingal should be kicked and not harps is a poor point.
Honestly I think the first division should be scrapped and the run a proper regionalised A league without the B-teams from the bigger clubs, it would cut out travel costs, there would be increased local club rivalry, and with less distance to travel 20/30 more away fans might make it to the matches rather than the paultry amount that can make cross country games on a friday evening
According to the attendances thread Monaghan have improved their fan base by 5 fans this yearQuote:
Originally Posted by Big Chief
http://foot.ie/forums/showpost.php?p...postcount=1873
your quite right we dont have many other sports but thats hardly the point . we (srfc) have a much better supported club than you while you have at least 8 times the pop. harps are a well supported club (still hate them ) with loyal fans and his point is they have potential (fans) fingal have none and will never have any .[/QUOTE]
Limerick FC biggest problem is a poor recent history in how the club was run.Apart from our hardcore ,every week supporter the attitude to the club in this town stinks.We are unable at present to get back the casual punter just to take a look at what we have to offer - especially as our successful rugby neighbour looms over us.
the club are taking great strides to amend this and i believe next season there will be an upsurge in support but it takes time.We have a community officer who does trojan work and for the first time in many years the club behind the scenes looks stable and progressive(last season we had no manager and very few players signed a week before season kick off -no pre season work done at all). While in general your point of "we should be a bigger club" is correct its a muted call without known all the facts.
Jaysis, such a load of huff and puff over what?
At least it sounds like Galway can have a real derby, and none of this Connaught derby Gaa ****e.